Nov 2023 Mod notice:
There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines
before posting here.
Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.
If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules
when posting here.
In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
Random factoid but Native American spiritual systems are particularly irritated about this as was explained to me. As one teacher shared, "This is the religion for the Odawa and not for anyone outside the tribe. It's not to be shared and it can't be practiced by anyone else. That's not how it works."
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.You can't expect everyone to fully educate themselves. The lay person sees each group as represented by its most vocal or extreme elements. This is why atheism's most visible public figures are folks like Richard Dawkins and Bill Maher (never mind Stalinist Russia and the CCP), while Jewish extremism is seen as backing the conservative Israeli government's hardline approach to Palestine, Muslim's extremists are known for blowing up schools, Hindu extremists are known for murdering Muslims, Christian extremists are known for ... well, many many things.
Making excuses for one's own team is only human nature.
Edited by Fighteer on Sep 26th 2020 at 12:19:49 PM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"A lot of religions in the world, the nonmonotheists in the world, also have no issue mixing and matching into an Interfaith Smoothie.
Prior to current governments, China especially just let you practice whatever elements you wanted.
A little buddhism, a little Taoism, some philosophies or two.
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.CNN: Progressive activists are wary over criminal justice under a Biden-Harris administration
Key passages:
In a series of interviews this summer, organizers told CNN their angst over the records of Biden, who wrote the 1994 crime bill, and Harris, a former prosecutor, along with the pair's outwardly supportive rhetoric for law enforcement, fuels their concerns about the future. And while Biden choosing Harris, a daughter of Indian and Jamaican immigrants, was in part a nod to influential Black women who wanted to see a reflection of themselves — Black and highly qualified— in the highest office in the land, the young activists said representation alone is not enough.
After a wide open primary that showcased the diversity of the Democratic Party, it ended with the nomination of the 78-year-old Biden, a moderate whose 1994 bill is often cited as one driver of mass incarceration, in part because of the "three strikes" law that ensured mandatory life terms for defendants with at least three federal violent crime or drug convictions.
The lack of enthusiasm for Biden and Harris points to deeper concerns over their ability to unite the party absent what many perceive as an existential threat posed by four more years of Trump. Demonstrators on the front line of a wildly invigorated social justice movement see movable objects in Biden and Harris, where the current administration looms like a stone wall blocking their push for change.
Neither Biden nor Harris support defunding the police, contrary to Trump's insistence otherwise. Biden has voiced support for conditioning federal aid to police based on behavior and Justice Department intervention against departments who violate civil rights standards. Harris has often said the US needs to "reimagine" public safety and how the police and the communities they serve interact but has said violent crime should stay the remit of trained officers.
And during her primary campaign, Harris released a plan that sought to end mandatory minimum sentences on the federal level, legalize marijuana, end the death penalty, and end the use of private prisons— a far cry from the policies she once enforced as California's attorney general and the district attorney for San Francisco, positions that led to her being labeled a "cop" by young Black activists.
Organizers have highlighted Biden's stance that "not all cops are bad cops" as part of their critique that the ticket has not engaged in enough "deep listening" from those who are victimized by the police. It is evidence, they say, that Biden and Harris are more concerned with pushing back on attacks from Trump and the GOP than representing their movement's priorities.
"It's very clear that what they're saying is completely opposite of what the movement is saying right now," Lane said.
"I would like to see them not talk down on the movement. Instead of making it seem outrageous, actually challenge themselves to listen and adopt them on a federal level to really gain confidence of the people," Lane said.
One rather irritating line of thought that I've seen coming from some leftist quadrants, especially in the mid-2010s was that not just New Atheism but atheism in general was inherently anti-woman and anti-POC, and for a multitude of different reasons each time. For some it's because faith is a huge source of empowerment for black women, for others it's that religion is a source of morality that white men lack, and for others it's that religion and its associated folklore was a rich source of culture that white cishet men were too uncouth to appreciate. Also saw a lot of anti-intellectualist undertones at times, usually a mixture of Measuring the Marigolds and Romanticism Versus Enlightenment mindsets.
Personally I found it quite uncomfortable as while the older generations of my family are Shenist, my brother and I were raised to be nonbelievers by our atheist parents who found little reason to believe. And Chinese culture as a whole is not super invested in ideas of faith and sincerity of belief (in fact some of these superstitions can become quite inconvenient when interacting with those who believe too heavily in it, like people who lead their lives in strict accordance with feng shui). Though it's not unlikely Maoist China had something to do with my parents' lack of belief, the idea that POC are inherently more religious than "white" people and this is a good thing strikes me as hopelessly myopic, and a bit of a backhanded insult.
Edited by AlleyOop on Sep 27th 2020 at 4:47:33 AM
It's probably best to wait and see on that front. In a normal transition, we'd be looking at the nominee for Attorney General as a clue as to how the incoming administration is going to deal with issues such as these. So no reason why we can't do the same here.
I know that Doug Jones has been suggested in the past, on the likely assumption he doesn't retain his seat in the Senate. Someone who has prosecuted the Klan has probably got his priorities in order. Is there anyone else though that should be considered?
About the Muhammad naming convention, this is a very popular name among Muslims, and Western countries after WWII encouraged migrant workers from places like Turkey and Morocco, which are majority Muslim countries. This is why you see a sudden surge in Muslim and African/Arabic names in Europe: many of those migrant workers decided to stay and have families, and are now often in their third or fourth generation.
Christians have similar naming conventions, really, it's just that they are less notable to us because these names have been so normalized. Who thinks of Peter or Paul as Biblical names these days?
Also, the "Muslims live in deserts" thing is probably mostly because that's where we tend to see them the most in the news and movies. Many people simply equate Muslim with Arabic, and Arabia with desert. This happens for all groups from the perspective of people living far from those groups and regions, it's not just Muslims.
Edited by Redmess on Sep 27th 2020 at 2:42:41 PM
Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
I'm reminded of an image I saw of somebody named Christian accusing muslim parents of "forcing" their religion onto their children, in response to seeing a soccer player named Islam. Cue people telling the guy to look at his own name...
Edited by Kardavnil on Sep 27th 2020 at 6:46:08 AM
Roll a Constitution saving throw to make it through the year.I kind of want Feinstein's seat to go to Katie Porter. She's such a skilled legislator and interrogator that it would be a crying shame if she was voted out in 2022 simply because her district reverts back to type without Donald Trump on the ballot to depress the Republican vote in California.
But hey, that's what primaries are for. Let them run in 2022 and may the best person win.
I am agnostic, but I think the new atheist movement has discredited itself when several new atheists became alt right.
Guys like Carl Benjamin are pretty instrumental in making the atheist movement look bad:
I also think Sam Harris has repeated some alt right talking points:
I think some new atheists have broken towards the left recently, but so many new atheists becoming alt right has damaged the movement.
If you disbelief in God, but replace God with anti feminism and racist pseudoscience, you are not replacing religion with a good moral code.
Now there are left atheists who belief in replacing God with community and fellowship to help the poor and defeat structural racism, those are the atheists I can respect.
Really being an atheist makes one no better or worse than anyone else, I have no problem with people who use religion to promote goals like helping the poor, there are good and bad atheists, there are good and bad religions people.
I shared a story of a former Christian fundamentalist girl who became an atheist and "actively atheist" because she assumed that it was a conflict between retrograde superstition, patriarchy, and toxic masculinity versus utopian Star Trek values of tolerance as well as progression.
This irritated me but I wouldn't wish what happened to her on anyone as she then attended a convention and was immediately overwhelmed with incredibly racist Bill Maher-esque speakers who said the Middle East should be carpet bombed to get rid of the subhumans, that sexism was genetically how we evolved, and constant sexual harassment.
As I said, "Whether you believe in God or not has no bearing on whether you're an asshole."
She ended up Wiccan. I'm not sure how serious she is about her beliefs but it's a community she loves.
This is relavent to US politics because the larger issues of sexism, racism and so on are built deeply into the social structure of the United States. Religion is just a disguise for the desire to protect the privilege of white male assholes.
This statement saddens me.
Edited by CharlesPhipps on Sep 27th 2020 at 8:43:16 AM
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson has officially endorsed Biden for president:
https://people.com/politics/dwayne-johnson-endorses-joe-biden-kamala-harris/
This may not seem like a big deal, but with Johnson being as influential as he is, he could very well get a lot of people to vote who otherwise might not have.
Bonus points for being a (former) Republican.
Edited by MrHellboy on Sep 27th 2020 at 10:56:47 AM
The hardest thing in this world is to live in it.![]()
I wouldn't willingly associate with that kind of atheist any more than I would a racist or misogynist person of faith.
I'm an atheist and a woman and culturally/ethnically Jewish, why would I associate with someone who insults me simply for being who I am?
What makes me sad is if someone thinks that's all atheists. It's obviously not.
And I do take the 'treat other people as you would be treated' seriously, which means respecting people's faith and/or lack of faith where it's not infringing on anyone else's rights.

Ah, the people who insist they're more educated or whatever and blatantly haven't taken the time to learn about the very thing they're being pushy about. And as ever making it more annoying because it's something people generally hold quite deeply.
Because most religions do not have a proselytising bent. And some denominations within religions are much pushier about it than others.