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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#290876: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:07:58 PM

[up]Which is the big problem with everything regarding Trump: it seems so ridiculously absurd, and violates any sense of how the "real world" should work that people have trouble accepting that it could be true.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#290877: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:16:15 PM

One thing I've learned is that the real world rarely ever works the way it "should" work. Reality doesn't have to follow narrative conventions — it just happens.

Edited by M84 on Sep 24th 2019 at 10:18:03 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#290878: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:18:19 PM

Even then, while still ridiculous, if you look at historical precedent you can see people like Trump have gotten to power multiple times before. He's not exactly unprecedented.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#290879: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:21:03 PM

I've also learned that a lot of people apparently don't pay attention in history classes much, or had really shitty history classes. Learn from it, or risk repeating it.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#290880: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:22:44 PM

Well, to be fair, with Trump it's not so much the world not following narrative conventions, so much as following them a little too well. Basically, it sounds like a poorly-written plot to some sort of cynical political comedy.

Leviticus 19:34
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#290881: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:29:25 PM

Yeah, Trump winning sound like poorly though comedy satire and the man itself as 90 cartoon.

Also I disagree in a way, history dosent follow narrative convention but sure as hell it make it.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#290882: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:32:43 PM

What happens is that we view history through a narrative in order to help us better make sense of it. It's because we're kind of natural storytellers. We see stories and symbolism in damn near anything.

Edited by M84 on Sep 24th 2019 at 10:34:23 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#290883: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:55:40 PM

Or stories are made of our understanding of the world.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#290884: Sep 24th 2019 at 7:58:52 PM

If that were the case stories would match reality a lot more. Instead, we have sayings about how reality doesn't make "sense" unlike fiction.

Disgusted, but not surprised
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#290885: Sep 24th 2019 at 8:37:34 PM

[up]Even history dosent make sense, that is why we are writing stuff over and over and over, history are in part kinda fiction, just more boring.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#290886: Sep 24th 2019 at 8:39:44 PM

The thing about history classes is nobody really cares about history. They just memorize what they need to to pass and forget it as soon as they don't need it anymore.

i'm tired, my friend
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#290887: Sep 24th 2019 at 9:14:55 PM

I remenber what a book of history said "the issue with telling history is like making your travel equiment for a travel: you always think what you bring with you and what to left out" which is the same principle of stories: depending of what we want to know, other details become pointless

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#290888: Sep 24th 2019 at 9:15:30 PM

[up][up] What a lot of people don’t get, is that the past defines our present in very real and quantifiable ways.

Being able to rattle off dates, names, events, etc doesn’t actually mean anything, unless you also have an understanding why it is relevant, and how it gives you a better understanding of the world today.

Edited by megaeliz on Sep 24th 2019 at 12:18:30 PM

PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#290889: Sep 24th 2019 at 9:29:05 PM

[up]Even that would be more stuff to memorize for a test and nothing more.

The core of the problem is that most people just don't give a shit about what happened 40-50 years ago.

i'm tired, my friend
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#290890: Sep 25th 2019 at 1:53:41 AM

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/tulsi-gabbard-is-the-12th-candidate-to-make-octobers-democratic-debate/amp/

Gabbard has qualified for the October debate after two state polls put her above 2% this week.

This means the next debate is up to 12 participants, meaning a split is likely. Frankly, they should be splitting the top and bottom 6, rather than doing it randomly.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#290891: Sep 25th 2019 at 2:01:42 AM

Ugh...at least Williamson didn't make the cut. Again.

I know it'd be too much to hope that this is what makes her finally take a fucking hint and drop out already...but dammit I really, really wish she would drop out.

Edited by M84 on Sep 25th 2019 at 5:02:13 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#290892: Sep 25th 2019 at 5:32:26 AM

Biden nosedives in early-state polls – Recent surveys show the former veep’s leads have vanished in Iowa and New Hampshire, while his South Carolina firewall shows signs of cracking.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/09/25/biden-iowa-new-hampshire-polls2020-1510351

Joe Biden’s poll numbers are crumbling in the early nominating states that matter most.

Once the dominant front-runner in the Democratic primary, Biden is now marginally trailing Elizabeth Warren in the first caucus state of Iowa and the first primary state of New Hampshire. His South Carolina firewall shows signs of cracking and he's losing his once-overwhelming lead in Florida, according to a raft of recent polling

.....

The former vice president continues to lead most national polls. He’s run ahead of Trump in general election match-ups in every major poll conducted this year. But the downward trend in Biden’s primary election top-line numbers and favorability ratings — which began long before reports surfaced recently detailing how President Donald Trump pushed Ukraine to investigate old business ties involving the former vice president’s son — suggests several bruising months have taken a toll.

“Biden’s support was always soft. That’s the key,” said Patrick Murray, director of the Monmouth University Polling Institute. “Unlike some of the other candidates, Biden’s support isn’t as locked in. He doesn’t have that ‘it’ factor.”

The Biden campaign, which has bristled both at media coverage of the candidate and the attention paid to polls, would not comment for this article

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#290893: Sep 25th 2019 at 5:46:55 AM

I guess it's way too early to tell what effect if any this Ukraine business will have on polls.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#290894: Sep 25th 2019 at 6:16:12 AM

At this point in time I think if the Republicans want Trump impeached it's because they think Pence could win them the election and they have no hope of Trump winning

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
singularityshot Since: Dec, 2012
#290895: Sep 25th 2019 at 6:35:37 AM

Depends - it's Trumpism that needs to be discredited, and Pence I think is too tied to that for it to work.

However, rumour has it that Pompeo is cheesed off with this Ukraine scandal as it is a foreign policy issue (so his remit) but one he had no control over as Rudy ran it as his own private project.

So while I can't imagine the Republicans rallying round Pence as an alternative to Trump, I can imagine Pompeo defecting, using the power of the State Department to put the knife in and in doing so give the Republican party that clean break they would need to try and disavow everything to do with Trump. From that Pompeo could try and make himself the clear alternative to Trump, possibly by advocating some very hawkish foreign policy positions and making Trump's hesitations appear as weakness.

Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#290896: Sep 25th 2019 at 6:38:25 AM

Unfortunately, I think the impeachment proceedings will have the opposite effect. Even so called "moderate" voters don't know how impeachment works at all and will assume that if Trump isn't escorted kicking and screaming by security personnel then "Deh...it was all really a witch hunt! President Trump is right!"

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#290897: Sep 25th 2019 at 6:41:22 AM

<points to header>

We are not supposed to argue the pros and cons of impeachment. That impeachment is about to actually happen doesn't change that.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#290898: Sep 25th 2019 at 6:44:51 AM

I only intended to talk about the proceedings. Not the impeachment itself, but if it does qualify, then I apologize and won't press further.

Does any Democratic choice have a good lead over Biden?

speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#290899: Sep 25th 2019 at 6:48:55 AM

So the "big" story yesterday after the impeachment news broke was that the whistleblower's lawyer previously interned for Chuck Schumer... like, 20 years ago. Ooooh.

Related: ‘SHUT UP, MORON!’ Giuliani Erupts on Fox News Guest for Comments About His Ukraine Involvement aka: What a complete meltdown on national television looks like.

Edited by speedyboris on Sep 25th 2019 at 6:51:54 AM

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#290900: Sep 25th 2019 at 6:49:27 AM

Warren is steadily gaining, and has possible slight leads in a few early states. If you don't want Biden, root for her. Because Sanders is slipping, and everyone else is a long shot.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

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