Nov 2023 Mod notice:
There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines
before posting here.
Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.
If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules
when posting here.
In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
![]()
Yeah, the succession of West Virginia from Virginia was very much a product of the divisions of the Civil War not falling precisely on state lines.
My understanding is that there was also a chance of Tennessee breaking up during the war, but it never quite materialized. Nevertheless there's a reason that Tennessee became the only former confederate state to ratify the 13th Amendment (the one that permanently abolished slavery for the non-US posters in the thread) in the immediate aftermath of the Civil War.
Edited by Falrinn on Oct 28th 2020 at 5:26:51 AM
Two new decisions from the Supreme Court related to the counting of absentee ballots (or perhaps more accurately, the decision to not make a decision)
CNN: Supreme Court won't expedite latest GOP challenge to Pennsylvania mail-in ballot rules
This means the case won't be decided before the election, and so current rules, i.e. allowing "the counting of ballots received up to three days after the election, even if there is no legible postmark." will stand.
Both cases were appeals of lower court rulings. Justice Barrett didn't participate in either case. Alito, Thomas and Gorsuch dissented in the first but agreed with the second.
Well, back then, DC didn’t have any residents other than the office-holders, so it didn’t need statehood.
My musician pageDid you actually not know that West Virginia existed?
![]()
That last one strikes me as less reassuring than it does a strong indicator that the Supreme Court is waiting to see whether Trump loses Pennsylvania by a close enough margin that late mail-in ballots matter.
(I'm beating a dead horse at this point, but it seriously cannot be overstated how much the courts are Trump's most plausible means to "victory". Not to say he doesn't have a legit Electoral College path, but it's pretty narrow.)
"Nevertheless there's a reason that Tennessee became the only former confederate state to ratify the 13th Amendment (the one that permanently abolished slavery for the non-US posters in the thread) in the immediate aftermath of the Civil War."
Nitpick, but Louisiana ratified it before Tennessee, and Arkansas ratified just after Tennessee did. All three states had strong Union occupation forces in the latter half of the war, so their state governments were already being set up for Reconstruction and the 13th Amendment by extention.
I have wondered if Washington not being an official state was due to some attempt making the capital neutral ground and that it above the ideas of statehood,or something,that it bears Washington's name might have something to do with it
The land for it was literally taken out of existing states to provide a neutral capital.
The problem is that now there's so many people within its boundaries that you have this representation problem and nobody wants to take it back, but it's entirely possible to shrink the reserved land itself to only include federal buildings.
Republicans have complained this would give the new state undue influence over politicians by having the car parks. Seriously.
Honest to Zuul, I did not know West Virginia existed. I thought that when John Denver sings "West Virginia," he was simply talking about the non-Eastern part of Virginia.
I'm from Europe, and in general we don't spend a lot of time talking about individual U.S. states. We don't hear West Virginia mentioned a lot of the time, and when we do, it's not mentioned that it's a state and not just a part of Virginia.
Speaking of shrinking the federal district, isn’t that how DC would become a state? Wouldn't that also end up with the president (the only resident of the now shrunken federal district) having 3 electoral votes? Or would they not, because they’d probably not be able to find three district residents eligible to be electors?
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran![]()
That's understandable.
It is the only state that has a cardinal direction it's name without it's counterpart having it as well.
Presumably because the unionist Virginia politicians who got together to declare themselves the legitimate government of Virginia during the Civil War in order to authorize the succession of West Virginia felt that forcing the part of the state still in rebellion to change it's name to "East Virginia" would be a bit much.
Shrinking the Federal district to just Federal buildings is a mutually exclusive with DC statehood.
...though it does raise the possibility that shrinking the district without repealing the 23rd Amendment would result in the President and any member of his family living in the White House (plus the VP who has their own official residence in DC) would have sole control over the 3 electors of DC.
Edited by Falrinn on Oct 28th 2020 at 6:01:42 AM
The count during election day is usually enough to declare a victor because it's rare that the proportion of votes changes dramatically as they get counted over the days, unless the race is tight in a given region.
This election promises to be very different because of the proportion of people who voted early or by mail-in ballots.
To underscore how fucked America was after Lincoln's assassination, Virginia petitioned to have W. Virginia re-absorbed under Johnson. Virginia planned to punish those who had been involved in it for their "illegal secession" as well as implement large numbers of brutal racial laws that had been overturned by West Virginia.
West Virginia said fuck off.
Edited by CharlesPhipps on Oct 28th 2020 at 7:41:43 AM
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.

It's illegal unless congress signs off on it, which as I've mentioned they have done twice in the past. The states of Maine and West Virginia wouldn't exist today if it was flatly illegal under all circumstances.
My thought is that a political environment where Texas wants to break up and the Supreme Court is willing to agree with the interpretation that Texas was granted that right in perpetuity is probably also an environment where Congress would sign off on a Texas breakup, rendering the whole issue moot.
Edited by Falrinn on Oct 28th 2020 at 4:58:10 AM