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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
I find the Holocaust to be particularly disturbing because of the industrialization angle. Another poster long ago described it as turning all of the infrastructure, industry, and innovation that defines modern civilization...and using it to commit mass murder.
Edited by M84 on Nov 23rd 2020 at 10:34:53 PM
Disgusted, but not surprisedIf you treat the Nazis as comic book villains, it's weird how a lot of it starts to make MORE sense like the fact a large part of their lunacy is because it's fairly clear they never expected to get as far as they did so they kept going after bigger prizes.
Like, Hitler's reaction to Petain being.
"Ha! I shall force you to humiliate yourself and make you give into my every demand."
"Absolutely! Let me provide you with all the resources and military aid you want! I'm eager to become part of your plans to conquer Europe!"
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.Personally, I am not sure about Trump, at its core, being a Fascist, or a Nazi.
Frankly, one vote for Trump is one vote too many. He got over 70 million of them. The "innefficiency" bit is important to xplain why the GOP collides with its Trump fanbase in that aspect: they share one goal (preservation of the status quo) but for different reasons, and through different means.
Donald Trump's core ideology was never to rework the political machine. Even during his 2016 campaign, his promise was more about going into the swamp and cleaning it: not destroying it to rebuild it, clean and pure - washed away of the imperfections of race or communist ideology.
He definitely takes advantage of social dogwhistles (class, race, gender) every like. 2 to 3 sentences, but more than deliberate political strategy - hear me out, this is because he is aberrantly idiotic and he cannot fathom a world where Mexicans aren't cutting lawns, blacks aren't gun-toting thugs, and asians aren't flu-spitting corrupt red scare governments. Racism, sexism, and jingoism aren't so much deliberately malicious as they are heuristically malicious: it is way easier for you to just assume ill of everyone different from you than to challenge that.
Trump cannot spare that many neurons, and both he and his followers are happy to just handwave those "issues" with some "realism". Unlike Fascism, the purge of others is not so much deliberate, as it is incidental to the deliberate efforts of the past that still remain.
Trump didn't invent the concept of the U.S as a global superpower, and he certainly didn't actually care to force his ideas as even he was cognizant enough that he was too ridiculously idiotic to achieve it. He is also not anti-conservatism, he is very, very, very conservative.
To be honest, Trump just strikes me as an opportunistic rat of the same brood as the rest of the GOP. Sole difference is, he says the quiet part out loud.
The issue with Trump's followers is that they are not Republicans, they are not GOP members who benefit from the top 1% keeping all the profits. There is a reason why they allied to the Trump promises of wealth and equity for all. There is a reason why Florida, despite voting Republican most of the time, voted for 15$ minimum salary.
Trump followers are not conservatives. They are not Republicans. They are closer to a Death Cult. They do not owe explanations for Trump, they do not need real reasons. They will whiplash on Tucker and the conservatives faster than you can , they only owe him worship. And the reason why they do this is because the worldview that has been spoonfed to them since birth is changing.
The internet judging people for being racist making them lose their job, increasing prices, climate change, news tickets flashing death and destruction every day, "dangerous rioters", the possibility of suffering consequences as a wealthy well off man just for saying an completely innocent word. The world is changing and it's bringing down privileges they used to enjoy in Hindenburg fashion.
It's depressing for them and for anyone. I don't say this for you to sympathize with them. Fuck them. I am saying this for you to understand why they would so willingly throw their support to doomed-from-the-start Gravy Seals revolutions, keep to Facebook to doompost at each other, and in the worst cases...end up sucumbing to the Lone Wolf activities before going out not so much in a blaze of glory, but more like a sad, sad little reddit post.
TL;DR: Trump isn't a nazi. He is just a regular conservative too dumb to not say the quiet part out loud, and his followers are a Death Cult wrapped around him because doing so sates their emotional need for a savior from all the changes the modern world is bringing.
Edited by Aszur on Nov 23rd 2020 at 9:23:28 AM
It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
That explains why Trump and what little loyal cronies he has still has an army of cultists backing every single idiotic thing he does this election cycle, even though it's obvious his chances of overturning the results are practically nonexistent.
Remind me to avoid his Twitter page, because every comment made by a Trumper and the orange-in-chief himself is making me lose my brain cells.
Scaled seekerCarl Bernstein reveals 21 GOP who loathe Trump behind the scenes:
The 21 GOP Senators who have privately expressed their disdain for Trump are: Portman, Alexander, Sasse, Blunt, Collins, Murkowski, Cornyn, Thune, Romney, Braun, Young, Tim Scott, Rick Scott, Rubio, Grassley, Burr, Toomey, Mc Sally, Moran, Roberts, Shelby. (2/3)
Sounds like these 21 have a Morton's Fork: Criticize Trump but potentially lose the Georgia run-offs and get themselves primaried later (plus have to deal with Trump endlessly insulting them), or stay silent on Trump while he continues to create chaos in his last two months.
Edited by speedyboris on Nov 23rd 2020 at 8:19:38 AM
I always thought Trump was a Nazi/Fascist/whatever not because he embraces those ideologies, but it's because they benefit only him. Like, if you were to manage to tell him some Democratic ideologies that were beneficial for him, he'd jump on it like a pig in shit, even if he doesn't believe in what you told him.
Remember, these idiots drive, fuck, and vote. Not always in that order.I got to listen to another insane rant from my co-worker last night. Apparently JFK was killed by the democrats because he was going to pass a bill that gave power back to the people...whatever the hell that means. And he kept referencing the Clintons for some reason even though Bill was busy running for class president in 1964. He also whipped out the famous "We're not a democracy" rationalization and (predictably) called the election a farce based on nothing but his feelings being hurt.
I need you guys to tell me something; when Trumpies talk about the "impending" Civil War, who exactly are they going to be shooting at? Because the more I think about it, it's less civil war and more "series of domestic terror attacks."
Edited by Codafett on Nov 23rd 2020 at 7:52:57 AM
Just Having FunWith nearly all votes counted, the 2020 presidential election wasn't that close
The 2020 presidential election wasn’t really that close.
Right now, Joe Biden’s popular-vote lead over Trump stands at 4 percentage points, 51 percent to 47 percent — and it’s only going to grow once more of New York’s votes (finally) get counted.
That would give Biden the second-largest popular vote margin out of the 21st century’s six presidential elections, with only Barack Obama’s 7-point win in 2008 being greater.
When it comes to the Electoral College, the tally stands at Biden 306, Trump 232 – which happens to be the exact same split as Trump’s 2016 win versus Hillary Clinton (but in reverse). And Trump referred to that as a “massive landslide victory.”
Biden’s ahead by 154,000 votes in Michigan (greater than Trump’s 10,000-vote winning margin there in 2016).
He’s ahead by 81,000 votes in Pennsylvania (nearly twice Trump’s 44,000-vote win there four years ago).
And he’s ahead by more than 20,000 votes in Wisconsin (almost the same as Trump’s 23,000-vote victory there in 2016).
On top of those leads, Biden also narrowly flipped the traditionally GOP-leanings states of Arizona and Georgia.
The 2020 presidential race looked close the 12 hours after the first polling places closed on Election Night.
But nearly three weeks later — with almost all the votes counted — it’s now safe to say the Biden-vs.-Trump contest wasn’t that close.
Edited by sgamer82 on Nov 23rd 2020 at 7:56:23 AM
Once again, that kind of talk comes from people who feel threatened and disenfranchised. Even while Trump was President, they still felt there were outwards external threats that prevented them from being great, wealthy, and free. Their theories are not so much explanations of the world around them, as they are excuses for why the fantastic promises made to them have not been solidified.
A gun is empowering. A gun is the ultimate sling that will knock a Goliath off with little to no training. It's literally enshrined in U.S zeitgeist to the point the mere concept of restricting some access to some of them sounds like the chatter of SATAN HIMSELF to some.
They don't care who they have to shoot. They just want to feel like they are important.
It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothesAnother thing to note is that these people are very much cowards. They can't stand up to what they perceive as injustice without a weapon and a bunch of like-minded folks. They intimidate and threaten because they have no confidence that their world-view will stand up to rational discourse. (Because it doesn't, of course.)
They use physical intimidation to hide their intellectual and moral cowardice. They won't fight a civil war because they know they'll die like clay pigeons. At most you'll see a rise in domestic terrorism.
Edited by Fighteer on Nov 23rd 2020 at 11:18:22 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!""Like, if you were to manage to tell him some Democratic ideologies that were beneficial for him, he'd jump on it like a pig in shit, even if he doesn't believe in what you told him"
A reminder that trump was democrat 20 years ago and in fact he defended bill clinton allegation about other womans, call them "ugly liars".
Trump is many things but is loyal only to himself.
"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"The Clinton thing is on brand for Trump, as he would naturally feel solidarity with any powerful man accused of abuse towards women.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"Sorry, couldn't resist.
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case in point:
"“I don't necessarily agree with his victims, his victims are terrible,” Trump said. “He is really a victim himself. But he put himself in that position.”
“The whole group, Paula Jones, Lewinsky, it's just a really unattractive group. I'm not just talking about physical," he said.
“Would it be any different if it were a supermodel crowd?” Cavuto then asked.
“I think at least it would be more pleasant to watch,” Trump replied. "
that would be a huge yikes from me
"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"![]()
The thought that occurs to me is that Republicans don't actually care about that. If it were their candidate winning a majority of the popular vote but losing the Electoral College, you'd better believe they'd be screaming about how unfair it is.
Edited by Fighteer on Nov 23rd 2020 at 11:48:42 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"@Azsur I don't think that argument you put in the TL;DR folder proves that Trump isn't a Fascist. Sort of stumbling into Fascism without trying because of other driving factors doesn't make you not a Fascist.
You said:
There's been a long historical debate over how premedidated the Holocaust was, and how much of it was the result of sychophantic Nazi officers trying to do what would get them in Hitler's good books. Incompetently stumbling into evil isn't exactly unknown for Fascists.
"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."That's the idea. We have elected leaders, who come to power through the majority vote. Yeah we don't gather in atriums in our togas but that's the best you're going to get in the modern world. I was actually reading up on that idea that we're not a democracy earlier today and the whole idea seems to be that Republicans no longer care about the majority or whose more popular because it's becoming abundantly clear that their guys are not that.
This election has been the greatest proof of that: A man won fair and square, but it wasn't their man so clearly he cheated on an unprecedented scale. Who is supported by the majority no longer matters to them.
Just Having Fun

Edited by M84 on Nov 23rd 2020 at 10:25:08 PM
Disgusted, but not surprised