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tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#323876: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:35:32 PM

Politco did an article on Obama and Biden's relationship in regards on how Obama was not encouraging either in a 2016 run or a 2020 run.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#323877: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:37:15 PM

Also, if Obama didn't bomb the guy, but he managed to get away and still planned an attack, the GOP would then cry that Obama should have done something? Legal obscurity be damned.

I don't think Republicans are the ones that care about it. Generally, it's a left-wing criticism.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#323878: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:41:49 PM

You say that like it's relevant.

The GOP jumped on anything Obama did.

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#323879: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:43:20 PM

Tan suit!??!?!!

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#323880: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:45:44 PM

[up][up] The point is that this is mainly a Democratic talking point.

[up] I'd file that more under Fox grasping at straws to create scandal around Obama, rather than criticize his actual political actions.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 14th 2020 at 9:47:59 PM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#323881: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:48:09 PM

The US shot citizens in the US Civil War. They were killed taking up arms against the US thenand WW 2. I do not care a terrorist like Anwar al-Awlaki was shot after waging war on the US, regardless if he had a passport.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#323882: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:49:00 PM

[up][up]I repeat.

You say that like it's relevant.
The GOP doesn't care whose talking point it is, if it's something they can use to bash a Democrat.

Edited by sgamer82 on Aug 14th 2020 at 12:50:46 PM

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#323883: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:56:22 PM

There is plenty of things to raise an eyebrow at the U.S at about them bombing foreign lands and why in the first place without even getting into the details of who they bombed, really.

P.S: Bombing is bad.

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#323884: Aug 14th 2020 at 12:56:35 PM

I'm not really familiar enough with the case or US law to say anything more on it.

And anyway, that wasn't the main point of the article. The main point is that the DOJ is being blatantly corrupt about accepting bribes from Michael Flynn, and the judge can't even do anything about it according to the law.

And given the tone of the article, the claim that this is some Republican talking point seems rather unwarranted.

Edited by Redmess on Aug 14th 2020 at 10:13:00 AM

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#323885: Aug 14th 2020 at 1:46:54 PM

I'm of the opinion the US decimating the leadership of Al-Qaeda with targeted strikes wasn't that bad honestly.

NickTheSwing Since: Aug, 2009
#323886: Aug 14th 2020 at 1:47:18 PM

@ Anwar Al-Awlaki Bombing: I'm of the opinion that terrorists who go ahead and plan and conduct terrorist attacks, support those terrorist groups, and such, should lose their citizenship rights.

This includes those like militia groups and far right wing loonies. If it was me, I would've declared the militia that occupied that one building a few years back were no longer citizens, followed by dronestriking them to a pulp.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#323887: Aug 14th 2020 at 1:50:48 PM

Yeah,you see the thing is,the group your talking about were Americans on American soil and droning striking them would have looked really really abd politically,and also they were trying to minimise the loss of life (as i recall only one person died)

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
megarockman from The Sixth Borough (Experienced Trainee)
#323888: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:03:08 PM

There's also the issue that US citizenship basically cannot be lost involuntary by Supreme Court decision — Afroyim v. Rusk.

The damned queen and the relentless knight.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#323890: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:12:20 PM

I have a different idea for what to do with American terrorists.

...

Arrest them, try them, and sentence them to life imprisonment for murder.

Stripping citizenship is a bad decision because it is a short skip to doing for any convicted felon.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#323891: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:17:06 PM

And when they're in a country where they cannot be extradited?

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Redmess Redmess from Netherlands Since: Feb, 2014
Redmess
#323894: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:46:42 PM

Stripping criminals of citizenship so you can kill them without due process is a very bad idea. Labelling them terrorists as a way to justify murdering them in a war situation is also a slippery slope situation.

You can't just take away someone's rights so you can kill them unopposed. That's what we have human rights for. That's what we have due process for.

As for Flynn, now that he has had his case thrown out through bribery, is it possible for Biden to reopen the case if he becomes president? After all, if the executive branch has absolute authority to throw out any case it likes, does it not have the power to reopen them as well?

Hope shines brightest in the darkest times
Imca (Veteran)
#323895: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:49:41 PM

Personally I would argue the difference here is the presence in a warzone, if they were sitting around on homeland soil arrest them and try them... but once you step forward into a warzone things are different.

If some one in the military decided to change sides and start shooting on there former allies, would they not be considered a valid target just because they had citizenship? The same thing kind of applies.

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#323896: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:51:41 PM

I suspect so, if nothing else his crime was lying to cover up other crimes, so the FBI can just interview him again and he’ll be in the same position, lie and commit a new offence of lying to the FBI, say nothing and get charged with obstructing an investigation, or tell the truth and get charged for his main crimes.

As for the US nationals becoming terrorists thing, I have no problem with shooting at enemy combatants who happen to be US nationals, but then you have to treat them as enemy combatants when you capture them (so no torture).

The citizenship striping is done so they can be killed without granting them and their allies their due protections under the rules of war, that’s what’s wrong, the loopholing of the Geneva convention, not the killing of terrorists.

Edited by Silasw on Aug 14th 2020 at 9:54:40 AM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#323897: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:56:12 PM

As for Flynn, now that he has had his case thrown out through bribery, is it possible for Biden to reopen the case if he becomes president? After all, if the executive branch has absolute authority to throw out any case it likes, does it not have the power to reopen them as well?

A US Citizen can't be charged twice for the same crime unless new Evidence comes that shows he would be the guilty one. The problem here is that this case of lying to the FBI is being actively dropped, so it can't just be restarted afterwards, and I can't think of any way to find new evidence to get him in trouble again. So if he either keeps his mouth shut or tells the truth, he can't be arrested over this again, and I see no reason why Flynn would ever want to talk to the FBI ever again after this so he can't get in trouble for telling a new lie.

For all intents and purposes, he's guilty but free.

Edited by DingoWalley1 on Aug 14th 2020 at 5:56:57 AM

Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#323898: Aug 14th 2020 at 2:58:39 PM

[up]Don't worry: there's plenty else he hasn't been charged with and tried for, but which evidence has since brought to light...

This goes for everybody around Trump.

Edited by Euodiachloris on Aug 14th 2020 at 3:12:18 AM

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#323899: Aug 14th 2020 at 3:01:51 PM

I see no reason why Flynn would ever want to talk to the FBI ever again

Being interviewed by the FBI isn’t generally something you can opt out of because you don’t want to do it.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
megarockman from The Sixth Borough (Experienced Trainee)
#323900: Aug 14th 2020 at 3:10:57 PM

Think they meant invoking the 5th all the time going forward.

The damned queen and the relentless knight.

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