TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

nova92 Since: Apr, 2020
#340101: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:20:21 AM

Although, IIRC, Perdue actually got more votes than Trump, presumably from Biden voters, and a Libertarian candidate siphoned off a few more from Ossoff. So there may be a thin sliver of voters who are persuadable, or at least can be convinced to not turn out for Perdue.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340102: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:22:37 AM

Basically, the thing in Georgia is not that Republicans were persuaded to vote for Biden but that people who normally didn't vote or were disenfranchised chose to vote.

Which is basically the issue in rural states. Its not people changing their mind but people deciding Trump was THAT bad and THIS TIME their vote would count.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
clemont107 Mega Togekiss?! from Land of Missed Opportunities (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Mega Togekiss?!
#340103: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:24:41 AM

I think there are also a lot of moderate conservatives in Georgia who happen to have relatively neutral opinions on Biden and King Ghidonald; while they may have ultimately gone for Biden, they would still prefer Perdue and Loeffer as Senators for some reason.

Edited by clemont107 on Nov 19th 2020 at 10:25:47 AM

"Wow, no Mega Togekiss in Legends Z-A. Or any non-Froslass new Sinnoh Mega Evolutions. Round of applause, everybody." - Dawn
nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#340104: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:43:26 AM

So I don't know if this got overlooked or what, but I'm seriously starting to wonder: what does happen if the contested states fail to certify their results on time? Not because of lawsuits or anything, just Republicans flat-out refusing like these idiots in Michigan.

All I can find is people talking about how Trump is hoping this will lead to Republican legislatures submitting their own slates of electors, but this is universally agreed to be a non-threat (not least because those legislatures themselves have rejected the idea), so it's not all that helpful in understanding what would actually happen.

nova92 Since: Apr, 2020
#340105: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:43:43 AM

[up][up] Not a lot, Perdue only outperformed Trump by a couple tenths of a %. But if the runoffs come down to the wire, those people staying at home or voting for Ossoff could make the difference.

Edited by nova92 on Nov 19th 2020 at 7:43:55 AM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340106: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:46:22 AM

Basically, people will yell at them until they do as happened in Michigan.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#340107: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:50:38 AM

Even if Michigan somehow swings back to Trump as a result of these "wait a second, after talking to Trump, we rescind our certifications" shenanigans, Biden still has enough EC votes to win, right?

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340108: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:54:14 AM

The certification is permanent.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#340109: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:55:06 AM

Yes.

Georgia certifies tomorrow, and Pennsylvania and Michigan do so on Monday. Past that, Trump doesn't have enough states to contest that he even has a tiny change of flipping.

Expect a lot of sound and fury this weekend.

Arizona doesn't certify until the 30th, and Nevada doesn't so until the 1st, but even if Trump flips them both (not happening) he's under 270. Beyond that, it's just uncontested states.

Edited by Rationalinsanity on Nov 19th 2020 at 11:57:43 AM

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#340110: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:57:41 AM

The certification is permanent.
Oh. So even though they rescinded it, it's still locked in?

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340111: Nov 19th 2020 at 7:58:54 AM

Yes.

It's done and it can't be reversed. They tried to undo it because Trump, himself, called and threatened them.

Which is illegal but welcome to our world.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#340112: Nov 19th 2020 at 8:11:04 AM

So basically, it's all over after this weekend, aside from Trump obviously continuing to cry like a lil' biatch.

That's a relief.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
SatoshiBakura (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#340113: Nov 19th 2020 at 8:13:01 AM

It’s been over since the election was called. Trump and his cronies just didn’t - and still don’t - want to admit it.

clemont107 Mega Togekiss?! from Land of Missed Opportunities (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Mega Togekiss?!
#340114: Nov 19th 2020 at 8:26:20 AM

Crowley is like the human equivalent of Megatron; both want power and to keep it permanently. If you compare the two side-by-side there's not much differences aside from the fact that Megatron is smarter, so he wouldn't make a big fuss about losing in case he wanted to regain power in 4 years.

Edited by clemont107 on Nov 19th 2020 at 11:28:39 AM

"Wow, no Mega Togekiss in Legends Z-A. Or any non-Froslass new Sinnoh Mega Evolutions. Round of applause, everybody." - Dawn
speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#340115: Nov 19th 2020 at 8:26:29 AM

I swear, this post-election period is like one of those horror movies where you think the killer's dead but then THE HAND COMES UP

Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#340116: Nov 19th 2020 at 8:28:46 AM

Actually, I suspect it'll be akin to a subversion Agents of SHIELD had:

The main villain of the first season or so, Garret, was killed. They are then resurrected by some advanced technology, coming back as a cyborg badass and declare their intention for revenge. Coulson vaporizes him nonchalantly.

Leviticus 19:34
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#340117: Nov 19th 2020 at 8:30:03 AM

The Michigan situation wasn’t the state certification, each county certifies its results, then the state certifies the state’s results as a whole. So the one county would have either had the state certify the results for them, or the state could have just certified its own results without the one county.

If a state doesn’t certify in time then it’s electors don’t count, Biden’s electoral college victory is strong enough that a state he won could fail to certify and he’d be fine.

Edited by Silasw on Nov 19th 2020 at 4:31:20 PM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#340118: Nov 19th 2020 at 8:40:47 AM

I think the point where it's safe to say all this is "over" is whenever Congressional Republicans in general openly acknowledge that Trump lost.

Also, apparently his team dropped their Michigan lawsuit... because they think the meaningless "retractions" from the Republican certifiers accomplished its objective.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#340119: Nov 19th 2020 at 9:38:52 AM

I kind of know why (depending on how you look at it, either a belief that not acting will better achieve unity or abject cowardice), but I don't get why the House doesn't impeach Trump again.

It's really frustrating to hear from Democrats the fact that even if these interferences were successful, it wouldn't make a difference to Biden's victory. Yes, that's kind of true, but the interferences are still illegal and a real threat to democracy. Also, once an inference is successful, it's a lot more likely that Republicans across the board will follow suit.

On a related note, I think it undersells it to frame the interferences as Republicans just playing a game to appease Trump. While that is part of it, another (perhaps bigger part) is that Republicans really don't want African Americans to be able to vote and right now are playing chicken to see how much they can get away with. And Democrats not doing anything is giving them permission to keep pushing it.

Like I'm generally a solidly Democratic person who "punches left", but in this situation I think there's a legit point in criticism of Democrats' lack of action.

Edit - [down] That is of course true. And I do kind of think there is a calculation (maybe right, maybe wrong) that lack of action makes it more likely that Democrats will will the Georgia Senate seats.

Edited by Hodor2 on Nov 19th 2020 at 11:41:06 AM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#340120: Nov 19th 2020 at 9:39:28 AM

Because the Republican Senate is still in control. Impeachment was necessary to make a formal symbolic stand for the law but let's not pretend that the Senate would do a damn thing differently.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Nov 19th 2020 at 9:40:06 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Xopher001 Since: Jul, 2012
#340121: Nov 19th 2020 at 9:57:36 AM

Wasn't it said before that the Congress Republicans are just trying to appease Trump's base?

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#340122: Nov 19th 2020 at 9:58:32 AM

It's not like there's much point to it, pragmatically. Trump is already an impeached president, and even if it could succeed, all it would do is get him out of office slightly faster than he's already set to go.

Also, what impeachable offense(s) would the democrats use? The main reason his actions in Ukraine got him impeached when nothing else did was it was a straightforward, easy issue to explain why he was being impeached because he got caught with his hands in the cookie jar.

Remember, impeachment has to go over well with the people, and people are not reliable when it comes to nuance.

Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
#340123: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:00:42 AM

GOP tries to cite problems with absentee ballots in Mercer County, GA.

There's just one slight hitch with this plan: There is no Mercer County, GA.

"Yup. That tasted purple."
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#340124: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:04:07 AM

[up][up]Something in the way of impeachment for election inference.

Or barring that, Democrats and the media need to treat it like less of a joke.

Top Michigan GOP Lawmakers are flying out to DC to meet with Trump.

Yes, I still think it probably won't work at the end of the day, but again, in part becuase Trump and Trumpists tend to be incompetent, but this isn't (just) about soothing Trump's ego. It's about a pretty widely shared Republican belief that Democratic votes are inherently illegitimate.

Edited by Hodor2 on Nov 19th 2020 at 12:05:49 PM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#340125: Nov 19th 2020 at 10:12:39 AM

When Republicans cheat, Democrats never really know what to do and just default to trusting that the system will do what it's supposed to.

The Right's battle cry is, "All Democrats are Satanic pedophiles who are manipulating the system for selfish ends! They aren't even really Americans! In fact, they aren't even human."

The Left's battle cry is, "Stay the course. Follow the rules. Play fair. Just do what you would do if everything was normal. If we trust the system, justice will emerge in the end."

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 19th 2020 at 10:14:58 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.

Total posts: 417,856
Top