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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#284351: Jul 3rd 2019 at 5:14:22 PM

[up][up]What will impact a census happening less than ten years will be the scope of the census. Some countries do their census every five years (for example), but it's a less detailed census and/or relies more on administrative data. The greater the scope or the greater the reliance on survey work, the more time is required to set up the next one and test it.

So, the constitution may prevent too long a period between them happening, but logistics will prevent too short a period between them happening.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Jul 4th 2019 at 11:13:53 AM

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#284352: Jul 3rd 2019 at 5:20:47 PM

Reposting since it got page bottomed:

https://whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday.com/2019/07/03/day-895/

    Day 895: Moving forward 
1/ A report from the Department of Homeland Security's independent watchdog found the squalid conditions at migrant detention camps were more widespread than initially revealed. The report describes standing-room-only cells, children without access to showers or hot meals, and detainees desperately begging to be released. Inspectors visited five facilities in June, where they found many migrants are given only wet wipes to clean themselves and bologna sandwiches to eat, leading to additional health problems. Children at two of the camps were not given hot meals until inspectors arrived. Overcrowding was so severe that migrants were banging on cell walls and pressing notes up against the windows begging for help. (New York Times / Reuters)

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration-idUSKCN1TY1A5

2/ A federal judge blocked Attorney General William Barr's order to indefinitely detain immigrants seeking asylum and deny them bail if they crossed into the U.S. border without permission. The order requires immigration judges to conduct hearings for asylum applicants to ask for release on bail within seven days if they have shown a "credible fear" of returning to their country of origin. (Bloomberg / New York Times)

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-07-02/u-s-blocked-by-court-from-jailing-asylum-seekers-with-no-bail

3/ Trump claimed that he is "absolutely moving forward" with including the citizenship question on the 2020 census, contradicting both the Justice Department and the Commerce secretary, and calling the news reports "FAKE!" Yesterday, Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross said the Census Bureau was in the process of printing the census form without the citizenship question following the Supreme Court's decision to effectively block the question from being added to the questionnaire. (New York Times / CNBC / The Hill)

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/07/03/trump-says-absolutely-moving-forward-with-census-citizenship-question.html

4/ The National Parks Service is diverting $2.5 million meant to improve parks in order to cover costs associated with Trump's Fourth of July event on the National Mall. Trump officials have consistently refused to disclose how much taxpayers will have to pay for the "Salute to America" event. The diverted park fees make up just a fraction of the extra costs the government will have to pay as a result of the event, which will include tanks, military flyovers, Air Force One, and an extended pyrotechnics display. (Washington Post)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/white-house-gives-tickets-to-trumps-july-fourth-extravaganza-to-gop-donors/2019/07/02/9109a566-9ce0-11e9-b27f-ed2942f73d70_story.html?utm_term=.ebfca6854219

5/ Trump defended the cost of his "Salute to America" event, saying it will be "very little compared to what it is worth" because it will be "the show of a lifetime." Military chiefs, meanwhile, are concerned about the politicization of the event – They've been asked to stand with Trump during the event. (Politico / Washington Post / CNN)

https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/03/politics/military-concerns-trump-july-4th-event/index.html

6/ Trump will hold a campaign rally in North Carolina on the same day Robert Mueller is scheduled to testify publicly to Congress. Trump's campaign announced that he will be returning to Greenville, N.C. on July 17 to offer counter-programming to Mueller's highly anticipated public testimony about his report on Russian election interference in 2016 and possible obstruction of justice by Trump. The Trump campaign's chief operating officer said the rally will be an opportunity to highlight "the successes of the Trump presidency." (Washington Post)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-schedules-a-campaign-rally-in-nc-on-same-day-mueller-testifies-publicly-to-congress/2019/07/03/29f68f94-9d79-11e9-85d6-5211733f92c7_story.html?utm_term=.c9816f0afe97

📌 Day 888: Robert Mueller agreed to testify before the House Intelligence and Judiciary Committees in back-to-back public hearings on July 17th about his investigation into Russia's election interference and possible obstruction of justice by Trump. The announcement came after the two panels issued a subpoena compelling Mueller's testimony. Mueller previously said he did not want to testify and his report should serve as his testimony. Members of Mueller's team will also participate in a closed-door session with lawmakers. (NBC News / Washington Post / New York Times / Politico / ABC News / CNN)

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/robert-mueller-testify-publicly-house-committees-july-17-n1021796

poll/ 41% approve the job Trump is doing as president while 54% disapprove. 29% strongly approve with 44% who strongly disapprove. (Gallup)

https://news.gallup.com/poll/259871/trump-approval-remains-low-40s.aspx

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#284353: Jul 3rd 2019 at 5:32:58 PM

"A report from the Department of Homeland Security's independent watchdog"

I'd like to point out that the Secretary of Homeland Security and other department officials have repeatedly denied all reports of the horrible treatment at these detention camps and now their own investigators are essentially calling them liars.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#284354: Jul 3rd 2019 at 5:43:19 PM

It's kind of a good sign how many people who serve the Trump administration and seemingly willingly sold their souls find themselves going, "What the fuck is wrong with you?"

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#284355: Jul 3rd 2019 at 7:42:40 PM

NRA meltdown has Trump campaign sweating – Republicans worry that the NRA and two other groups that have long formed the core of their electoral infrastructure will be effectively on the sidelines.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/07/03/nra-guns-trump-campaign-1395970

The National Rifle Association aired an avalanche of TV ads and pushed its 5 million-plus members to the polls for Donald Trump in 2016, propelling him in the Rust Belt states that delivered him the presidency.

Now, the gun rights group is in total meltdown — and senior Republicans and Trump 2020 officials are alarmed.

In recent weeks, the NRA has seen everything from a failed coup attempt to the departure of its longtime political architect to embarrassing tales of self-dealing by top leaders. The turmoil is fueling fears that the organization will be profoundly diminished heading into the election, leaving the Republican Party with a gaping hole in its political machinery.

With the Chamber of Commerce and Koch political network withdrawing from their once-dominant roles in electing conservatives, Republicans worry that three organizations that have long formed the core of their electoral infrastructure will be effectively on the sidelines.

The predicament has so troubled some Republicans that they are calling on the famously secretive NRA to address its 2020 plans. Within the past week, senators have privately expressed concerns about the group to National Republican Senatorial Committee Chairman Todd Young.

“No organization has been more important to conservative voter education and engagement than the NRA. We all hope they’re able to mount the kind of effort in the 2020 cycle they have in the past,” said Gregg Keller, a former American Conservative Union executive director. “But in case they can’t, given their current situation, I hope they’re being forthright about that within the movement so others can pick up the slack.”

“The situation,” he added, “has folks nervous.”

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#284356: Jul 3rd 2019 at 7:50:52 PM

In some good news the charges have been dropped against that pregnant woman in Alabama who was shot and charged with manslaughter because the baby died.

Although it really says something that that was even a thing to begin with.

Edited by LSBK on Jul 3rd 2019 at 9:52:26 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#284357: Jul 3rd 2019 at 8:01:38 PM

This would have set a really bad precedent otherwise. If this had actually gone through, in the future anyone could call the cops on pregnant women for doing anything that could be considered remotely risky. Which is pretty much everything.

[up][up]I guess they'll have to rely on alt-right and Kremlin shitposters to pick up the slack.

Edited by M84 on Jul 3rd 2019 at 11:05:14 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#284358: Jul 3rd 2019 at 8:38:13 PM

The NRA's founders weren't exactly in a good position with Trump either because of the fact that they poured massive amounts of money into electing him, only to have a huge fallout from that support.

So much so that it largely contributed to their bankruptcy.

The short version being:

  • NRA enthusiasts believed Trump wouldn't take their guns so there was no need for the NRA to lobby.
  • Massive amounts of cash thrown into it came from Russian sources that dried up.
  • Their network was an enormous money pit.
  • Trump gave absolutely no real boost the NRA (and why should he)?

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jul 4th 2019 at 1:24:02 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#284359: Jul 3rd 2019 at 10:58:21 PM

I kinda love how it turned out to be a Faustian deal for them. evil grin

I have no problem with the Second Amendment, but some people have gotten to the point where they support the rights of guns more than the rights of humans themselves...

Do not obey in advance.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#284360: Jul 3rd 2019 at 11:01:28 PM

They also tend to be rather...selective about how that Right applies.

...By which I mean they're racist as fuck.

Now you might note that if rights are selective, they are not actually rights. They are privileges. This is of course something a lot of "gun nuts" willfully ignore.

Edited by M84 on Jul 4th 2019 at 2:03:08 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#284361: Jul 3rd 2019 at 11:05:59 PM

I'm not surprised, tbh.

I guess this does make it even more galling that a PoC like Candace Owens stans for them.

Edited by BearyScary on Jul 3rd 2019 at 10:08:55 AM

Do not obey in advance.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#284362: Jul 3rd 2019 at 11:07:11 PM

It's not like most rights are absolute, anyway.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#284363: Jul 3rd 2019 at 11:09:02 PM

Recall that the Mulford Act which repealed a law allowing public carrying of loaded firearms was passed in response to the Black Panthers engaging in armed patrols of Oakland to make sure cops weren't killing black people. The Panthers marching on the state capitol while armed to protest the bill also reinforced their decision.

The NRA sure didn't mind gun control when faced with the image of a bunch of angry black guys carrying loaded firearms. Heck, they outright supported it if it meant disarming the Black Panthers.

The crux of the issue is that to a lot of people, firearms are a symbol of freedom and (more importantly) power.

And they don't want black people to have power.

Edited by M84 on Jul 4th 2019 at 2:13:53 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#284364: Jul 4th 2019 at 4:53:26 AM

Or freedom.

i'm tired, my friend
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#284365: Jul 4th 2019 at 6:05:02 AM

Michigan US Representative Justin Amash has declared his independence from the Republican Party in a Washington Post Independence Day op-ed.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#284366: Jul 4th 2019 at 6:07:38 AM

Of course he still doesn't quite bring himself to acknowledge that a lot of the partisanship started with the GOP. But hey, at least it's one less GOP rep.

Let's hope he doesn't still continue to vote along GOP lines for whatever reason.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#284367: Jul 4th 2019 at 6:38:59 AM

>The crux of the issue is that to a lot of people, firearms are a symbol of freedom and (more importantly) power.

"Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun." isn't wrong.

So what does that say about the people who want to disarm us?

Edited by Soban on Jul 4th 2019 at 9:40:08 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#284368: Jul 4th 2019 at 6:46:49 AM

The problem is the racism, not the gun control.

And I for one refuse to believe that people in the USA need to be able to own guns to maintain their freedoms.

Edited by M84 on Jul 4th 2019 at 9:48:44 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#284369: Jul 4th 2019 at 7:04:00 AM

I don't think in 2020 they do. The problem is what about 2045? In 1920, I don't think anyone saw the horrors of the holocaust coming. 16,000,000+ dead. It seems to me plausible that an armed populace would and should give pause to anyone considering something like it. Assuming for a moment that it costs 40,000 lives a year, it would take 400 years for the two to even out. Do you think that we'll be that stable until 2420? I would like to hope so, but I can't guarantee it and neither can you.

PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#284370: Jul 4th 2019 at 7:13:09 AM

[up]What do you think could possibly happen between now and then that would make owning guns necessary for survival? What, you think the country's gonna fall and we'll all ending living in Mad Max? No.

i'm tired, my friend
archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#284371: Jul 4th 2019 at 7:13:40 AM

Maybe not for the same reasons as above, but I definitely think the rise of the armed left is a good thing. Most “right wing” gun owners are more willing to compromise on gun control than you’d think, but they end up voting hardline pro-gun because there isn’t any other option for them. If they have other options their votes could definitely be swung.

Edited by archonspeaks on Jul 4th 2019 at 7:15:00 AM

They should have sent a poet.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#284372: Jul 4th 2019 at 7:28:48 AM

[up][up][up]If your argument for no gun control is "the country might collapse"...that's not really a very good argument.

Disgusted, but not surprised
nightwyrm_zero Since: Apr, 2010
#284373: Jul 4th 2019 at 7:28:49 AM

Considering the current political leanings of a large number of US gun owners, it would seem more likely that they would be on the side of the perpetrators of the next holocaust than the other way around.

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#284374: Jul 4th 2019 at 7:48:32 AM

[up] Yup. The vast majority of guns are held by a small number of right-wing extremists. Yeah, there’s some lefties with one or two guns for hunting, or personal protection. But those stockpiles where one family has a dozen or more guns? Uhm...

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#284375: Jul 4th 2019 at 7:54:06 AM

[up][up] This, more than anything.

I have general concerns about personal firearms ownership that are unrelated to Constitutional issues. I don't think it's necessary, and I think that a gun is a net provocation to violence rather than a way to prevent it. I think that people who want to shoot as a hobby or lifestyle choice can rent or lease guns and have them stored in a secure facility rather than in their homes, with a few rare exceptions like ranchers. Anyone who needs to be armed professionally should be required to check in their weapons when they go off duty.

None of that addresses the core problem in U.S. politics, which is that the Second Amendment is indelibly associated with an anti-government, revolutionary mindset. The underlying theory is that an armed populace is the best defense against the tyranny of the government. If they start to take our freedoms, we'll shoot 'em down, or something like that. This idea has many, many flaws, not the least of which being that the only Federal governments that have seriously threatened our freedoms have been Republican ones, eagerly voted for by those same anti-government, Second Amendment people. The irony is utterly lost on them.

When I see someone waving a gun around in celebration of their freedoms, I see a person who supports racist, theocratic, jingoistic politics and votes for politicians who try to strip government of the power to redress social and economic injustices, and this is why, in turn, I want to take those guns away. They're like toddlers throwing a tantrum, and those are the last people you want to have deadly weapons. This constant threat of insurrection is a kind of poison eating away at our ability to govern effectively. We just saw that.

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 4th 2019 at 10:58:52 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

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