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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35651: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:32:10 AM

I find Elizabeth Warren adorable and want to give her a big hug.

That is probably demeaning.

chihuahua0 Since: Jul, 2010
#35652: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:33:22 AM

What do you guys think of this video?

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35653: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:37:27 AM

It's ideologically slanted and seems to completely ignore the fact that there are virtually no cases of in person voter fraud. I turned it off half way in.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#35654: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:38:30 AM

First up you need to prove that all those people are voting. Yeah there's a lot of people incorrectly registered but there are very few cases of voter fraud. Not nearly enough to tip any election.

Either way I don't care. I still can't get past a major GOP member from my state saying "This law will allow Governor Romney to win PA!"

The rest I'm not going to comment on but just because many Democrats, blacks, and other groups support this law does not mean it's not a bad law.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:39:21 AM by Kostya

DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#35655: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:39:29 AM

Has anyone proposed the idea of mailing Voter Ids to Voters?

That's what Germany and the Netherlands do (I think).

edited 28th Oct '12 11:39:54 AM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#35656: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:40:34 AM

[up]I think registration forms are mailed out in some states however these are sometimes prone to errors and as such are "voter fraud."

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35657: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:42:21 AM

How will you have pictures of the people you're mailing to?

The idea of Voter ID is to have the picture match the person.

DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#35658: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:42:32 AM

[up][up]

Why can't this shit ever be simple?

edited 28th Oct '12 11:42:59 AM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#35659: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:42:33 AM

And probably mailed way too late.

chihuahua0 Since: Jul, 2010
#35660: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:42:50 AM

@Tomu: Can you link me to that study? I'm yet to see it as a primary source.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#35661: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:43:29 AM

Tomu: You could send a picture and a registration form to some center that turns it into an ID and mails it back to you.

edit:@Video: One thing I thought of. They say 24 million people are improperly registered to vote. Okay, fair enough. Now how many of those people voted in the last election? You apparently know who these people are since you have accurate stats so you should have an idea of how many were actually voting last time.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:45:33 AM by Kostya

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35662: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:44:45 AM

What, you mean the one that said that there's no cases of in person voter fraud?

DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#35663: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:45:25 AM

@Tomu

The idea of Voter ID is to have the picture match the person.

Not necessarily.

Many States (including Texas and Alaska) will accept voter I Ds without photos.

This article explains it.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:46:34 AM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
#35664: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:45:38 AM

The latter half of the video did raise an important point though: It claimed that while there are virtually no cases of detected in-person fraud, there are also virtually no cases of people who would have otherwise voted being unable to do so due to ID laws, citing studies supposedly carried out in Georgia and Indiana following the implementation of ID laws in those states.

Can anyone find a link to those studies?

@Kostya: Voter rolls are fairly open information. Whether any individual voted in any particular election is much more likely to be protected for privacy reasons.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:48:25 AM by EdwardsGrizzly

<><
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#35665: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:47:22 AM

Let's really look at these situations that supposedly require ID:

  • Board a plane: Not going to be something that the working poor are going to be doing. Flying is expensive.
  • Cash a Check: I've never needed a photo ID to do this. I've never been asked to show one while doing so. So I don't know where this one comes from.
  • Enter a Federal Building: Not something most people ever have occasion to do. Most people go their whole lives without entering a federal building.

Also, keep in mind that social security cards can be used for a lot of things but do not count for purposes of voter ID laws.

[up] I can prove that the claim is B.S. Indiana alone discards a couple thousand provisional votes that don't get counted because people can't provide ID.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:48:34 AM by shimaspawn

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35666: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:47:30 AM

Grizzly: How'd they measure that?

DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#35667: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:49:29 AM

So here's my understanding.

  • There are few cases of voter fraud.

  • There are few cases of voter disfranchisement due to Voter I Ds

Is this accurate?

Regardless I still think laws regarding voting shouldn't be made this close to an election. Its bound to cause people to panic.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:51:11 AM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#35668: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:49:30 AM

[up][up][up]The only one of those three I've ever done is cash a check and I was never asked for an ID to do that. According to them I could have gotten to this point in my life without needing an ID assuming I lived in a place that had a subway system.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:51:09 AM by Kostya

shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#35669: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:51:44 AM

Indiana and Georgia discard 1,200 votes.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:51:54 AM by shimaspawn

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
#35670: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:51:45 AM

@Tomu: Supposedly, one of the studies found that only 23 people out of a sample of 36,000 reported being unable to vote due to voter ID requirements. I'm trying to find the actual studies so I can see exactly where the sample was drawn from (in particular, exactly what voter ID laws were in effect at the time) and how the questions were asked.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:52:43 AM by EdwardsGrizzly

<><
3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#35671: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:52:29 AM

Deviant, we (Germany) do not sent Voter ID to the voters. We sent a "Wahlschein" to each Voter. Its basically your "ticket" to vote (and on the back is the mail-in application for mail-in-votes). If you loose it you can probably (in theory, never lost mine so far) replace it at the town/city hall of your voting precinct (providing ID, naturally). However you can take your Wahlschein and simply vote in the city hall whenever you have time as a "mail-in-vote".

For the actual voting you need it and your "Personalausweis" (or probably Passport or Drivers license, never tried it with those, though). Which is an ID virtually everyone has in Germany. Its basically the nationwide ID Card everyone has you all wrote about a few posts back.

Its basically only a "There is a Vote for X on the Yth. Please Vote at Z in your Neighboorhood" for you and "yes, this person is a voter" for the vote office workers.

So, we HAVE Voter ID laws...but in Germany everyone has an ID for that anyway. Voter ID without a nationwide issued ID which almost everyone has sounds like a really bad idea from over here.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:53:58 AM by 3of4

"You can reply to this Message!"
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#35672: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:53:14 AM

[up][up]

I fear that this whole thing has become so politicized that it is near impossible to find a non-biased source of information regarding Voter ID laws.

edited 28th Oct '12 11:54:24 AM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35673: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:53:43 AM

So, 23 weren't able to vote, and then another 1200 were discarded.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#35674: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:55:25 AM

[up]Versus what's probably no more than one or two dozen cases of voter fraud that these laws would actually prevent.

I think it's fairly obvious which has a bigger affect on the election.

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35675: Oct 28th 2012 at 11:57:27 AM

Didn't they find, nationally, about 23 cases of voter fraud over the course of like, 8 years?


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