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Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#325376: Aug 29th 2020 at 11:38:14 AM

There is a fair amount of research on the effects that term limits have on politics. I believe 10.3162/036298006X201742 is the one that discusses most of the points folks here are concerned about.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#325377: Aug 29th 2020 at 11:43:38 AM

Term limits on legislators were adopted in 21 states during the early 1990s. Beginning in 1996, the limits legally barred incumbents from reelection in 11 states, and they will do so in four more by 2010. In 2002, we conducted the only survey of legislators in all 50 states aimed at assessing the impact of term limits on state legislative representation. We found that term limits have virtually no effect on the types of people elected to office—whether measured by a range of demographic characteristics or by ideological predisposition—but they do have measurable impact on certain behaviors and priorities reported by legislators in the survey, and on the balance of power among various institutional actors in the arena of state politics. We characterize the biggest impact on behavior and priorities as a “Burkean shift,” whereby term‐limited legislators become less beholden to the constituents in their geographical districts and more attentive to other concerns. The reform also increases the power of the executive branch (governors and the bureaucracy) over legislative outcomes and weakens the influence of majority party leaders and committee chairs, albeit for different reasons.

The Abstract, but you'll need some sort of journal access to read it.

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#325378: Aug 29th 2020 at 11:52:10 AM

There are some conservatives, but I think most actual republicans don't come here any more.

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
ElSquibbonator Since: Oct, 2014
#325379: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:03:14 PM

Also, I remember in 2016 The New York Times web site had their own updating predictions of who would win the Presidential election. But they don't seem to have it this year. What happened to it?

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#325380: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:03:27 PM

I think it's a little too late to do that.

What? No, there are still free elections ergo we can still get them out of government. In 2018 taking the House allowed Democrats to stop their legislative agenda, in 2020 taking the Senate and Presidency could allow us to stop their appointment of judges and implement our own agenda.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#325381: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:03:56 PM

Des Moines Register: a judge bas granted Trump campaign's request to block absentee ballot requests in Linn County, Iowa after the county commissioner went and prefilled the ballot requests.

[up][up][up] It's because most Republicans that come on here are Trumpsters and will get banned because their ideals and posts don't match forum rules.

Edited by tclittle on Aug 29th 2020 at 2:08:14 PM

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#325382: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:19:44 PM

Technically, I am a registered Republican, but that's just a registration.

Leviticus 19:34
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#325383: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:27:11 PM

[up] I assume they meant "people who actually believe in whatever the heck that party stands for". :/

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#325384: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:52:14 PM

[up] I'm pretty positive anyone who believes in what the Modern Republican Party stands for are banned from the Forums, especially the Political ones.

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#325385: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:57:09 PM

[up]Well, only if they express it. Someone who keeps their true beliefs to themselves could function just fine if they stayed in other sub-forums.

They could theoretically post here too but in practice, it would require 1) incredible amounts of discipline to avoid letting the mask slip and 2) the inclination to post amongst people who hate your beliefs and believe things that you hate. Obviously neither is individually likely and together it becomes incredibly implausible.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#325386: Aug 29th 2020 at 12:57:56 PM

Banned on hate speech and disinformation grounds at the very least. We have conservative tropers on this site, and some of them hang out on the forums, but committed Republicans are getting rarer and rarer in OTC.

It would be nice to have an actual political debate again, but that's impossible if the participants aren't all debating in good faith.

Edited by Fighteer on Aug 29th 2020 at 3:59:41 PM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#325387: Aug 29th 2020 at 1:17:07 PM

That's increasingly become the problem; I don't think anyone actually wants things to be divisive and ugly all the time, but if a portion of the electorate is becoming increasingly supportive of authoritarianism and other ugly policies, you can't really have a civil debate or polite disagreement.

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#325388: Aug 29th 2020 at 1:30:05 PM

Yeah, when your party is increasingly mired in hate speech and disinformation, it becomes impossible to have a good faith debate.

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
ElSquibbonator Since: Oct, 2014
#325389: Aug 29th 2020 at 1:40:36 PM

It's a shame, honestly. The last thing I want is for the forum to become an echo chamber.

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#325390: Aug 29th 2020 at 1:50:04 PM

Oh there’s no risk of that, just because OTC lacks US party support variance doesn’t mean it lacks political ideology variance.

We’ve got conservatives, centrists, liberals, technocrats/robotists, progressives, democratic-socialists and even a smattering of people who at least in part subscribe to old school Socialism, Anarchism or similar.

I remember when we had rather strongly opinionated anarchism who felt all police should be shot, they ended up banned rather obviously for advocating violence.

Edited by Silasw on Aug 29th 2020 at 8:53:04 AM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Resileafs I actually wanted to be Resileaf Since: Jan, 2019
I actually wanted to be Resileaf
#325391: Aug 29th 2020 at 1:51:03 PM

Also people from all around the world to give other countries' perspective on things.

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#325392: Aug 29th 2020 at 1:51:42 PM

I used to go to a forum with much looser rules and it was like 70% new posts and threads with pro Trump memes with bogus statistics, "arguments" that consisted of nothing more than links to far right websites, and calling the Democrat of the day a pedophile.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#325393: Aug 29th 2020 at 1:53:21 PM

I don't think there is a single person in this forum who would purely vote Democrat no matter what out of tribalism.

If the candidates were, lets say, Bill Weld for the Republican side and Tulsi Gabbard for the Democrats, I wager most people would (rightfully) vote Republican.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#325394: Aug 29th 2020 at 2:20:26 PM

[up][up] Those have been infiltrated by the alt-right cult due to lax rules, I strongly suggest staying away from there. The Alt Right Playbook has an episode on such forums.

The sad thing is, the alt righ knows how to infiltrate forums and fandoms with loose rules and radicalize their users. In that regard, we should be very glad they don't get a foothold here.

[up] Well, obviously as someone from a country with a coalition system, I would not be inclined to always vote for the same party every time anyway. The US has a rather unique situation in that regard.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 29th 2020 at 11:21:39 AM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#325395: Aug 29th 2020 at 2:27:03 PM

[up] Because even if your party isn't the majority it could still be part of the coalition that makes up the majority that becomes Government?

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#325396: Aug 29th 2020 at 2:50:56 PM

Exactly. Even a second party can have considerable influence, and there is often room for a third coalition partner as well.

And even small parties have considerable power, because their support of the coalition can make the difference for getting a vote through. Even a party with two seats can be an important voice this way.

This is in my opinion much more democratic than a two party system, especially one as polarized as the US has now.

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#325397: Aug 29th 2020 at 2:53:40 PM

In a coalition government, your party allies with other parties and they agree upon an agenda that still might not be what you voted for, so it's only a step away from a two-party system. My feeling about a coalition or parliamentary system is that it makes voters less likely to vote for realistic, achievable goals.

If there's a party that wants to steal the Moon cheese and feed the poor with it, they'll get votes, which end up being useless since either they won't participate in government or they'll throw in with a coalition that won't get them any Moon cheese anyway.

In the U.K., we've seen how the division of left-wing interests among Labour, Green, Lib Dem, and so on creates tepid, ineffectual opposition to a conservative majority.

I'm not saying that the U.S. system is better, but offering a multi-party system as "inherently superior" fails to pass the smell test.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#325398: Aug 29th 2020 at 2:55:02 PM

Doesn't the UK also have at least one party so dedicated to not participating in the Government that they never even claim their seats once elected?

RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#325399: Aug 29th 2020 at 2:56:50 PM

The UK's still a first-past-the-post system, which is what undermines having multiple parties.

And yes, Sinn Fein refuses to take seats when elected, because that would mean swearing allegiance to the Queen. Which, obviously, they are against.

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#325400: Aug 29th 2020 at 3:00:16 PM

Even with fewer conservatives on this forum, it's hardly any echo chamber. Just bring up Bernie Sanders. tongue

Do not obey in advance.

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