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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Perseus Since: Nov, 2009
#342676: Dec 9th 2020 at 3:47:08 PM

streaming services will proactively defend themselves by shutting down any stream that hints it might run afoul of the new bill.

So... any stream.

Edited by Perseus on Dec 9th 2020 at 10:47:27 PM

Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#342677: Dec 9th 2020 at 3:49:16 PM

[up][up] Well seeing as how this would literally shutdown Twitch and any other streaming site. They would be affected too.

Almost all the streaming sites operate under US copyright law because the US is the world's bullies on the internet.

Edited by Memers on Dec 9th 2020 at 3:49:53 AM

Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#342678: Dec 9th 2020 at 3:51:32 PM

Would other countries he able to retaliate in any way or could the bill be fought and stopped?

Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#342679: Dec 9th 2020 at 3:53:49 PM

Its a last minute Rider on something that absolutely needs to pass. Like this was the perfect time to introduce a crappy ass rider... No one really has time to fight it.

Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#342680: Dec 9th 2020 at 3:54:55 PM

What about removing it afterwards?

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#342681: Dec 9th 2020 at 3:56:15 PM

It's stupid as fuck that you can just quickly add something completely unrelated like this to a bill and other people can't just as quickly remove it.

Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#342682: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:00:33 PM

When would it actually go into effect anyway?

[up] It feels like he did it just for petty spitefulness.

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#342683: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:02:01 PM

So if you watch an episode on Youtube not directly from the studios, congratulations, you're a felon under this proposed bill.

No, not at all.

If you upload an episode where you don’t have copyright permission to do so you’d be a felon. You can’t not be the studio and still have copyright over something.

Like I said, what about foreign streams, though?

Same as with other laws about online activity. Again this isn’t about streamers as in Twitch, not beyond them facing the risk of criminal charges for playing copyright music.

Well seeing as how this would literally shutdown Twitch and any other streaming site.

It wouldn’t shut down Twitch, very little of what’s streamed on twitch breaches copyright law.

Would other countries he able to retaliate in any way or could the bill be fought and stopped?

Why would they care? It’s an absurd proposal but it would simply cause content creators to move out of the US if they feared criminal charges for incidental copyright violations.

Edited by Silasw on Dec 9th 2020 at 12:04:06 PM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Perseus Since: Nov, 2009
#342684: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:04:14 PM

Have you seen the DMCA shitshow that Twitch has been lately? Streamers are getting their stream recordings taken down left and right and Twitch's best advice for them is "try playing the game without audio".

This is bad.

Edited by Perseus on Dec 9th 2020 at 11:05:02 PM

Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#342685: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:04:40 PM

[up][up] Based on whats been going on on Twitch the last few weeks, with streamers having to delete their entire 10+ years of streams because of DMCA bots... and live takedowns of people streaming games. No, it has a massive impact on Twitch.

Even random Stock Sound Effects are getting DMC Aed because someone thinks they own it.

And with the way that DMCA works, the accuser has FAR more rights than the accused. And someone needs a shit ton of money to even fight anything.

Edited by Memers on Dec 9th 2020 at 4:06:22 AM

CookingCat Since: Jul, 2018
#342686: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:05:05 PM

[up]x9 More like because they are too stupid to move their sites to a different country, despite all these stupid copyright bills appearing in the US in the last decade. I doubt Dailymotion will be effected, as they are French.

Edited by CookingCat on Dec 9th 2020 at 4:05:39 AM

RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#342687: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:07:22 PM

[[quoteblock]]Even random Stock Sound Effects are getting DMCAed because someone thinks they own it.[[/quoteblock]

Specifically, companies with stock audio libraries (some of which may be copyrighted) are finding a match in their database and flagging it, even though the sound effect is so old or ubiquitous it's not under copyright.

Or the sometimes bizarre fact that white noise has been hit with copyright claims.

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#342688: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:10:03 PM

Yes, though it probably won't directly reach you - instead, streaming services will proactively defend themselves by shutting down any stream that hints it might run afoul of the new bill.

I didn't think it would directly threaten me, I'm not a content creator, but thanks for the confirmation.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#342689: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:11:42 PM

All the recent Twitch activity is because Twitch has for a long time allowed audio copyright violations (thus why entire libraries of content have been correctly flagged) and because Twitch is doing the enforcement. There’s no right to due process under Twitch the way there is under criminal law, people aren’t going to get dragged of to jail because a company made a false DMCA claim.

This is still bad, don’t get me wrong, it would create an absurd burden for law enforcement and result in a ton of spurious criminal investigations that would have a real impact on people, especially if Twitch decided to make things worse by doing something stupid like banning anyone under investigation for copyright violations.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#342690: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:12:03 PM

If something isn't done than this will be put many content creators out of the job.

[up]You think this'll end up being one of those laws that officials just stop caring about for that reason?

Edited by Kaiseror on Dec 9th 2020 at 6:13:32 AM

CookingCat Since: Jul, 2018
#342691: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:13:42 PM

A lot of people will probably move to Dailymotion too, because as I mentioned, they are based in France and thus don't fall under US jurisdiction.

Edited by CookingCat on Dec 9th 2020 at 4:13:52 AM

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#342692: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:17:04 PM

It very much could do that. Anyone who plays copyrighted music as background noise could face criminal charges, so that’s a segment of streamers gone. Plus Twitch and You Tube would likely do the same thing they’ve done with DMCA and overreact to claims of copyright violation to an even more absurd degree than they do already.

And with the way that DMCA works, the accuser has FAR more rights than the accused.

You’re confusing You Tube and Twitch’s DMCA systems with the actual DMCA law. Under the You Tube and Twitch internal systems the accuser has a ton more rights than the accused, but that’s because of the systems You Tube and Twitch have built, under the actual DMCA law claims need to be proven in court, it’s Twitch and You Tube who are carrying out punishment without evidence, not the legal system.

Edited by Silasw on Dec 9th 2020 at 12:17:33 PM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Reflextion from a post-sanity world (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#342694: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:31:46 PM

Under the new law? They’d defend themselves the same way people do when under criminal investigation for other things, but most of what gets claimed currently would never get to the point of charges being filled, because the claims are bogus.

Under the existing law, yes there’s the standard problem of imbalance of funds between parties in a civil lawsuit, but You Tube and Twitch make that worse, because you don’t even need to hire a lawyer a file a case to get You Tube or Twitch to take action, to begin an actual civil case you have to meet certain standards of evidence that Twitch and You Tube don’t request before they take action.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#342695: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:35:04 PM

The law apparently sets up a specific court in the US copywrong office in DC. They are going to have to gotta haul a streamer to DC in chains.

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#342696: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:36:03 PM

What's the chance of some streaming platforms taking their business elsewhere to avoid dealing with that nonsense?

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
Imca (Veteran)
#342697: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:36:14 PM

It wouldn’t shut down Twitch, very little of what’s streamed on twitch breaches copyright law.

This kind of wrong, Lets Plays and Game streams are.... undecided, there is arguments on both sides of the fence that they are either fair use or that they are not, and neither side wants to take it to court because then it becomes a setled matter, however if emboldened by this they MAY.

And the precedence in other countries outside of the US? Well its not fair use.

Thankfully as far as I know the US legal system only looks to itself for precedence, but its not something you want to push, especialy when one side has lots of money to grease palms, and the other doesn't.

[up] None, you cant avoid dealing with US internet policy by going elsewhere, its one of the big things I hate about the US fucking with the internet.

Edited by Imca on Dec 9th 2020 at 4:38:25 AM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#342698: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:37:06 PM

My guess is this legislation is going to struck down depending on the backlash

Edited by Ultimatum on Dec 9th 2020 at 12:38:59 PM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#342699: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:42:57 PM

This kind of wrong, Lets Plays and Game streams are.... undecided, there is arguments on both sides of the fence that they are either fair use or that they are not, and neither side wants to take it to court because then it becomes a setled matter, however if emboldened by this they MAY.

Most game streamers don’t breach copyright simply because they stream with the permission of the rights holder. An awful lot of game developers grant blanket permission to streamers because they like free advertising.

You’re right that the fair use defence has yet to be tested in court and that this could embolden someone like Nintendo to start filling police reports against anyone streaming a Mario game.

This law is very much a bad thing, people just need to keep it in perspective, it’s bad, but not arrested-for-watching-Hearthstone levels of bad.

What's the chance of some streaming platforms taking their business elsewhere to avoid dealing with that nonsense?

They’d need to have no legal presence in the US to avoid the law, even then anyone that is either a US citizen, or resident in the US, would be subject to the law.

Edited by Silasw on Dec 9th 2020 at 12:46:26 PM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
CookingCat Since: Jul, 2018
#342700: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:47:02 PM

[up] Like I asked, would Dailymotion be effected, since they are completely based in France? What about Japanese streaming sites?

Edited by CookingCat on Dec 9th 2020 at 4:47:30 AM


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