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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

TitanJump Since: Sep, 2013 Relationship Status: Singularity
#340126: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:15:26 AM

Why is it never as simple as "If anyone cheats, they will be disqualified and removed from their posts with immediate effect" as moral punishment for cheating.

Really, why is it not that simple?

clemont107 Mega Togekiss?! from Land of Missed Opportunities (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Mega Togekiss?!
#340127: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:16:24 AM

Which is why Dems need better leadership. Pelosi and Schumer if I recall tend to be Extreme Doormats who call for bipartanship even when it has been made clear that Republicans plan on ending the Democratic Party.

"Wow, no Mega Togekiss in Legends Z-A. Or any non-Froslass new Sinnoh Mega Evolutions. Round of applause, everybody." - Dawn
ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#340128: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:17:13 AM

[up][up]Because it wasn't written in the beginning and now there's no way to add it in as that would require the consent of cheaters.

Edited by ShinyCottonCandy on Nov 19th 2020 at 1:17:22 PM

My musician page
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#340129: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:20:21 AM

[up] Honestly, stuff like this just makes me wonder if the Founding Fathers were bloody naive.

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#340130: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:27:09 AM

Recall that the Democratic Party is akin to the Hero with Bad Publicity. If either Pelosi or Schumer put their foot down a wave of bothsiding from both the Republicans and (and this is the important part) the media would be sure to follow, possibly depressing turnout among people who only voted for Biden just to get Trump out of the WH enough to not only keep them out of the Senate, but lose the House as well, and maybe even the White House if a Biden presidency appears to be ineffectual because of Republican obstruction. At least that's what the fear is, i think.

Of course, the other side of the coin is letting Republicans run rampant could also depress turnout. Which I don't think Democrat leadership is too dumb not to realize.

Basically, like I've been saying, Democrats see themselves in a Morton's Fork situation: appear to do too much and turn off voters, or appear to do too little and turn off voters. Though, since "too much" and "too little" are subjective, and much of the base thinks they're doing too little as is... who knows?

...this post didn't make any sense.

i'm tired, my friend
TommyR01D Since: Feb, 2015
#340131: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:42:13 AM

Parliament and Congress have had a virtual "meeting" to commemorate the arrival of the Mayflower in Massachusetts in 1620.[1]

Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340133: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:46:39 AM

The simple problem with America's government is roughly half of it is crooked. That is not easily fixed and a substantial part of the public is entirely onboard with the values of white supremacy, voter suppression, and cruelty they display. Democrats call for unity and bipartisanship because they want to try to get them to do their jobs.

We had our chance to throw out Trump by a landslide and show our disgust.

70 million people still voted for him and the GOP.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#340134: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:54:12 AM

[up] Yeah, which is pretty much why some of my acquaintances have been somewhat bummed out by the result.

Because of the realisation that part of the US' population is actually that bad. :/

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340135: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:59:21 AM

I feel people understand Kentucky better. Today, you are all in a red state fighting to be blue.

sigh

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#340136: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:01:47 AM

For anyone that just now, in 2020 realized that yes, 50% of the country does in fact support the Republican party, I have no confidence that those people will retain this knowledge by next election. We were startled to learn this same fucking thing in 2016 too.

People on the left struggle to comprehend the basic idea that Republicans in power got into power by being elected into office over Democrats. The Left has a bad habit of not really thinking that the Right is a threat. We like to squabble internally and struggle to come together because it's just assumed that beating the Republican is a foregone conclusion. We cannot fathom voting for him, so many leftists just assume that nobody would ever vote for him.

It is hard to fight a culture war when half the people on your side cannot comprehend that such a culture war would even exist.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 19th 2020 at 11:02:10 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#340137: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:03:10 AM

TL;DR: Good Cannot Comprehend Evil

i'm tired, my friend
nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#340138: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:04:19 AM

Or barring that, Democrats and the media need to treat it like less of a joke.

Who's treating this like a joke?

Yes, people are laughing at the more blatant displays of total incompetence. But every single news site I see, while admittedly noting how unlikely anything Trump's trying will work, talks at the same time about how harmful it is American democracy that he's trying at all. I'm personally absolutely terrified that this meeting with senior Michigan legislators is going to be the start of the very same process of submitting unelected electors that I recently called a non-threat.

I mean, clearly Democrats are trying to walk a balance when it comes to putting pressure out there. But I think it's a bit exaggerated to say that they're treating this situation like a joke because the House hasn't impeached Trump again or called for a legal investigation into his attempts to steal the election. (And IIRC there is an attempt to censure Lindsey Graham.)

I am curious, admittedly, whether there's a possibility of criminal investigations into Trump's post-election behavior once everything's said and done with.

Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#340139: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:10:07 AM

I recall making an argument once (elsewhere, not here) that the narrative of a politician as a "liar" and their voter base as "sheep" is actually constructed in large part to avoid giving moral responsibility to voters. It doesn't seem to occur to people that the voter base actually totally wants what their elected official is doing.

Leviticus 19:34
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#340140: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:10:39 AM

I wanna add that of the people that are just realizing that half the country is spiteful and hateful enough to support the Republican Party, half of them (minimum) in turn claim that said hate and spite is on both sides. And don't think trying to explain why each side is angry and how that anger isn't equally unjustified. It won't register. Period.

Naturally, this is even less helpful and harder to surmount.

i'm tired, my friend
Resileafs I actually wanted to be Resileaf Since: Jan, 2019
I actually wanted to be Resileaf
#340141: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:30:55 AM

Personally I just hope that Democrats and leftists can take from this election that when they unite, they can defeat the Republicans, and that they have to work together to make this happen. That they have to continue working together after the election and that they have to spread their message and what they want to see in the US. And when the next elections come, they have to continue working together.

But my fear is that the majority of the centrist Democrats will just rest on their laurels, ignore the message that was given to them this November and just assume that people will vote for them and then get surprised when they don't.

Edit: It looks like there's a trend for frustrated trumpsters on Twitter to called black people 'riggers' to be racist without saying the n-word while at the same time implying that black people have rigged the elections. They certainly continue to show their class.

Edited by Resileafs on Nov 19th 2020 at 2:50:08 PM

Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#340142: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:56:21 AM

[up] Which Trump is attempting to enable by the whole Wisconsin Recount in two counties with large black populations.

ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#340143: Nov 19th 2020 at 11:56:35 AM

And as yet another parting "Fuck You" shot, the Trump administration has officially labeled the BDS (Boycott, Divest, Sanction [Israel]) movement as anti-Semitic, taking steps to counter its ability to operate in the bargain.

In a statement issued Thursday, Pompeo committed the State Department to "countering the Global BDS Campaign as a manifestation of anti-Semitism." Toward that end, he said U.S. officials plan to identify and withdraw the department's funding and support from organizations linked to the movement.

Pompeo also rolled out new guidelines concerning the markings on goods imported to the U.S., requiring that anything produced in areas of the West Bank under Israeli administration are labeled with Israel as their country of origin. The new policy marks a departure from the Obama administration, which, in its own final days, issued guidance saying it was "not acceptable" to label goods produced in the occupied territories with any variation of "Made in Israel."

In his statement announcing the reversal, Pompeo suggested that this move, too, was aimed at thwarting the economic pressure sought by BDS and others.

"We will continue to oppose those countries and international institutions which delegitimize or penalize Israel and Israeli producers in the West Bank through malicious measures that fail to recognize the reality on the ground," he said.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#340144: Nov 19th 2020 at 12:01:12 PM

But my fear is that the majority of the centrist Democrats will just rest on their laurels, ignore the message that was given to them this November and just assume that people will vote for them and then get surprised when they don't.

I think one of the things that both progressives and centrists seem to miss out on is the fact that policy doesn't matter nearly as much as branding.

Basically, centrists don't need to be afraid of socialist policies, what they need to be concerned with is the appearance of socialism. Biden is about the last person you could accuse of being a socialist, but the label stuck because the democrats spent little time and effort to counter that narrative in Florida. The democrats don't need to go right or stay in the center, they just need to make it seem like they are, in the areas of the country where "socialism" is still an effective bogieman.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Nov 19th 2020 at 5:01:38 PM

clemont107 Mega Togekiss?! from Land of Missed Opportunities (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Mega Togekiss?!
#340145: Nov 19th 2020 at 12:02:44 PM

[up][up]They do realize that a lot of Donnie's supporters are anti-Semitic, right? I mean that's a core part of alt-right ideology, so trying to be pro-Jewish I think would not resonate well with his base.

"Wow, no Mega Togekiss in Legends Z-A. Or any non-Froslass new Sinnoh Mega Evolutions. Round of applause, everybody." - Dawn
3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#340146: Nov 19th 2020 at 12:04:14 PM

This isn't Pro-Jewish, its Pro-Israel, a distinction the GOP has been treading a long time.

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GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#340147: Nov 19th 2020 at 12:05:31 PM

I think most conservatives voters aren't nearly as evil or malevolently stupid as many leftists characterize them as being.

They simply only care about themselves, their families, the economy, and find the left's approach to things overbearing.

That's how my dad is. He doesn't strike me as a hateful person at all. He just thinks the way things are right now is adequate, and earnestly thinks that countries do better economically under conservative governments.

Though to be fair, after 4 years of thinking "There must be something good about Trump if so many people voted for him" even he's disgusted by how Trump is handling this whole election situation.

Kaze ni Nare!
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340148: Nov 19th 2020 at 12:05:44 PM

A decent chunk of white supremacists are pro-Israel because it's a deportation fantasy.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
#340149: Nov 19th 2020 at 12:06:51 PM

And also those bits of the Rapture that need Jerusalem to be in a given condition.

"Yup. That tasted purple."
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#340150: Nov 19th 2020 at 12:07:43 PM

I think most conservatives voters aren't nearly as evil or malevolently stupid as many leftists characterize them as being.

They simply only care about themselves, their families, the economy, and find the left's approach to things overbearing.

That is an evil and malevolently stupid mindset though, is this meant to criticize the leftist view?

A decent chunk of white supremacists are pro-Israel because it's a deportation fantasy.

And it's a model of the ethnostate they want to make.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Nov 19th 2020 at 12:08:11 PM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang

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