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Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#286951: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:15:26 PM

Yeah, statistically you are way more likely to die in a car accident than in a terrorist attack.

The terrorist attack is still more frightening, because that is what it's supposed to do.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#286952: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:18:04 PM

Mind you, I've had 3 hostage situations and mass shootings in my immediate area so it's not something I causally dismiss either.

  • Someone shot up my local Kroger and an elderly black couple was killed after planning to massacre a black church - 30 minutes away
  • Up my street a guy took his family hostage until killed by SWAT.
  • A guy went into my University library and threatened the place with a gun before campus security tackled him. I was at the computers working on my homework.

Failed attacks, targeted shootings, and criminal acts/domestic violence may raise the numbers significantly.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#286953: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:25:19 PM

I have the utmost sympathy for you, but still, or rather exactly because of this, you shouldn't put all white males under scrutiny.

In fact, you being this afraid is exactly what they want. Terrorism thrives on fear. Don't give in to it.

I am a white male and I can absolutely see reason in being nervous around white men. Frankly, more people need to be; right now, being white and male is basically a blanket pass to be as shitty as you want without consequences. White men get immediate benefit of doubt from all authority figures everywhere.

We're living in a situation where white supremacy is considered a legitimate political stance, white rapists are given a slap on the wrist in the off-chance they're ever prosecuted, literal f*cking Nazis are making a comeback, and guns have more rights than human lives. Yes, it is okay for an LGBT woman to be afraid of white men. Not all bears are going to attack you, but that doesn't mean you should run over and hug them when you see one.

If someone offered you a six-pack of Coke and told you they spiked two of the cans with deadly, deadly poison, would you drink one? #NotAllCokeCans, sure, but also #EnoughToBeTooMany. I know it sucks to have to jump through extra hurdles socially because people fear you might be a dangerous criminal due to the color of your skin, but hey, now y'know how black people have felt for centuries.

Until we do something about the white male terrorist problem, the white male rapist problem, the violent homophobia problem, and the literal f*cking Nazi problem, I won't blame anyone for keeping a safety knife in their back pocket when meeting a white dude. Especially an LGBT woman.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Aug 8th 2019 at 3:28:05 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#286954: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:25:46 PM

[up][up] Kentucky’s crime rate sits around the national average. That doesn’t sound particularly out of the ordinary, though I doubt most people would be aware of all the threats and police action going on around them.

Edited by archonspeaks on Aug 8th 2019 at 2:26:48 AM

They should have sent a poet.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#286955: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:30:42 PM

My opinion is it's like Zootopia. When you're a bunny and get on a train with your child then two tigers get on the train, don't assume the tigers are going to eat your bunny child.

Wait until they say they're Alt-Right predators.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Robrecht Your friendly neighbourhood Regent from The Netherlands Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Your friendly neighbourhood Regent
#286956: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:42:42 PM

I have the utmost sympathy for you, but still, or rather exactly because of this, you shouldn't put all white males under scrutiny.

In fact, you being this afraid is exactly what they want. Terrorism thrives on fear. Don't give in to it.

As a white male, I can only say this:

Yes, yes you should put all white males under scrutiny. Many of us are not terrible, I like to think I'm one of them. But as a group? As a social class? White men are, collectively, the fucking worst and it's about time we acknowledged that.

Especially since White Supremacists and Fascists do indeed want us to be afraid... Specifically they want us to be so afraid of them we won't dare to tell them to stop. The way to combat that is fucking well not to go all 'fine people' on them.

So yeah, white males should be under scrutiny, because for most of history we've been the only group not under scrutiny and it's allowed some real shitbags to get away with way too much for way too long.

Edited by Robrecht on Aug 8th 2019 at 11:42:52 AM

Angry gets shit done.
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#286957: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:53:34 PM

There is a fallacy I even call "The Dog Fallacy" (though I've also called it the Shark Fallacy). Basically, you're more likely to be killed by a Dog than a Shark or a Wolf, but that's not because sharks and wolves are less dangerous than dogs. Paradoxically, it's actually the reverse: Wolves are legitimately quite dangerous...which means people tend to hunt them, avoid them, or approach them with caution.

Leviticus 19:34
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#286958: Aug 8th 2019 at 2:57:34 PM

[up][up]I think that logic is actually terrible and depends greatly on the bullshit science of profiling.

I think maybe we should give people the benefit of the doubt until they've done actual crimes or shown a reason to be distrusted other than their sex, race, or religion.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Aug 8th 2019 at 2:59:24 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
RainingMetal (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#286959: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:02:33 PM

It never hurts to be paranoid, but try not to make enemies when there aren't any to make. Wait for them to (attempt to) fire first.

ASAB: All Sponsors Are Bad.
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#286960: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:06:44 PM

Not likely,wheels are already in motion unless their case was personally seen to by president [elected_Democrat]

It's entirely possible that Warren would order an immediate moratorium on deportations the day after inauguration, including halting in-progress ones.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#286961: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:13:19 PM

If congress permits it of course

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#286962: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:14:05 PM

See, I would love is she stated an opinion on such a question.

I've stated before that I don't favour Elizabeth Warren as presidential candidate due to electability concerns, but I've developed another concern - that she and many other candidates are working under a misunderstanding of the White House's role in US politics. It is not a platform for developing detailed policy proposals as these are done by Congress, but to enact laws and setting out the parameters of law enforcement. Deportation policy, executive orders etc. are the main business of the presidency, and I think that the primary is focusing too little on these things.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#286963: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:14:55 PM

It never hurts to be paranoid, but try not to make enemies when there aren't any to make. Wait for them to (attempt to) fire first.

If you aren't prepared for a fight, the person who throws the first punch usually gets to be the person throwing the last. Especially when that first punch is drugging and raping you. Or shooting you.

There is nothing wrong with a little caution around the one group of people that the police will demonstrably not protect you from.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
bitemytail Since: Dec, 2011
#286964: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:16:40 PM

In other news (sorry to change the subject),

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/08/politics/andrew-yang-democratic-debate/index.html

Andrew Yang qualifies for September debates with new Iowa poll.

"In order to make the stage in September, candidates must receive 2% or more in at least 4 separate polls released between June 28 and August 28 and conducted by approved pollsters. Candidates must also receive donations from at least 130,000 individual donors distributed across multiple states."

"Nine candidates have now met the qualification for the September debate: former Vice President Joe Biden, New Jersey Sen. Cory Booker, Mayor Pete Buttigieg, California Sen. Kamala Harris, Minnesota Sen. Amy Klobuchar, former Rep. Beto O'Rourke, Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders, Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren and Yang."

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#286965: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:16:53 PM

The powers of the Presidency have changed since the Bush Administration and arguably since Nixon and Reagan. Basically, I should point out that we've had a proposal for Universal Health Care reform before and it was done by Richard Nixon (who implemented exactly ONE element and that is dialysis is free across the United States).

Since that time, Congress and the Senate have become more and more under the control of the Presidency while the powers of Executive Orders have grown radically.

In effect, what they couldn't do earlier they can do now as the President is now expected to be head of a universally united party underneath them.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#286966: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:17:43 PM

If you aren't prepared for a fight, the person who throws the first punch usually gets to be the person throwing the last. Especially when that first punch is drugging and raping you. Or shooting you.

There is nothing wrong with a little caution around the one group of people that the police will demonstrably not protect you from.

Perhaps, but that logic seems like it could be easily applied to other groups.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#286967: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:22:54 PM

Also, I'd argue the statement that white males are the "only group not under scrutiny" is rather dubious, at least has been out of date for many decades. Our society worships the punching up principle, which means the most privileged group is generally very scrutinized. I'd point to All Germans Are Nazis as a good example of this-in fact I'd say in general the racist stereotype of white people is, ironically, that they're racists.

The least scrutinized group would tend to be one in the middle of society, I'd argue. I actually wanna say (for America), it would tend to be Asians. I can't back that up with data, mind you, so don't quote me on that. My hypothesis would be that they're definitely victims of racism, but not to the extent that they're frequently talked about compared to groups like Black people, Hispanics, etc.

Leviticus 19:34
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#286968: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:24:46 PM

I find the idea of scrutinizing any group purely on the basis of race....racist.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Robrecht Your friendly neighbourhood Regent from The Netherlands Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Your friendly neighbourhood Regent
#286969: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:26:40 PM

I think that logic is actually terrible and depends greatly on the bullshit science of profiling.

That's ok. You're allowed to be wrong.

I think maybe we should give people the benefit of the doubt until they've done actual crimes or shown a reason to be distrusted other than their sex, race, or religion.

Scrutiny is not the same as distrust. Speaking only for myself, I want the people around me to scrutinise what I do and point out to me when I'm doing or saying something (unintentionally) insensitive or even horrible because, as a white male in a white male dominated society, I sometimes do not have the right context.

In much the same way that, as a disabled bisexual person, I do that for the non-disabled and non-bisexual people close to me.

Angry gets shit done.
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#286970: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:27:05 PM

If congress permits it of course

This isn't the UK. The President can tell ICE "stop deporting" by executive order, and they have to stop deporting; no permission required.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#286971: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:29:36 PM

Speaking as someone who is neuro-atypical, I find that kind of logic troubling with the same, "Scrutinizing people with mental illness is just wise."

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Robrecht Your friendly neighbourhood Regent from The Netherlands Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Your friendly neighbourhood Regent
#286972: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:31:06 PM

[up] Yeah, except that the actual logic here is 'scrutinizing neurotypicals is wise'.

Angry gets shit done.
Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#286973: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:35:47 PM

>I find the idea of scrutinizing any group purely on the basis of race....racist

This is the truth. Not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character.

Is this really a point we have to debate here of all places?

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#286974: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:43:13 PM

... as a woman, if I’m walking somewhere alone at night, I’m more nervous about a grown man nearby than I am about another woman. I really hope no sensible person would try to tell me that’s irrational or sexist, given the massive statistical evidence that, y’know, men attack women more than other women do.

The same applies to fearing random white men. Again, see mass shooting statistics. As a white person, I am baffled to see people claim that acknowledging reality (i.e. we live in a white supremacist society and the vast majority of white people are racist) is in itself a form of racism.

Racism is mass incarceration of Black and brown people, storing toxic chemicals in Black and native communities, destroying minority communities to build highways, suppressing minority voters, etc. Racism is Latinx citizens being terrified to go to the store because what if there’s another mass shooting.

Racism is not “I am nervous/scared of white strangers because I don’t know if they might act violently toward me, a brown/Black person.”

[up] Analyzing white supremacy and privilege is about systemic problems with society. That’s not applicable and frankly it’s disingenuous of you to misapply an MLK quote like that.

Edited by wisewillow on Aug 8th 2019 at 3:50:47 AM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#286975: Aug 8th 2019 at 3:49:55 PM

> This isn't the UK. The President can tell ICE "stop deporting" by executive order, and they have to stop deporting; no permission required.

Frankly if President _name_ tells them to stop even with an order they might need to enforce it because some people are rather too eager to carry the previous president's wishes

have a listen and have a link to my discord server

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