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Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
#329976: Sep 30th 2020 at 1:38:52 AM

And apparently the Proud Boys are already printing Trump's call to arms on t-shirts.

"Yup. That tasted purple."
BattleRaizer from Realm of Khorne Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#329977: Sep 30th 2020 at 1:53:38 AM

Anyone else here not American but look at the debate and ask:"Are there no other candidate? How does the race for the most powerful office in a superpower come down to these two?"

Edited by BattleRaizer on Sep 30th 2020 at 3:53:59 PM

E.T technically is a Isekai movie
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#329978: Sep 30th 2020 at 1:55:45 AM

No, because Biden is a completely reasonable person and in a two party system you are far more likely to end up with a candidate possessing average positions for their party.

I feel like people have weirdly high standards for politicians that indicate they've never actually paid attention to politicians.

nova92 Since: Apr, 2020
#329979: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:01:00 AM

NPR: NYC To Send New Ballots To Nearly 100,000 Voters After Printing Error

On Tuesday, the New York City Board of Elections announced a plan to print and mail new absentee ballots to nearly 100,000 voters who received erroneous envelopes in their absentee ballot packages. The decision comes after an unknown number of Brooklyn voters received absentee ballots with the wrong name and address printed on the return envelope.

Why is New York City so bad at this? It's a city where Democrats control all the levers of power. They shouldn't be this terrible at election administration. Have they learned nothing from their primaries?

RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#329980: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:04:51 AM

I think it was a printing error from the company contracted to do it.

"Company makes dumb mistake" is only news because of the context.

devak They call me.... Prophet Since: Jul, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
They call me.... Prophet
#329981: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:14:05 AM

"Anyone else here not American but look at the debate and ask:"Are there no other candidate? How does the race for the most powerful office in a superpower come down to these two?"

The process isn't designed to produce good presidents. It's too involved and too expensive, so you preselect for candidates who sufficient politicians like and who sufficient donors like. Neither of whom are regular people selecting for skill.

So the primary skill a US president is selected for is, due to the way the system works, the ability to get elected as US president. Actual skill as a president not needed.

Edited by devak on Sep 30th 2020 at 11:14:40 AM

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#329982: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:18:12 AM

Anyone else here not American but look at the debate and ask:"Are there no other candidate? How does the race for the most powerful office in a superpower come down to these two?"

Nope.

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#329983: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:28:01 AM

Again, I don't mean this to be rude, but sincerely without malice: It's a good thing the opinions of non-Americans don't matter in this election, because the sheer amount of naysaying, bothsiding, and "you can't really want to vote for Biden, right?" really doesn't help. Yes, I'm aware that this election has global ramifications for people across the world. In which case, it's about goddamn time they started educating themselves about what the only choice we have is, and stopped sitting on the sidelines throwing popcorn at the only realistic shot we have to get Trump out of office.

My apologies. Rant over.

It's been fun.
singularityshot Since: Dec, 2012
#329984: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:29:03 AM

I'll be honest, I thought Trump edged this first debate. BUT this comes with a big caveat in that I was only able to listen to the debate, so I am wondering what I missed in terms of body language and behaviour - much in the same way that it was said that Nixon won the first debate against Kennedy on the radio but lost it on TV. And it's also fair to say that if all you can do is listen to the speakers, he who shouts loudest often wins so Trump by default.

I don't however think it shifted the election race in any way shape or form, so while Trump may have shaved it he needed to smash it and he didn't. All in all, we didn't learn anything new about Trump whereas there were some things we learnt about Biden.

Some other takeaways:

Biden does need a better line on Hunter. Trump flung his mud, as is his want. And he was able to kick up enough smoke that people are going to ask if there is some fire worth chasing. Biden's rote denial is just going to prompt the Mandy Rice-Davies quote so there has to be something a bit more substantial. That said, there is something in being candid about Hunter's drug problem - I think that will resonate with a lot of people suffering in the opioid epidemic and could help to reframe the discussion in a more favourable light.

Biden was strong on the "I am the Democrat Party" line and in skirting the contentious issues around policing, court packing and the Green New Deal. Every time Trump said "you've lost the left" I was smiling. Getting the left to vote for Biden is "our" problem - whereas those people in the centre who might be turned off by left wing policies are going to be reassured. Trump basically sunk his own argument that Biden is a puppet of the left. That said, I would like Biden to try and explain a little bit of his policy in microeconomic terms. It's annoying that the myth of "tax cuts will pay for themselves" means that Republicans don't have to justify their economic policy whereas the concept of investment leading to jobs leading to increased spending leading to increased tax intake is not as entrenched.

The biggest takeaway going forward however? It was interesting that many commentators were saying things like "should we even have a second and third debate given what a disaster this one was". And that is a fair question, even though the answer is that "yes we will have the debates because neither campaign wants to lose face by appearing to back down from a challenge." BUT - what it does do is elevate the importance of the VP debate. We know that the presidential debates are just going to be fire and fury. Pence isn't going to be able to do the same to Harris. And Harris can completely trap Pence and by extension the GOP establishment that Pence represents, by calling out all the attempts to gaslight the American public that the GOP has had to resort to every time Trump says something truly despicable - most notably from this debate the failure to condemn the Proud Boys.

Imca (Veteran)
#329985: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:30:08 AM

You know I just saw the clip of Trump refusing to discredit white supremicists even when handed the softest of softballs agian, and I noticed this time Biden just grining ear to ear...

Did he go off on that in the debate? Or is he grining like that because it gave him material for campaign adds.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#329986: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:36:06 AM

Some polling data and other considerations that Biden did benefit more from this debate than Trump.

I have already said before that presidential debates are a fundamentally bad idea. They emphasize aspects of candidates (looks, personality, debating style etc.) that are comparatively unimportant for a president, and they invariably become discussions about matters that are not a president's to give. If this becomes the last US presidential debate ever I would probably celebrate.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#329987: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:41:41 AM

I've seen a German news article trying to stay neutral by pointing out that Biden failed in being charismatic during the debate.

I mean, I would say standing beside a doped up monkey flinging poop is going to give you disadvantage on Charisma Checks...

"You can reply to this Message!"
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#329988: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:48:11 AM

I'll be honest, I thought Trump edged this first debate. BUT this comes with a big caveat in that I was only able to listen to the debate, so I am wondering what I missed in terms of body language and behaviour - much in the same way that it was said that Nixon won the first debate against Kennedy on the radio but lost it on TV. And it's also fair to say that if all you can do is listen to the speakers, he who shouts loudest often wins so Trump by default.

Biden tended to address a lot of his remarks to the audience/camera, whilst Trump was gesticulating like wild.

Also, if you ever wanted to see someone actually laughing at Trump on live TV? Here you are.

There's more, but the visuals definitely helped Biden.

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#329989: Sep 30th 2020 at 2:52:12 AM

[up][up] ....

Is said outlet aware we've been led for over a decade by a person who's many things, but charismatic isn't one of those?

Edited by DrunkenNordmann on Sep 30th 2020 at 11:52:30 AM

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#329990: Sep 30th 2020 at 3:13:45 AM

It's Spiegel and I'm pretty certain this is them trying to find a "both sides were less than ideal" tone to remain 'neutral'.

Their report on the US tends to be hit and miss sometimes

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DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#329991: Sep 30th 2020 at 3:19:49 AM

Oh, so they're doing the stupid thing where they pretend that both sides are somehow equal? Got it.

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
nova92 Since: Apr, 2020
#329992: Sep 30th 2020 at 3:20:32 AM

I think it was a printing error from the company contracted to do it.

"Company makes dumb mistake" is only news because of the context.

Sorry, was a bit overexcited in my initial post. But the problem is NYC has had a lot of election-related mishaps this year. And it's not great that they didn't catch it before ballots went out.

3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#329993: Sep 30th 2020 at 3:21:00 AM

Eh less that and more noting that Biden didn't come out squeaky clean. More fig leaf than CNN, I guess.

Though let's see what comes when the day shift gets writing.

I think an issue is that a lot of media outlets are comparing it to your usual debate....which was never in the cards with Trumps

Edited by 3of4 on Sep 30th 2020 at 12:23:53 PM

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thok That's Dr. Title, thank you! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Non-Canon
That's Dr. Title, thank you!
#329994: Sep 30th 2020 at 4:16:49 AM

Just as a reminder; the Senate needs to pass a continuing resolution and Trump needs to sign it today so that the federal government doesn't shutdown tomorrow. (This will probably happen; the Senate has already passed a few procedural votes to get to this point, and in a sane world it would definitely happen.)

WoodyAlien3rd from Persimmon Land (Italy) Since: Oct, 2015 Relationship Status: Omelette du fromage~
#329995: Sep 30th 2020 at 4:28:09 AM

Dana Bash calls the first presidential debate a 'shitshow'

Debate is a national humiliation, says The Guardian's David Smith

You're right in saying that us non-Americans' opinion does not matter about your vote. However the fact remains that, whoever wins, the damage has been done. The credibility of your nation is at an all-time low and seeing two very old men exchanging playground insults only cements the popular image of the US as a nation of racist ignorant buffoons who can't be trusted with anything. Look, I'm not saying that both guys are the same, and I certainly think and hope that Biden is going to win, but that won't be nearly enough to get the US to be trusted again in the next decade, especially since its enemies saw how easy it is to sow discord and put everyone against everyone else.

"Effective Altruism" is just another bunch of horsesh*t.
Ingonyama Since: Jan, 2001
#329996: Sep 30th 2020 at 4:34:17 AM

And speaking of the Senate, I just learned about this: Schumer, in rare move, takes control of floor to force health care vote.

Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, in an extremely rare move Tuesday, took control of the Senate floor and is forcing a procedural vote on a bill, a step that is typically done only by the Senate majority leader.

The top Democrat's action now sets up a vote later this week related to a bill that would protect people with pre-existing conditions if the Supreme Court sides with the Trump administration's Department of Justice and strikes down the Affordable Care Act after arguments are heard in November.

Schumer's surprise steps were extraordinary because such motions are typically offered by Majority Leader Mitch McConnell who controls the Senate and dictates what gets considered on the floor. Schumer has never before tried to force such a cloture vote in his time as the top minority leader, aides said.

The rules say any senator can do what Schumer did Tuesday but senators typically don't take these extreme steps because doing so regularly would shut down the Senate.

That's why it's custom to let the majority leader set the schedule.

So after all this time, after it seeming as if no one has any power to control what happens in the Senate except McConnell, and even if they couldn't have actually passed anything because of not being able to get 60 votes, they still could have brought up all kinds of procedural votes, gotten the Republicans on record for their votes, and bogged down or shut down the Senate.

I...I can't even.

Edited by Ingonyama on Sep 30th 2020 at 4:34:41 AM

nova92 Since: Apr, 2020
#329997: Sep 30th 2020 at 4:46:04 AM

AP News: Wisconsin might purge 130K people from voter rolls

The Wisconsin Supreme Court weighed Tuesday whether to go along with conservatives who argue that 130,000 voters should be removed from the rolls in the hotly contested presidential battleground state, while the Democratic attorney general defended not purging them.

Similar lawsuits are pending or have recently been resolved all over the country, in Georgia (court dismissed case), Pennsylvania (case on hold until after election), Michigan (pending)

Edited by nova92 on Sep 30th 2020 at 4:52:13 AM

Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
#329998: Sep 30th 2020 at 4:50:15 AM

Has the requested purge been audited to make sure it's not GOP suppression?

"Yup. That tasted purple."
nova92 Since: Apr, 2020
#329999: Sep 30th 2020 at 4:54:36 AM

Given

However, the lawsuit was unlikely to be resolved by the state Supreme Court before the Nov. 3 election just five weeks away.


Wisconsin Institute for Law and Liberty, a conservative law firm


The [state elections] commission wanted to wait until after the presidential election before removing anyone because of inaccuracies found while previously attempting to identify voters who may have moved.


Because voters who moved were concentrated in more Democratic areas of the state, liberals argued that the lawsuit was meant to lower turnout on their side.


Removals or proposed removals, especially this close to an election, can be confusing and intimidating for voters and frequently aren’t based on reliable information.

It sounds like intimidation tactics more than anything else.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#330000: Sep 30th 2020 at 5:07:54 AM

I mean it's obviously voter suppression; the only question is whether the court will let them get away with it.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

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