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Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#51176: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:38:35 PM

Starship, if you think I'm talking about police state tactics to enforce healthy eating, then I can't stop you, but you are wrong. I support Bloomberg's legislation on the principle of trying to prevent consumption of unhealthy foods, but I feel that its implementation is terribly lacking.

You can agree with the principle without agreeing on the methods. I've already stated what measures I think would work best at dealing with obesity and related problems; I don't feel like repeating them in detail here. What I want is food manufacturers mandated to package healthy portion sizes with limits on sugar, fat, and salt. I want health education for the public. I want funding for minimum living standards so that people can afford to eat good food. I want the temptation of oversized, underpriced junk food taken off of store shelves.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#51177: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:40:11 PM

Why can't you just take out the restrictions on serving sizes and salt and sugar limits so we can go ahead and form our own health coalition?? smile

It was an honor
RadicalTaoist scratching at .8, just hopin' from the #GUniverse Since: Jan, 2001
scratching at .8, just hopin'
#51178: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:44:01 PM

Dudes, don't destroy what you can exploit. Institute a universal healthcare system, then calculate the cost of unhealthy shit and tax it accordingly. There's MONEY to be made, c'mon!

Share it so that people can get into this conversation, 'cause we're not the only ones who think like this.
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#51179: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:45:14 PM

Shut up, you Canuck. [lol]

It was an honor
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#51180: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:45:18 PM

It's sort of like other attempts to upset a long-standing status quo — you have to swing pretty far in the other direction to make the point. Just educating people, just giving them more money — those things won't solve the problem by themselves. You have to address the availability of healthy food.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
theweirdKiddokun What a Wonderful World! from Last Place in the Race Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
What a Wonderful World!
#51181: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:47:23 PM

I don't think that people get what Bloomberg's law does. The law ban the the selling of certain sizes at carts or stands plus etc. Not the complete ban of such product. The only difference is now I have to the grocery or corner store to get a bigger size. The sizes ban from carts and etc. are anything bigger than 16 oz. Starship, he is only make it easier to make the healthier choice.

The Reaper Games starts anew.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#51182: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:48:55 PM

Don't we have a specific topic for Bloomberg's law?

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#51183: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:51:38 PM

Thank you for going in-depth Kiddokun. But understand, it's not that I don't see what he's attempting.

My big objections are two-fold. First, there are many other methods who could've chosen that wouldn't piss all over civil liberties and would have higher, more lasting impact. Second, as the dialogue with Fighteer shows, if we allow this, then the government can easily cook up all sorts of reasons to butt into the lives of its citizens.

[up] Yes, this is a smidge off topic.

edited 14th Mar '13 1:51:57 PM by TheStarshipMaxima

It was an honor
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#51184: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:51:50 PM

@Silas: Yes

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
DevilTakeMe Coin Operator from Wild Wasteland Since: Jan, 2010
Coin Operator
#51185: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:52:00 PM

There's a thread for what Bloomberg's law actually does. The availability of healthy foods and a promotion of a healthier lifestyle and all that.

I think we're better off talking there about what the law does, and stick with the legal and political aspects here. Such as whether it's alright for another state to prevent such a law by being prohibited by state law (as opposed to a city law).

Edit: Ninja'd again.

edited 14th Mar '13 1:52:46 PM by DevilTakeMe

Glove and Boots is good for Blog!
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#51186: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:53:21 PM

Such as whether it's alright for another state to prevent such a law by being prohibited by state law (as opposed to a city law).

That definitely sounds off-topic for the other thread.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
theweirdKiddokun What a Wonderful World! from Last Place in the Race Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
What a Wonderful World!
#51187: Mar 14th 2013 at 1:59:19 PM

@Starship

That is fair, but I don't like people call the mayor of my city a dictator for putting in a law that causes little to no harm to anyone.

The Reaper Games starts anew.
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#51188: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:02:58 PM

I'm as much a New Yorker as you are, and when a rich politician oversteps their bounds, ignoring their fellow makers and the very people who elected them, all in the name of some personal crusade of dubious benefit, we call it out. He's not exempt.

It was an honor
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#51189: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:14:02 PM

"a rich politician oversteps their bounds"

According to you. You disagree with him, I get it. But to make it seem as if he's doing something draconian and/or monstrous is to ignore those people who agree with him. Even if they don't necessarily agree with the way he's going about it.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#51190: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:22:23 PM

Come now 'Teer. Judges don't say "the Mayor's office and the Board of Health didn't follow proper channels" because it rolls off the tongue.

Bloomberg has a reputation for deeming himself above the rules, much like Giuliani before him. I've lived in the Bronx my whole life, I can tell you, NYC mayors are like that.

The fact that this one has stated openly he's out to see 'his vision' implemented in other parts of the country marks him as a serious threat.

It was an honor
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#51191: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:29:50 PM

Guys... did you miss the mass of ninja's saying how this should probably be in the other thread?

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#51192: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:30:37 PM

[up] Oh, go kick an Easter egg.

[lol][lol]

Okay, we'll move it to that thread.

It was an honor
theweirdKiddokun What a Wonderful World! from Last Place in the Race Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
What a Wonderful World!
#51193: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:36:41 PM

[up][up]Best of said that part of this topic doesn't fit the other thread.

[up][up][up]That was only because he was moving on to corner stores. Other states can't do this on a wide scale at a city level would be better. Mississippi going just a far, but in the oppisite direction.

edited 14th Mar '13 2:37:40 PM by theweirdKiddokun

The Reaper Games starts anew.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#51194: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:40:35 PM

[up]From what I got Best Of said that we should keep the "Such as whether it's alright for another state to prevent such a law by being prohibited by state law (as opposed to a city law)" bit here, which doesn't appear to be what Starship and Fighter are talking about.

[down] Sorry, I should have included the arrow from the start. I realised you were kidding about the Easter Egg bit, after I broke my toe (those things are tough).

edited 14th Mar '13 2:43:24 PM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#51195: Mar 14th 2013 at 2:41:36 PM

I was kidding about kicking the Easter egg.

It was an honor
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#51196: Mar 14th 2013 at 3:30:25 PM

[up]

You'll break the Easter Egg!

@ Fighteer:

You have to address the availability of healthy food.

Knowing you, presumably tied into that is giving people the time to prepare and educating them of the need to eat healthily, right? And if they don't you'll legislate to make sure they will right?

And how many cookery shows do you get over there? Over here, television seems to be full of them...

edited 14th Mar '13 3:30:51 PM by Greenmantle

Keep Rolling On
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#51197: Mar 14th 2013 at 3:40:38 PM

How, in this scenario in which I am a Food Nazi, would I make them do it? Throw them in jail for being fat? No, the point is to guide and persuade, not compel. Also, we're doing this in the other thread now.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
ohsointocats from The Sand Wastes Since: Oct, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#51198: Mar 14th 2013 at 3:42:39 PM

Well we had laws proposed to ban fat people from restaurants, insurance costs much more when you're fat, people want to charge fat people more for other things...

Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#51199: Mar 14th 2013 at 3:46:10 PM

...make them attend compulsory health and cooking classes, put them on compulsory fitness programs, give them the food and tell them how to prepare/cook it, just plain lecture them in a condescending tone until they do something. And if they don't?

Let them Die.

[down]

I'm thinking of it being done in the most condescending way, like some of "New" Labour was in the Blair/Brown years, by the way.

edited 14th Mar '13 3:48:00 PM by Greenmantle

Keep Rolling On
Achaemenid HGW XX/7 from Ruschestraße 103, Haus 1 Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
HGW XX/7
#51200: Mar 14th 2013 at 3:46:28 PM

[up][up]

Not to mention having to stand outside like a naughty 8 year old if you want to light up in half the world these days.

edited 14th Mar '13 3:46:53 PM by Achaemenid

Schild und Schwert der Partei

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