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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#324276: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:22:01 AM

They're so desperate for speakers they'll invite anyone who might even remotely support the Republican party,I'm half expecting a certain rapper to show up there

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#324277: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:24:25 AM

[up][up]Oh come on. Nobody here's doubting that Trump and the GOP are trying to rig things in their favor. Nobody here thinks the GOP will play fair.

We just think talking about coups is unproductive and kind of pointless.

We've had this discussion before, Redmess. I don't see why you feel the need to repeat yourself.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#324278: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:24:25 AM

Nobody is pretending it isn’t happening, you change the conversation substantially when you move from the things he is currently doing (messing with the post office, messing with polling stations, court challenges to Vote-by-Mail laws, etc...) to things we have yet to see evidence of him doing (organising armed groups to keep him in power by force should he loose).

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324279: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:29:39 AM

If he succeeds in stealing the election through election interference, though, wouldn't that effectively be a coup?

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#324280: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:31:07 AM

Speaking for myself here, but @ Redmess, what I found annoying about the Trump coup discussion (and honestly a lot of your discussion about Trump) is because while I'm not sure if this is your intent, but it comes off as if you think that Trump is an Evil Genius and have contempt for his opponents.

TitanJump Since: Sep, 2013 Relationship Status: Singularity
#324281: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:31:35 AM

[up][up] No.

It wouldn't.

Edited by TitanJump on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:31:42 PM

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#324282: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:31:35 AM

No, a coup doesn’t involve elections at all. It’s not a coup every time a dictator wins a rigged election, only if they overthrow an existing government or use force to prevent a new one taking power.

All coups are illegitimate seizures/retentions of power, but not all illegitimate seizures/retentions of power are coups.

Edited by Silasw on Aug 18th 2020 at 3:33:31 PM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324283: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:35:58 AM

I don't think he is an evil genius, but I do think people are underestimating him. He is perfectly capable of conspiracy and plotting when it suits his interests. He's been doing it all his life. Despite all the cracks about him being a toddler and such, he is not actually incapable.

[up] Alright, then we should use that instead. Hence why I wanted to move away from that word.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:36:45 PM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#324284: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:36:55 AM

Well, that doesn't exactly go against my broader impression that the tone of your posts is "look at how Trump outplayed those pathetic Democrats".

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324285: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:37:50 AM

That is not at all what I was going for, no.

I'm not sure where you are getting that from.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:38:12 PM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#324286: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:39:33 AM

The point being made, I think, is that whatever you say you intend, that's not how it's coming off to the people you're communicating to.

Edited by sgamer82 on Aug 18th 2020 at 8:40:08 AM

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324287: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:40:49 AM

Damn autism. Sorry guys.

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
SpookyMask Since: Jan, 2011
#324288: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:49:48 AM

I for first time started reading youtube comments on biden vs trump thing and umm.

Yeah, I have headache now, I can't really get how so many people think that Biden is literally as bad as Trump or how moderate policies are so much worse than Trump's policies.

Like I can get the idea of principle of "lesser of two evils" being bad but umm. This is reality not a principle

Edited by SpookyMask on Aug 18th 2020 at 6:51:22 PM

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#324289: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:50:30 AM

I don't think he is an evil genius, but I do think people are underestimating him. He is perfectly capable of conspiracy and plotting when it suits his interests. He's been doing it all his life. Despite all the cracks about him being a toddler and such, he is not actually incapable.

Trump couldn't outplay a Ventriloquist Dummy at shouting if he also had a hand jammed up his ass.

I doubt he ties his own shoes every morning and not because of health issues.

He's not clever. He's never been. His inherited legal team is somewhere between clever and just familiar with the game they play. But his history is plagued with failure and falling back to the one thing that defined him: inherited real estate.

Trump is not the cause, he is not the name that will prop up. Fellow republicans will ditch him faster than Ted Cruz' memory of Trump insulting his wife the second he is untenable. Trump is a symptom of a political and cultural system that's been pushed for decades in the United States.

If anyone is clever and dangerous, that'd be Mitch. Not Trump.

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324290: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:51:08 AM

[up][up] We keep warning you that you shouldn't, and yet you keep reading 'em.

[up] He seemed perfectly capable of orchestrating that phone call with Ukraine, though. He clearly did not need any help with that.

This is exactly what I mean with underestimating him. He is not as dumb as your memes make him out to be.

I know it is very tempting to paint someone you hate as too dumb to live and brainless, but that does not make it true.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:54:12 PM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#324291: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:54:21 AM

Like I can get the idea of principle of "lesser of two evils" being bad but umm. This is reality not a principle

As long as their answer to that is to tacitly support the worst possible option, their argument's got zero value.

Edited by DrunkenNordmann on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:54:17 PM

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324292: Aug 18th 2020 at 8:55:02 AM

Where did that quote come from, and who is saying it?

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324293: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:03:02 AM

Okay, lets put aside all the hyperbolic jokes and memes about Trump's intelligence, and ask it this way:

What proof do you have that Trump is incapable of plotting a conspiracy to rig the election and steal the presidency? That he is not intelligent enough to actually commit these political crimes?

Edited by Redmess on Aug 18th 2020 at 6:04:51 PM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
SpookyMask Since: Jan, 2011
#324294: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:04:03 AM

My general problem is that I should stop reading comments altogether, but instead I check them out but on different topic each time tongue

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324295: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:05:47 AM

Yes, the TV Tropes forum will ruin your life, just as surely as the main site will.

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#324296: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:06:52 AM

He is not as dumb as your memes make him out to be.

Pretty sure he is.

You're constantly conflating survival instincts and nastiness with intelligence.

Edited by RainehDaze on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:07:21 PM

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#324297: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:08:55 AM

With things like tampering with the Post Office or for that matter his calls to Ukraine, it's less that Trump is clever than that he's doing things that are illegal and/or not easy to counter, because the system isn't made to handle a President that doesn't give a shit.

And more to the point, even with the above, none of those things actions would be at all successful if (Congressional) Republicans cared.

Like yes, there is something to the idea that Trump openly stating corrupt/criminal intent makes him seem less culpable, but I wouldn't rule out the idea that Trump is an idiot who keeps making an Accidental Public Confession of wrongdoing and is only still President because Republicans don't care.

Edited by Hodor2 on Aug 18th 2020 at 11:10:53 AM

Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324298: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:09:14 AM

[up][up] Do you seriously think the man is too dumb to tie his shoelaces?

[up] The point is that he has the intellectual capacity to commit that fraud, and to play into the indifference of congress, indeed, to change the system to the point where they will let him do whatever he wants.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 18th 2020 at 6:11:28 PM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#324299: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:10:06 AM

He seemed perfectly capable of orchestrating that phone call with Ukraine, though. He clearly did not need any help with that.

I am sorry, but if you think clever that taking advantage of a routine phone call (it is routine for the President of the U.S to call recently elected presidents of other nations, and for them to receive those calls) and tell him, and I quote:

"The other thing, there's a lot of talk about Biden's son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it...It sounds horrible to me"

That...if you think it is clever, or smart to say that during a forcibly legally transcriped diplomatic phone call then you and I are operating under incredibly distinct and irreconciliable definitions of "cleverness". He was not eloquent, he was not direct, he was just straightforwardly corrupt there's nothing clever or thoughtful about that.

Edited by Aszur on Aug 18th 2020 at 10:12:11 PM

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#324300: Aug 18th 2020 at 9:13:04 AM

I'm not sure if that is a sign of lack of intelligence or just sheer arrogance. The man does think he can get away with murder, after all, quite literally.

And no, he is obviously not a genius about it, but he still managed to get away with it because he controls the senate so completely.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 18th 2020 at 6:14:53 PM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times

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