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GoldenKaos Captain of the Dead City from Cirith Ungol Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Captain of the Dead City
#289976: Sep 13th 2019 at 8:39:46 AM

To position yourself as the voice of reason, you kinda need to prove the others aren't. By attacking them. tongue

It's a tactic anyway.

Edited by GoldenKaos on Sep 13th 2019 at 4:40:08 PM

"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."
MrHellboy The Shadow from A world of my own Since: Dec, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
The Shadow
#289977: Sep 13th 2019 at 9:35:15 AM

So is anyone aware of this whole #Boycott ABC thing?

Evidently, during the debate, they showed a Republican political ad that featured a picture of AOC being burned, along with messages about the "dangers of socialism" and whatnot.

Did anyone else see this? It's pretty bad

The hardest thing in this world is to live in it.
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#289978: Sep 13th 2019 at 10:01:42 AM

Which just goes to prove that someone needs to be reviewing the content of ads before letting them run on their channels. Like, I get taking ad money because revenue is revenue, but boy howdy maybe you should check to make sure they aren't burning someone in effigy/

ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#289979: Sep 13th 2019 at 10:09:58 AM

Apparently, it was run on an affiliate of ABC that's owned by Sinclair, so I don't think the matter was just not reviewing the ad content.

My musician page
speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#289980: Sep 13th 2019 at 10:11:25 AM

[up]x3 Yes, it was mentioned on the last page. A more effective/accurate boycott hashtag would not be directed at ABC but at Sinclair.

Edited by speedyboris on Sep 13th 2019 at 10:13:07 AM

NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#289981: Sep 13th 2019 at 10:12:12 AM

I'm unclear if ABC is even legally allowed to reject a political ad like that. There are rules around political advertising specifically intended to prevent channels from supporting one side over another.

Also, if the ad aired nationally, then it's not the fault of the specific affiliate hosting the debate. They only control their own airtime in their own market. A nationally aired ad has to come from the national ABC people.

Edited by NativeJovian on Sep 13th 2019 at 1:14:18 PM

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#289982: Sep 13th 2019 at 10:55:00 AM

What does AOC stand for? EDIT: Oh wait, I remember now, that's a person's initials.

Edited by Protagonist506 on Sep 13th 2019 at 10:57:26 AM

Leviticus 19:34
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#289983: Sep 13th 2019 at 10:55:39 AM

It's far from clear that the filibuster fear is "irrational and wrong". Evil Turtle did only bring a few bills forward when he had a trifecta - seemingly, in part, due to concerns about filibustering - and some of them failed due to filibusters. Since he's always considered the filibuster important to keep future liberal bills at bay, there is no indication that Republicans will kick him out and he's always held the line on keeping the filibuster for laws, I think there is a point to be made that this is the only line he won't cross.

It's absolutely irrational and wrong.

Fact: The filibuster will stop the next Democratic President from acheiving anything domestically for at least four years, if not longer.

Fact: Climate change is approaching and similar systemic issues need to be addressed lest they result in unimaginable human cost.

I understand why Senators would be leery of removing the filibuster, but that doesn't make it any less cowardly and wrong. We need to take extensive action to protect society and if they stop that then they're doing the Republicans job for them. This isn't about incrementalism vs revolution, it's about any kind of progress vs gridlock consuming years we don't have.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#289984: Sep 13th 2019 at 10:57:07 AM

The thing with the filibuster is that, frankly, what it's designed to do is not something that I consider especially desirable. Namely, it's designed to slow down the lawmaking process, something that ideally should be fast.

Leviticus 19:34
Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#289985: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:02:23 AM

The filibuster was never designed to do anything. Its not an actual rule, but a loophole created when the Senate debate rules were changed by Aaron Burr of all people.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#289986: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:06:02 AM

Ivanka tells donors she got her moral compass from her dad – Trump’s family and allies are getting personal with donors, dishing out morsels about life in the White House

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/09/13/ivanka-trump-donors-1488704

Immediate thought from just the headline: This Explains So Much.


Editing to add:

Appeals Court Revives Seth Rich Lawsuit Against Fox News – The network exploited the Democratic National Committee staffer's murder and spread false conspiracy theories.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/fox-news-seth-rich-lawsuit-murder-dnc_n_5d7ba5e4e4b077dcbd5ce8cc

An appeals court on Friday reinstated a lawsuit from the parents of slain Democratic National Committee staffer Seth Rich against Fox News, who exploited Rich’s 2016 murder and promulgated right-wing conspiracy theories about it.

Rich’s parents, Joel and Mary Rich, sued the network after it published unverified claims in 2017 that linked Rich to Democratic National Committee emails leaked by Wiki Leaks during the 2016 presidential election.

The lawsuit seeks damages for the “emotional distress” caused by the right-wing fixation on their son’s death.

A lower-court judge threw out the lawsuit last year, saying that the suit’s claims were not “sufficiently outrageous” and “fail to adequately allege essential elements of the causes of action asserted.”

But on Friday, a panel of federal appeals court judges in New York said the judge erred in dismissing the suit.

“The Riches’ complaint plausibly alleges enough facts to state a claim for intentional infliction of emotional distress — for extreme and outrageous conduct by [Fox News],” the judges wrote in their ruling. “We have no trouble concluding that — taking their allegations as true — the Riches plausibly alleged what amounted to a campaign of emotional torture.”

.....

Fox News responded to the lawsuit’s revival in a statement Friday:

The court’s ruling today permits Mr. and Mrs. Rich to proceed with discovery to determine whether there is a factual basis for their claims against FOX News. And while we extend the Rich family our deepest condolences for their loss, we believe that discovery will demonstrate that FOX News did not engage in conduct that will support the Riches’ claims. We will be evaluating our next legal steps.

Edited by sgamer82 on Sep 13th 2019 at 12:20:13 PM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#289987: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:06:53 AM

While I'm ambivalent on the filibuster issue, I don't think lawmaking should be swift. It should take as much time as needed. Making new laws is something that should take a lot of time and effort.

Disgusted, but not surprised
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#289988: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:18:08 AM

[up]But the lawmaking process already takes a damn long time, by its very nature.

The filbuster just clogs up the legal pipeline for little to no gain.

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#289989: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:23:07 AM

While I'm ambivalent on the filibuster issue, I don't think lawmaking should be swift. It should take as much time as needed. Making new laws is something that should take a lot of time and effort.

No one's saying that laws should be passed in a few days or something, rather the filibuster makes lawmaking absurdly slow and results in an inefficient and ossified institution.

Which is bad enough at the best of times but is absolutely disastrous when we're talking about 1) existential threats to our civilization and 2) one side of the political spectrum going absolutely insane and rejecting all compromise.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#289990: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:28:46 AM

My point is that lawmaking shouldn't be "fast", as Protagonist claimed.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#289991: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:34:14 AM

Considering the context it should be clear that fast is a relative term, I absolutely believe that the legislature should be efficient.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#289992: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:37:17 AM

And ideally, the lawmaking process should actually be able to, you know, make laws. Especially ones that might be contested more than "Kicking puppies is now illegal".

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M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#289993: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:38:24 AM

"Fast" and "efficient" are not the same thing. And while an efficient legislature is ideal, a fast one is not.

Disgusted, but not surprised
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#289994: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:39:20 AM

[up][up]Watch the lobbyists for hush puppies fight that one.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#289995: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:42:49 AM

The filibuster carries the weight, thanks in no small part to Mr. Smith Goes to Washington, of the cultural idea that an unjust law may be protested to exhaustion by a single, brave lawmaker and stopped with that noble sacrifice. It has become part of the American ethos of the value of the individual.

It occupies the same part of the emotional spectrum as John Wayne facing down the bandits at High Noon, of John McClane killing the terrorists while the police and FBI stand helpless, of Davy Crockett defending the Alamo. We all imagine ourselves as the hero, and the hero's job is to square off, all alone, against impossible odds and implacable forces, regardless of whether they win or lose.

One can argue about the value of this ethos — whether it has done more net harm or good in the long term — but it is indisputably there, and that's what you're going to run into if you try to kill the filibuster.

Edited by Fighteer on Sep 13th 2019 at 2:46:32 PM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#289996: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:43:54 AM

[up][up]Except fast is relative, a legislature that is capable of passing laws without a supermajority is fast in comparison to ours. But its speed shouldn't come at the expense of the quality of the legislation in question.

Frankly, I think we're arguing about semantics at this point.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#289997: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:44:56 AM

Semantics matter when you're talking about legislation.

Disgusted, but not surprised
ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#289998: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:49:50 AM

[up][up][up]There's just so much about the US legal system that would have been so much easier to stop before it started, thanks at least in part to some sort of stockholm syndrome that keeps the public from supporting a change for the better, isn't there? The filibuster, gun ownership, first past the post...

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M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#289999: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:53:30 AM

Let's not call it Stockholm Syndrome. It's simply the aversion to changing things that have been around for such a long time.

I for one don't consider myself a "prisoner" of the system in the USA.

Edited by M84 on Sep 14th 2019 at 2:55:23 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#290000: Sep 13th 2019 at 11:55:58 AM

Isn't that what Stockholm Syndrome is? I was not of the impression that considering yourself a captive is a requirement of Stockholm Syndrome.

Edited by ShinyCottonCandy on Sep 13th 2019 at 2:57:54 PM

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