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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#33976: Oct 20th 2012 at 6:43:20 PM

Was Stein ever charged for that whole protest thing? Or just released afterwards?

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
rmctagg09 The Wanderer from Brooklyn, NY (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
The Wanderer
#33977: Oct 20th 2012 at 6:44:59 PM

Found this sample ballot

I see Stein and Johnson are on the ballot.

edited 20th Oct '12 6:45:59 PM by rmctagg09

Hugging a Vanillite will give you frostbite.
#33978: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:22:30 PM

I'm probably going to vote on Monday. Besides the president, there's a US congress seat open. The republican used to be in the state legislature and during that time actually worked with my family personally to fix a quirk in some legislation that probably only affected a couple dozen other families in the state besides us. So given that his other credentials are pretty decent (pro-life, a veteran, opposed to the No Child Left Behind Act, opposed to Obamacare, endorsed by the NRA, and reasonably middle-of-the-road as regards Afghanistan/Iran/Patriot Act issues) he has my vote easily. My only issue with him is on immigration: he's part of the "let's get tough" crowd and I am not.

The rest off the ballot I don't really care about. There's a lot of little piddly offices that don't have any real power and/or have such unknown candidates that I have no better way of choosing than flipping a coin.

<><
Tangent128 from Virginia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Gonna take a lot to drag me away from you
#33979: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:43:26 PM

I heard a radio ad the other day where the candidate attacked their opponent for supporting public campaign financing. Were they in my district, they would have lost my vote.

Do you highlight everything looking for secret messages?
Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#33980: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:47:03 PM

What's the No Child Left Behind Act?

Some bullshit Orwellian bill that screws people over, right?

[up][up] You do realize that the NRA/PATRIOT Act is deeply corrupt, and that Obamacare covers those with pre-existing conditions, right?

edited 20th Oct '12 7:48:19 PM by Serocco

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
Enkufka Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ from Bay of White fish Since: Dec, 2009
Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ
#33981: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:49:00 PM

@Serrocco: NCLB was a program signed in good faith by Bush in an attempt to improve education. In effect, it mandated standardized tests a whole lot and based funding on the results.

It didn't work, of course, but still.

Very big Daydream Believer. "That's not knowledge, that's a crapshoot!" -Al Murray "Welcome to QI" -Stephen Fry
Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#33982: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:49:55 PM

[up] I doubt Bush did that based on good intentions. Was there profit involved in that bill for standardized tests?

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
Enkufka Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ from Bay of White fish Since: Dec, 2009
Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ
#33983: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:51:35 PM

Probably, inasmuch as any government program will affect a private industry in some way.

I think Bush was a fool whose cabinet was staffed with malicious bastards. I give him the benefit of the doubt and not assume that most of what he did was malicious.

Very big Daydream Believer. "That's not knowledge, that's a crapshoot!" -Al Murray "Welcome to QI" -Stephen Fry
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#33984: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:54:20 PM

Bush genuinely does seem like a guy that was just really easy to manipulate. I don't think he intentionally screwed people over but I don't think he cared about actually helping anyone. Romney comes off in a similar light but he seems to be actively malicious in some aspects.

Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#33985: Oct 20th 2012 at 7:55:56 PM

Bush still made all of the decisions. He still picked Cheney to be his vice president. He still made all those speeches that blamed Saddam for the 9/11 attacks (though Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz were the ones that pushed everyone for the invasion in Iraq). He still tried to privatize Social Security (that was Ryan's idea, and he even managed to convince Cheney to do it). He still did nothing regarding Katrina.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:01:36 PM by Serocco

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
Tangent128 from Virginia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Gonna take a lot to drag me away from you
#33986: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:03:00 PM

NCLB works under the idea that tying funding to test results would hold schools "accountable"; the issue is, a school with cut funding turns out to be less effective at teaching children, creating a vicious cycle. Furthermore, it skewed incentives towards teaching how to test well, not how to learn and exploit knowledge.

Do you highlight everything looking for secret messages?
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#33987: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:05:32 PM

Some bullshit Orwellian bill that screws people over, right?

....Not quite.

The No Child Left Behind Act was an act passed by the Bush administration in 2001/2. The act's goal was to reform the education system. The act supported standards-based education reform based on the premise that setting high standards and establishing measurable goals can improve individual outcomes in education. The Act requires states to develop assessments in basic skills. States must give these assessments to all students at select grade levels in order to receive federal school funding.

Should a school not meet the goal then the following actions would be taken:

  • Schools that miss the goal for a second consecutive year are publicly labeled as being "in need of improvement" and are required to develop a two-year improvement plan for the subject that the school is not teaching well. Students are given the option to transfer to a better school within the school district, if any exists.

  • Missing the goal for three years forces the school to offer free tutoring and other supplemental education services to struggling students.

  • If a school misses its goal for a fourth consecutive year, the school is labelled as requiring "corrective action," which might involve wholesale replacement of staff, introduction of a new curriculum, or extending the amount of time students spend in class.

  • A fifth year of failure results in planning to restructure the entire school; the plan is implemented if the school fails to hit its goal for the sixth year in a row. Common options include closing the school, turning the school into a charter school, hiring a private company to run the school, or asking the state office of education to run the school directly.

The Act had good intentions and mass bipartisan support. But there were many problems with the bill, the most notable ones being that the government never fully funded the act and set rather unrealistic goals.

Eventually many States used the State Rights card and ended the program in there state. I think only around 10 states are still trying to reach the deadline the No Child Left Behind Act set.

I'm surprised you haven't heard about it. The media was always talking about it in the early 2000s.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:06:42 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#33988: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:05:47 PM

It also has the bizarre problem of punishing a school for having high marks. When your students are scoring in the mid to high 90s consistently there's not much room for improvement so you're going to have trouble getting more funding if you need it.

Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#33989: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:06:01 PM

[up][up] I was a kindergartner during that time.

I bring that up because educators are funding Obama by a bucketload, but once again, I doubt he's gonna do anything regarding education or NCLB.

Fox News admits tax raises for the rich need to happen for economic growth.

And yet, you're not gonna find any politician, left or right, that'll campaign on that. Not Obama, not Romney. Hell, they want to lower corporate taxes. Obama himself keeps admitting that in the debates.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:08:07 PM by Serocco

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#33990: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:08:10 PM

I sincerely don't know what to believe about Obama. He could just be saying that to not scare off the stupid people or he could genuinely believe that. The latter wouldn't exactly surprise me since he's, you know, not an actual liberal but still.

DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#33991: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:08:47 PM

[up][up]

So what would you call Obama proposing the Buffet Rule?

edited 20th Oct '12 8:10:10 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
rmctagg09 The Wanderer from Brooklyn, NY (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
The Wanderer
#33992: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:09:21 PM

[up]x4 Never met a teacher that actually liked that thing.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:09:28 PM by rmctagg09

Hugging a Vanillite will give you frostbite.
Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#33993: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:11:08 PM

[up][up] I haven't seen it implemented. He's done nothing about it other than to have that as a proposal.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:14:29 PM by Serocco

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#33994: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:13:31 PM

[up]

Well as the article notes, Nearly every elected Republican opposed the proposal. Representative Paul Ryan (R–Wis.), who is the chairman of the House Budget Committee, criticized the new tax provisions. He labeled it as class warfare and also stated that it would negatively impact job creation and investment.

In April the proposal 51 affirmative votes in the Senate, but was stopped by a Republican filibuster that required 60 votes to proceed to debate and a vote on final passage.

See, this is what happens when you allow politicians to make pledges not to raise taxes.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:15:52 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Serocco Serocco from Miami, Florida Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Faithful to 2D
Serocco
#33995: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:14:54 PM

From what I've seen, Obama's more concerned about cutting Medicare than implementing the Buffett rule.

It's something that Romney and Ryan also want, but none of them are going to say that in the debates.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:15:24 PM by Serocco

In RWBY, every girl is Best Girl.
Enkufka Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ from Bay of White fish Since: Dec, 2009
Wandering Student ಠ_ಠ
#33996: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:18:03 PM

[up][up]On that note, that reminds me: Tommy Thompson, running here in Wisconsin, doesn't understand the nature of the pledge he signed.

CEO asks employees to help the company "And yourself" by donating $2.5k to Romney.

[up]not that fucking thing again. It's being cut because the payments to doctors and hospitals is being lowered, not because it's just being cut outright. There have been no cuts to benefits At All.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:29:58 PM by Enkufka

Very big Daydream Believer. "That's not knowledge, that's a crapshoot!" -Al Murray "Welcome to QI" -Stephen Fry
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#33997: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:19:46 PM

Romney has taken the bizarre position of opposing the Democrats cutting of Medicare, while supporting and promising far greater cuts.

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Completion oldtimeytropey from Space Since: Apr, 2012
oldtimeytropey
#33998: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:21:12 PM

To all the Bush-bashing: He signed NCLB in good faith. It gave massive federal funding to schools and standardized curriculum throughout the nation along with what the previous poster mentioned. When it was being passed it was supported by nearly everyone and was what Bush was hoping would be what people would remember him for.

(This was passed around the same time in his presidency as Obama passed ACA/Obamacare, Clinton tried his health proposal, etc. for reference.)

If it weren't for the Iraq war, Bush would've been known as that guy who tried to fix public schools.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:39:31 PM by Completion

LostAnarchist Violence Is Necessary! from Neo Arcadia Itself Since: Sep, 2011
Violence Is Necessary!
#33999: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:30:27 PM

[up] See that you stave your tongue and correct yourself accordingly, young man!

This is where I, the Vampire Mistress, proudly reside: http://liberal.nationstates.net/nation=nova_nacio
Completion oldtimeytropey from Space Since: Apr, 2012
oldtimeytropey
#34000: Oct 20th 2012 at 8:38:18 PM

To segue this topic on topic, there's not been much talk about education this election as there was in 2000 outside of general student loan issues that appear every election in an attempt to appeal to college voters.

edited 20th Oct '12 8:38:42 PM by Completion


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