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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
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NEVER!
Pentagon told to start planning for fiscal cliff cuts
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Well that had absolutely nothing to do with US Politics.
edited 5th Dec '12 2:26:21 PM by DeviantBraeburn
Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016Ultra, you do realize that one of the greatest criticism against Obama is that he would usually cave in a situation like this, right? And that a lot of people, including other Dems on Congress, want Obama to stand firm on this particularly issue?
It's been said Obama no longer has anything to lose, and thus no reason to bend to Republican demands anymore. Hell, this is the sort of thing a lot of people have been waiting for him to do; stand up against them instead of compromising. And he's given out his starting point on a deal already, Boehner doesn't like it.
I really don't see how Obama is being unreasonable at this particular point in time. He's tried compromise before; it didn't work very well. Now he's forcing the Republicans to play ball instead of going home.
@Ace: The thing is, "if you really don't want to join a union, you don't have to" means that unions' efficacy becomes entirely dependent on voluntary contributions by individuals, and the union is only representative of the part of the workplace that wants to be represented. The net result is that management can reliably ignore the union. Under a union shop, the union receives dues from every worker in the workplace and has at least a mandate to represent the entire body of the workers; this means that the union has somewhat (though very limited) coercive power when agreeing to a strike action, and greater access to arbitrators when management uses its bargaining power to act against worker interests.
DEMOCRATS want him to stand firm. Not Republicans and independents.
Polls? What polls? What people?
I don't know if you've noticed, guys, but most people aren't paying attention to politics now that the election's over. And if the economy tanks, they will not respond by saying "well, I suppose it's actually indirectly the fault of the Republicans."
Plus, do you not remember how bad the Financial Crisis was? It was a disaster. You really want to do it again, just to score political points? Don't be partisan, guys. Because you know what? There are conservatives out there saying the exact same thing. The Democrats and the Republicans are completely capable of breaking out economy together.
Except for 4/1/2011. That day lingers in my memory like...metaphor here...I should go.There
are
a lot
of articles
that talk about how
most would blame the GOP
if we go over the cliff.
Ultra, independents kind of want Obama to stand firm too. And the Republicans, if they don't play ball right now, will have less to leverage if they wait until after. They need to be broken of the idea that they can keep taxes from rising if they're going to work with Democrats at all.
Also, telling us to not be partisan is basically telling us to not have an opinion. And yes, we remember how bad it was. We were there.
@Maxima: I think people were angrier that he lied about it, but I was a little kid then was not really aware of what was going on. The lying is what nearly got him impeached, really.
To me, I thought that signaled the beginning of the end for the Republicans. The country saw them cooking up a shitstorm because of adultery, but apparently the irony of a bunch of Republicans denouncing someone for cheating was lost on them.
edited 5th Dec '12 2:38:15 PM by TheStarshipMaxima
It was an honor@Ultra: Yes, Democrats want him to stand firm. His party. The people who voted for him and elected him. The people he promised in his campaign that he'd start standing firm against things like this. The majority of the country. Doing what the majority of the country wants you to do is not being unreasonable.
edited 5th Dec '12 2:34:33 PM by shimaspawn
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. DickOral sex wasn't considered a sexual activity back in those days, so he wasn't lying under oath.
edited 5th Dec '12 2:36:58 PM by Serocco
In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.![]()
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This.
a lot of the country is rather sick of listening to the right wing run further and further off the deep and and lying every step of the way do their base believes them. And I can safely say, if my options were going off the fiscal cliff or accepting some halfass compromise that will damage the economy MORE than the Cliff in the longterm, and I no longer needed to care about my re-election chnces?
I'd say "dear republicans. Buy parachutes" and then floor it.
edited 5th Dec '12 2:38:29 PM by Midgetsnowman
Ultrayellow does have a point: seeing these things from an independent's point of view, so we know how to reach out to them. The plans drawn up in this thread amongst us may sound good in theory, but United States public doesn't always conform to those plans.
I think public awareness is important, though. Public needs to see that in terms of blocking solubility of the fiscal cliff issue, the party trying to be in power is the Republicans. 1) It's Congress and not president that makes laws. 2) The Republicans control the House with more partisan influence than Democrats do in Senate, who have hard time because of filibusters. 3) When a problem happens because of a lack of compromise, the side that isn't conceding is the side using veto power.

Senator Tom Coburn, Republican from Oklahoma, said "I would rather see the rates go up than do it the other way because it gives us a greater chance to reform the tax code and broaden the base in the future."
Tom Coburn said he wants to raise taxes. A rich, Deep South, Texas-accented Republican wants to raise taxes. Everyone else, like Cantor and Baehner, just want to raise revenue, which is not the same thing as raising rates.
In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.