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TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#40726: Nov 17th 2012 at 1:34:11 PM

Well, except when it comes to science, but that's mostly because everyone and their mothers will be quick to beat the figurative shit out of you if you suggest something that even looks counter-factual.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#40727: Nov 17th 2012 at 1:38:54 PM

[up] Well, yeah. I was talking about stuff that has contrasting opinions, like the healthcare debate. There are doctors and students of medicine who both support and decry the idea of universal healthcare.

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#40728: Nov 17th 2012 at 1:44:20 PM

Well, the evidence speaks for itself though; the countries that have universal healthcare have better coverage, it's cheaper per capita, and it covers anyone who pays taxes. You don't have to spend your life accumulating capital, worried that the insurance might refuse to pay the treatment for something.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#40729: Nov 17th 2012 at 1:45:51 PM

See, you think the evidence speaks for itself. There are doctors that think otherwise.

That's why we can't really have unbiased lobbyists.

edited 17th Nov '12 1:46:17 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
ohsointocats from The Sand Wastes Since: Oct, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#40730: Nov 17th 2012 at 1:52:35 PM

Isn't a lot of the issue cost of schooling?

Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#40731: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:01:07 PM

I care not about what lobbying entails so much as what it's caused.

What has it caused? The defeat of the Public Option, the pro-banker deregulation, the pro-corporate deregulation, the tax cuts for the rich, the oil drilling, the wars overseas (defense industry)...

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#40732: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:02:01 PM

The problem with lobbying is when it grants greater speech rights to those with more money.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#40733: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:06:49 PM

[up]Well said but... why did you say it three inches to the left?

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#40734: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:09:43 PM

Lobbying can also be used to encourage the Public Option, decry the bloated military budget, and so on and so forth. The problem is to create the base for that kind of lobbying. (And once we can prove Obamacare doesn't damage our access to healthcare, I think it's going to be easier to speak for the public option.)

Seriously, lobbying is a tool. Liberals and progressives need to learn how to wield it effectively in order to get things done.

DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#40735: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:09:59 PM

[up][up] Eddie's tinkering with layout stuff. tongue

edited 17th Nov '12 2:10:04 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#40736: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:22:04 PM

Anyhow, don't Charities and NGO's Lobby the Government too? Unions?

Keep Rolling On
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#40737: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:27:55 PM

I'm sure they do but they probably don't have as much money to burn on this stuff.

Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#40738: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:31:07 PM

Then again, if you want a different style of Lobbying, you need a different Political Culture.

But in the main, Lobbying is a tool, and is not in itself bad. After all, nobody can know all the effects of a piece of Legislation, especially not busy Staff members or Ministers. That's what Consultation is for.

Keep Rolling On
Joesolo Indiana Solo Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Indiana Solo
#40739: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:35:13 PM

I'd think not allowing companies themselves to have lobbyists would be a good first step.

I'm baaaaaaack
Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#40740: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:36:11 PM

Lobbyists are the ones that write the laws that politicians vote for.

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#40741: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:36:40 PM

^^

What about Trade Bodies and Business Associations, especially regional ones?

^

What? Charity Lobbyists write laws?

edited 17th Nov '12 2:37:05 PM by Greenmantle

Keep Rolling On
Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#40742: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:44:38 PM

One example of lobbyists writing bills.

Google owns TV Tropes, right? Its CEO once verified that lobbyist are writing legislation via a video in the artcle.

edited 17th Nov '12 2:46:49 PM by Serocco

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#40743: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:45:51 PM

What? Charity Lobbyists write laws?
Yeah. :x An example more on the state level, but ALEC, a group consisting of some of the biggest companies and lobbies in the US, wrote union busting laws, looser gun control laws, anti-anti-cigarette branding laws, lower taxes, anti-lawsuit bills, pro-private education bills, pro-deregulation bills. pro-voter suppression laws. Etc etc etc.

One of the more nastier examples, but lobbyists do write laws in the US.

Joesolo Indiana Solo Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Indiana Solo
#40744: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:47:21 PM

[up][up] Google does NOT own Tv tropes. I think we use their ad servers and the site search uses google.

I'm baaaaaaack
Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#40745: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:47:42 PM

ALEC also wrote the Stand Your Ground bill, which Jeb Bush signed into law as Governor of Florida.

As far as what Stand Your Ground entails, empirical studies found that coincide with a jump in justifiable homicides.

edited 17th Nov '12 2:50:38 PM by Serocco

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#40746: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:48:45 PM

[up][up]

Google secretly owns the Internet. wild mass guess

edited 17th Nov '12 2:49:04 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#40747: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:51:02 PM

Christie says Romney still 'upset' after loss

[up][up]

You mean more people are going to kill in self-defense with they have the legal ability to do so?

SHOCKER! surprised

edited 17th Nov '12 2:53:47 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Joesolo Indiana Solo Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Indiana Solo
#40748: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:51:20 PM

[up][up] Then how is Bing still around?

[up] You know his campaign was so sure of victory they actually bought a fireworks display?

edited 17th Nov '12 2:53:29 PM by Joesolo

I'm baaaaaaack
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#40749: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:53:20 PM

Joesolo: Rule 1. Always hide the fact that you possess a monopoly.

Deviant: Really? At this point it's his own damn fault. He should have stopped dismissing all polls that pointed to an Obama win as biased and actually tried to see why he only had strong support among white, middle class Americans.

nightwyrm_zero Since: Apr, 2010
#40750: Nov 17th 2012 at 2:53:43 PM

[up][up]To make you think google doesn't already own the internet.

edited 17th Nov '12 2:53:54 PM by nightwyrm_zero


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