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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#335426: Oct 26th 2020 at 12:42:27 PM

Another interesting quote:

Voting by mail does not favor either party “during normal times,” according to a team of researchers at Stanford, but that phrase does a lot of work. Their findings, which were published in June, did not take into account a president whose words alone could produce a partisan skew. Trump’s systematic predictions of fraud appear to have had a powerful effect on Republican voting intentions. In Georgia, for example, a Monmouth University poll in late July found that 60 percent of Democrats but only 28 percent of Republicans were likely to vote by mail.

This basically means any arguments about mail in voting not favouring either party are moot, because Republicans are specifically changing their voting behaviour because they believe mail in voting favours Democrats, making it a self fulfilling prophecy.

And some speculation about the sort of thing that could happen on election day:

Suppose that caravans of Trump supporters, adorned in Second Amendment accessories, converge on big-city polling places on Election Day. They have come, they say, to investigate reports on social media of voter fraud. Counter­protesters arrive, fistfights break out, shots are fired, and voters flee or cannot reach the polls.

Then suppose the president declares an emergency. Federal personnel in battle dress, staged nearby in advance, move in to restore law and order and secure the balloting. Amid ongoing clashes, they stay to monitor the canvass. They close the streets that lead to the polls. They take custody of uncounted ballots in order to preserve evidence of fraud.

“The president can’t cancel the election, but what if he says, ‘We’re in an emergency, and we’re shutting down this area for a period of time because of the violence taking place’?” says Norm Ornstein of the American Enterprise Institute. If you are in Trump’s camp and heedless of boundaries, he said, “what I would expect is you’re not going to do one or two of these things—you’ll do as many as you can.”

Edited by Redmess on Oct 26th 2020 at 9:02:21 AM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#335427: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:07:09 PM

Then suppose the president declares an emergency. Federal personnel in battle dress, staged nearby in advance, move in to restore law and order and secure the balloting.

And the fearmongering cottage industry strikes again.

Trump couldn’t get the national guard to clear protesters from outside the White House, they’re not going to invade polling stations for him.

That leaves him with federal law enforcement, who would end up facing off against the national guard regiments sent in by the governor of whatever state such events occurred in. They also lack the numbers to act on a large number of polling places.

Edited by Silasw on Oct 26th 2020 at 8:08:32 AM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#335428: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:15:15 PM

A few good people are still in there, like Bill Weld, but yeah, their numbers are dwindling.

Libertarian politicians are not good people. I have a pre-existing condition, if Mr. Weld had his way I'd be either bankrupt or dead.

And that's just me, the policies they support are harmful in the vast majority of situations.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#335429: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:16:47 PM

[up][up] You mistake the premise, the national guard would be called in to break up riots and close off streets in the case of a declaration of emergency.

And I have read Trump's book, it was an interesting read, and gives a good window into what made Trump into what he is today, and his messed up family (almost nothing on his own children, though, this is very much about Trump's siblings and parents). It will make a fine basis for a dramatic miniseries someday, I'm sure.

Edited by Redmess on Oct 26th 2020 at 9:17:13 AM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#335430: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:19:50 PM

[up][up]He was libertarian, I am not aware of him still spouting these former positions, he now describes himself as "Fiscally conservative."

Which yeah, is not liberal, but he is still a Republican. Other than that, he is Pro LGBT/Same Sex marriage, Pro Choice, Pro Legalization, doesn't deny climate change and was in favour of impeaching Trump.

If I had to choose between him or some shitty Democrat like Bloomberg, Williamson or Gabbard, I'd take him within a heartbeat.

Edited by Forenperser on Oct 26th 2020 at 9:20:02 AM

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#335431: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:23:38 PM

You mistake the premise, the national guard would be called in to break up riots and close off streets in the case of a declaration of emergency.

Yes they would be called in, by the state’s governor, whose orders they would follow. The key swing states have democrat governors, who aren’t going to order their national guard regiments to seize ballots or destroy them.

The premise is faulty because it assumes that Trump is the only authority in such a situation, he’s not, the US has a federal system and states control their national guard regiments, also the national guard commanders have a history of telling Trump to shove it when he tries to get them to do illegal things.

If the idea is just that there may be violence at the polls, well then Trump is truly fucked, because Biden’s voters are all voting early, so election day violence is going to result in Trump’s voters not wanting to risk it while Biden’s sit safe at home tanking their stars they cast their vote a week ago.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#335432: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:25:16 PM

[up][up]The problem there is the similar to the problem with “I don’t see color.” Strictly speaking it’s not as bad, but they have a way of turning a blind eye when someone else discriminates against the minority, particularly subtly. For example, whenever medical care makes up some bs not to provide their best level of care toward the minority people. (Pre-existing conditions seem to be the default go-to.)

Edited by ShinyCottonCandy on Oct 26th 2020 at 4:25:56 AM

My musician page
Galadriel Since: Feb, 2015
#335433: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:25:31 PM

If Biden wins, he really needs to pass a law that bars armed militias from showing up at the polls. It’s ugly, blatant voter intimidation.

But given the right-wing supreme court, they might even throw a common-sense law like that out on Second Amendment grounds. Cause a bunch of far-right guys with guns and Confederate flags hanging out at polling stations couldn’t possibly get in the way of black people voting. They’re just exercising their constitutional rights!

Edited by Galadriel on Oct 26th 2020 at 4:28:02 AM

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#335434: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:27:41 PM

He was libertarian, I am not aware of him still spouting these former positions, he now describes himself as "Fiscally conservative."

Which yeah, is not liberal, but he is still a Republican. Other than that, he is Pro LGBT/Same Sex marriage, Pro Choice, Pro Legalization, doesn't deny climate change and was in favour of impeaching Trump.

If I had to choose between him or some shitty Democrat like Bloomberg, Williamson or Gabbard, I'd take him within a heartbeat.

Going from libertarian to fiscal conservatism is no change at all.

Once again, I have a pre-existing condition. Fiscal conservatism demands that I be sacrificed on the altar of lower taxes for rich people.

You mention Climate Change, there is no solution for climate change that is fiscally conservative. And the rest of those positives? Libertarians support them too, it doesn't make the harm they do any less real.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Oct 26th 2020 at 1:28:30 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#335435: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:36:44 PM

Going from libertarian to fiscal conservatism is no change at all.

I think the flag's different

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#335436: Oct 26th 2020 at 1:38:48 PM

Very true [lol]

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#335437: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:00:14 PM

So quick question, are any of you familiar with Clownfish TV on Youtube? Are they a good news channel?

They sure like their "[X] does [Y]!?!?" titles.

Edited by Redmess on Oct 26th 2020 at 10:05:08 AM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#335438: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:05:10 PM

So I am seeing a lot of stories cropping up of spreading 'pandemic fatigue', think that's going to affect the election any?

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#335439: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:08:06 PM

> So quick question, are any of you familiar with Clownfish TV on Youtube? Are they a good news channel?

Nope

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#335440: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:08:47 PM

[up][up][up]I might be misremembering but I'm pretty sure that's an alt-right channel, so I wouldn't give it any more consideration.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Oct 26th 2020 at 6:08:56 AM

astrokitty Happiness is a cup of tea from Somewhere Out There Since: May, 2014 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Happiness is a cup of tea
#335441: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:10:04 PM

I feel like naming your channel "Clownfish TV" is just begging for people to mock you.

Somebody once told me the world was macaroni, I took a bite out of a tree
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#335442: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:13:18 PM

Hmm, that's what I was afraid of.

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#335443: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:14:06 PM

I believe that the alt-right have a term "clown world" which refers in some way to the idea that Jews control the world (I guess the idea is that this is like a truth that no one dares to admit).

I'm not familiar with the channel, and maybe they chose the title because they liked Finding Nemo or something, but given the above, I would doubt they are a good news source.

Edit - Looking them up, the videos seem like standard Gamergate/Comicsgate type stuff about cancel culture and Hollywood Social Justice Warriors. So bad, but not Nazis at least from the video description.

But still wondering why you are considering them as a news source.

Edited by Hodor2 on Oct 26th 2020 at 4:16:23 AM

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#335444: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:14:47 PM

Honestly I wouldn't use YT to get news anyways, or at least not an individual pundit channel.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Oct 26th 2020 at 6:15:04 AM

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#335445: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:16:08 PM

Clown World has nothing to do with the Jews, it's just that they use this term whenever they think the world, or the law, is completely backwards.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
GoldenKaos Captain of the Dead City from Cirith Ungol Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Captain of the Dead City
#335446: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:17:41 PM

Libertarians are always fine with people having the right to oppress other people if push came to shove. Fuck 'em

Edit: Capitalist Libertarians, that is.

Edited by GoldenKaos on Oct 26th 2020 at 2:18:06 AM

"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#335447: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:22:47 PM

I am not considering them, but I have an American friend who does not watch TV and distrusts any big media as being biased by default, and instead swears by Youtube channels like Clownfish TV, and is under the impression that this sort of channel is more honest because it isn't some big media organization.

And yes, they voted for Trump, not because of believing in his actual policies, but because they think the public is being misled about what Trump actually does or says. When I brought up several of the things he does, I got the standard justifications you'd expect from Republicans: kids in cages wasn't his fault, he actually denounced white supremacists, etc.

I don't think this is a bad person at all, just a centrist who doesn't know what media to trust any more and puts too much stock in Youtube sources with questionable biases of their own. And I'm trying to figure out how to deal with that.

Oh, and the vote for Trump is also partly because Biden gets walked over by everyone and will be a Harris puppet, apparently. Well, when that's what the "news" tells you, is it any wonder they don't know who to vote for any more?

Edited by Redmess on Oct 26th 2020 at 10:26:20 AM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#335448: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:26:25 PM

I confess my first thought is "Just because they're more honest doesn't mean they aren't deluding themselves."

Edited by sgamer82 on Oct 26th 2020 at 2:27:08 AM

ScubaWolf from South Carolina Since: Feb, 2020
#335449: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:30:06 PM

[up][up] Uhh, he ain't a centrist judging from those talking points. He's in full blown Trump-supporter land.

Edited by ScubaWolf on Oct 26th 2020 at 5:30:30 AM

"In a move surprising absolutely no one"
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#335450: Oct 26th 2020 at 2:31:04 PM

I'm not denying that, but how do you get someone out of such a tiny media bubble they have created for themselves? How do you show that a media source is unbiased and can be trusted?

[up] More like Trump denialism, I think.

Edited by Redmess on Oct 26th 2020 at 10:31:49 AM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times

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