TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#282501: Jun 9th 2019 at 5:31:23 PM

We’ll see. From that poll, 30% seem to be up for grabs, and I think Warren has a lot of potential to grab those voters.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#282502: Jun 9th 2019 at 5:44:49 PM

[up][up]That will be a challenge for Warren considering her likely voter base has much less in common with Biden’s. Something 538 also pointed out.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#282503: Jun 9th 2019 at 5:45:52 PM

Coming on second in Iowa would still be a big boon to her campaign.

tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#282504: Jun 9th 2019 at 9:41:59 PM

On a tangent, I realized just today just how similar the modern for profit prison complex is to pre-Civil War slavery. You have prisons using prisoners as slaves, keeping them from actually learning so they can be fast tracked back into the system (either because they don't know any better or because they think it's better), and even counting prisoners for voting purposes even when they aren't allowed to vote.

I knew it was bad before, but this made me realize it on a whole other level.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#282505: Jun 9th 2019 at 9:44:57 PM

Gotta "love" that "except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted" bit in the Thirteenth Amendment.

Disgusted, but not surprised
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#282506: Jun 9th 2019 at 9:46:17 PM

The Documentary on Netflix, 17th is basically about that similarity.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#282507: Jun 10th 2019 at 2:42:59 AM

From Politico: Chao created special path for McConnell’s favored projects. Note that Transportation Secretary Elaine Chao is actually the wife of Evil Turtle, and while her career in that department began before her marriage, it's not the first time she has attracted scrutiny over conflicts of interest.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#282508: Jun 10th 2019 at 2:48:03 AM

At the grassroots level, Kentucky radio host Matt Jones has indicated he might be prepared to run as a populist Democrat against Mc Connell, a target of frequent barbs on his hugely popular sports show.

“What has Mitch Mc Connell done to help Kentucky?” Jones asked in a POLITICO interview. “Mitch Mc Connell has been a master — a master at helping wealthy business interests get wealthier. If there is a rich guy Hall of Fame, he should be in it.”

Mc Connell’s answer to these criticisms is clear: He’s used his influence to deliver on Kentucky’s priorities.

"All 100 senators may have one vote," Mc Connell told the Lexington Herald-Leader last year, "but they’re not all equal. Kentucky benefits from having one of its own setting the agenda for the country."

By that logic, Kentucky ought to be the most awesome state in the country. Which it isn't — I'm fairly certain the state suffering food shortages is proof that it's not exactly taking the best care of its citizens.

Disgusted, but not surprised
RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#282509: Jun 10th 2019 at 2:51:35 AM

Isn't that defense basically "I'm already funneling funds to Kentucky that otherwise wouldn't go there, so you'll all shut your mouths if you know what's good for you", when (as Charles and others have said) it's apparently not even true?

It's been fun.
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#282510: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:09:04 AM

It is not really a surprise to hear a Republican lying again.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#282511: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:36:22 AM

Its beyond even Blatant Lies since Mitch and Bevin have made it a point to deny money to the people of Kentucky a major part of their campaigns. I remind people, of course, that Mitch's goal has been destroy the Affordable Health Care Act despite how many people whose lives it has saved in Kentucky.

They also have attacked regular Medicaid, Welfare, and any other forms of government assistance.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jun 10th 2019 at 7:36:52 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#282512: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:57:55 AM

At this point, it should be more surprising when McConnell tells the truth.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#282513: Jun 10th 2019 at 9:06:42 AM

I'd be surprised if any truth could survive five minutes of contact with him without curling into a ball and crying.

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#282514: Jun 10th 2019 at 10:53:49 AM

Nadler has announced that he's made a deal with the Justice Department concerning the Mueller Report.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#282515: Jun 10th 2019 at 12:23:50 PM

FYI - Mitch is one of the major people who enforced the continued criminality of marijuana despite the fact Kentucky as a tobacco state is in a unique position to be able to make it a massive cash crop that could rescue tens of thousands of struggling farmers.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jun 10th 2019 at 1:37:56 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#282516: Jun 10th 2019 at 1:37:06 PM

[up]

I think you mean "enforced" instead of "prevented" there.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#282517: Jun 10th 2019 at 6:34:17 PM

[up][up][up] In other words, the DOJ blinked first?

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#282518: Jun 10th 2019 at 6:59:37 PM

https://whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday.com/2019/06/10/day-872/

    Day 872: Possibly catastrophic 
1/ The Justice Department agreed to provide Congress with "key evidence" collected by Robert Mueller related to obstruction of justice and abuse of power by Trump. House Judiciary Chairman Jerry Nadler said "Mueller's most important files" will be available to all committee members, allowing "us to perform our constitutional duties and decide how to respond to the allegations laid out against the President by the Special Counsel." The House Judiciary Committee, however, moved no closer to securing testimony from Mueller or other figures, such as former White House counsel Donald Mc Gahn, who has declined to testify, citing Trump administration lawyers. (New York Times / CNN / Washington Post)

https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/10/politics/jerry-nadler-mueller-report-william-barr/

2/ Jerry Nadler agreed to delay a vote to hold Barr and Mc Gahn in contempt of Congress after reaching the deal with the Department of Justice for evidence from the Mueller report. The House will still proceed with a vote to authorize the House Judiciary Committee to take Barr to federal court to fully enforce its subpoena, but will not formally vote to hold Barr in contempt. "If the Department proceeds in good faith and we are able to obtain everything that we need, then there will be no need to take further steps," Nadler said. "If important information is held back, then we will have no choice but to enforce our subpoena in court and consider other remedies." (ABC News / NBC News / NPR)

https://www.npr.org/2019/06/10/731300750/house-democrats-to-get-some-mueller-report-material-but-contempt-vote-is-still-o

3/ Trump backed off his threat to impose tariffs on all Mexican goods, tweeting that the U.S. reached an agreement with Mexico to reduce the number of migrants at the southern border. According to a joint statement, Mexico agreed to "take unprecedented steps to increase enforcement to curb irregular migration," including the deployment of thousands of national guard troops to its border with Guatemala to stop migrants from reaching the U.S. Mexico also agreed to an expansion of a Trump administration program to host more migrants seeking asylum while their court proceedings are in progress in the U.S. (New York Times / Washington Post)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/mexican-officials-hail-tariff-averting-pact-with-us-even-as-worries-emerge/2019/06/08/fcee754a-8886-11e9-9d73-e2ba6bbf1b9b_story.html

READ: The United States-Mexico Joint Declaration released by the State Department. (New York Times)

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/07/us/state-department-mexico-trump.html

4/ Mexico had already agreed to deploy its National Guard several months ago. The Mexican government agreed to the "deployment of its National Guard throughout Mexico, giving priority to its southern border" during secret talks with Kirstjen Nielsen back in March. And, the agreement to host asylum seekers in Mexico while their cases proceed in the U.S. was reached in December. Trump, however, tweeted on Saturday that he was "very excited about the new deal with Mexico." (New York Times / Reuters)

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trade-mexico-idUSKCN1TA0GM

5/ Trump claimed there are "some things….. …..not mentioned" in the deal with Mexico, promising they'll be revealed "in the not too distant future." Mexico's Foreign Affairs Minister Marcelo Ebrard, however, contradicted Trump's claim that a "fully signed and documented" agreement would be revealed soon, saying there were no undisclosed parts of the U.S.-Mexico deal. Trump also claimed that Mexico agreed to "immediately begin buying large quantities of agricultural product from our great patriot farmers." There is no evidence, however, that an agreement on agricultural trade was agreed to and three Mexican officials have denied that it exists. (Politico / Associated Press / ABC News / New York Times / CNN / Bloomberg / Business Insider)

https://www.apnews.com/7bedd8e672dd4f6ca3ffe2b3fd78fe0f

6/ The White House blocked a State Department intelligence agency from submitting written testimony that human-caused climate change is "possibly catastrophic" to national security. The written testimony by the State Department's Bureau of Intelligence and Research for a House Intelligence Committee hearing outlined that "absent extensive mitigating factors or events, we see few plausible future scenarios where significant — possibly catastrophic — harm does not arise from the compounded effects of climate change." Officials from the White House's Office of Legislative Affairs, Office of Management and Budget, and National Security Council all objected to parts of the testimony because it did not align with the Trump administration's official stance. The analyst, Rod Schoonover, was ultimately allowed to speak before the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, but the White House refused to approve Schoonover's written testimony for entry into the permanent Congressional Record. (Washington Post / New York Times)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2019/06/08/white-house-blocked-intelligence-aides-written-testimony-saying-human-caused-climate-change-could-be-possibly-catastrophic/

Secretary of State Mike Pompeo suggested that people deal with climate change by "mov[ing] to different places." Pomeo claimed that the climate "always changes," and so "societies reorganize" and "we will figure out responses to this that address these issues in important and fundamental ways." (Talking Points Memo)

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/pompeo-climate-change-move-different-places

    Notables 
Transportation Secretary Elaine Chao set up a special liaison to deal with grant applications from her husband Mitch Mc Connell's state of Kentucky. The deal allowed at least $78 million for preferred projects to go through while Mc Connell campaigned for reelection. Chao personally asked Todd Inman to serve as intermediary and help advise Mc Connell and local officials on specific grants that Mc Connell designated. One grant for a highway improvement project in a Mc Connell political stronghold had already been rejected on two separate occasions. (Politico)

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/06/10/mcconnell-elaine-chao-1358068

A real estate company part-owned by Jared Kushner received $90 million in foreign funding since 2017. Kushner failed to list the company, Cadre, on his first ethics disclosure, but later adding the company and calling it an inadvertent omission. (The Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jun/10/jared-kushner-real-estate-cadre-goldman-sachs

A bipartisan group of Senators is attempting to block Trump's sale of arms to Saudi Arabia. Senators are using a provision in the Foreign Assistance Act to request a report from the Trump administration on Saudi Arabia's human rights record, which could trigger a vote to halt the billions of dollars in arms sales that Mike Pompeo is pushing for despite opposition from Congress. (Politico / NBC News / The Hill)

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/dem-gop-senators-want-check-trump-s-power-sell-arms-n1015581

The Trump administration rejected requests from U.S. embassies to fly the rainbow pride flag on embassy flagpoles during Pride Month. An advisory cable last year directed diplomats to obtain top-level approval from the State Department's Office of Management to fly a rainbow flag. Requests by U.S. embassies in Israel, Germany, Brazil and Latvia to fly the pride flag on their flagpoles have been denied. (NBC News / Washington Post)

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/trump-admin-tells-u-s-embassies-they-can-t-fly-n1015236

The symbolic oak tree Emmanuel Macron gave to Trump last year has died. Macron tweeted at the time that the sapling would be "a reminder … of these ties that bind us" and the "tenacity of the friendship" of the two nations. (The Guardian)

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jun/10/tree-planted-to-mark-trump-macron-friendship-dies

Trump has made at least 10,796 false or misleading claims since taking office. Trump has averaged about 12 false claims a day. (Washington Post)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/06/10/president-trump-has-made-false-or-misleading-claims-over-days/


Justin Amash leaves the conservative Freedom Caucus – Rep. Justin Amash on Monday stepped down from the conservative House Freedom Caucus less than a month after becoming the first Republican member of Congress to say President Donald Trump has committed impeachable offenses

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/06/10/politics/justin-amash-leaves-freedom-caucus/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fcurrentstatus.io%2F

Edited by sgamer82 on Jun 10th 2019 at 11:31:21 AM

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#282519: Jun 10th 2019 at 10:46:41 PM

I want to say "Good for him", but I don't know enough to say so definitively.

Do not obey in advance.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#282520: Jun 11th 2019 at 1:14:18 AM

Concerning the recent poll from CNN in Iowa...

538 podcast: Politics Podcast: Is Elizabeth Warren Surging?

Fair warning, It's a little under an hour long. I unfortunately don't have time to listen to it myself right now, but I figured people invested in Warren's chances might want to listen to it.

There's also a link to the RCP polling data that includes the Iowa poll from CNN.

RCP polling data for Iowa.

Edited by M84 on Jun 11th 2019 at 4:18:32 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#282521: Jun 11th 2019 at 7:31:32 AM

In other words, the DOJ blinked first?

Exactly. Now that we're finally moving forward with holding Barr in contempt and empowering Nadler to pursue such charges more expediently in the future, we're seeing the bloody nose effect I talked about earlier.

As I mentioned, a bully's confidence is only so strong as his feeling of invulnerability. Bravado costs nothing. Anyone can say they'll gladly go to jail for Trump. But when you walk into that room and slap the handcuffs down on the table, a lot of people change their tune quick. Just like Michael Cohen did.

Despite being the one repeatedly pointing out that this will happen this way if the House would just find the nerve to take that step, I'm actually surprised at how fast it happened. I was sure we'd need to actually hit at least once, so to speak. That Barr would try to stubbornly stay loyal for a while after being arrested, but others would look at what happened to him and fall in line with the subpoenas now placed on their desks.

I overestimated Barr's fragile bully nerve. We didn't even bloody the Justice Department's nose. Nadler merely wound up the punch and Barr collapsed into a shrieking mess. Which is even better and should still have the "Oh, shit, the House is actually serious about this" effect with its other subpoenas that I anticipated.

This is precisely how you handle a bully: you have to hit them. It doesn't have to be with a literal fist, mind. But you have to create a cause-effect relationship between their behavior and their life becoming shittier. Smash their invulnerability confidence, make them see that their actions have real consequences that hurt them, and you'll see a change in attitude.

I'm very pleased with what is happening now that the House is finally willing to do this. And with the new motion empowering Nadler, I don't expect to see obstruction like this last month again.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jun 11th 2019 at 8:31:58 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#282522: Jun 11th 2019 at 8:23:58 AM

This is precisely how you handle a bully: you have to hit them. It doesn't have to be with a literal fist, mind. But you have to create a cause-effect relationship between their behavior and their life becoming shittier. Smash their invulnerability confidence, make them see that their actions have real consequences that hurt them, and you'll see a change in attitude.
I disagree on the "doesn't have be with a literal fist". An eye for an eye; the bully ought to be carry a lasting psychological trauma for me to be sure that the lesson is sufficiently likely to take root. Moreso when they're gone past being a "bully" and straight into being a monster in human form.

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
GoldenKaos Captain of the Dead City from Cirith Ungol Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Captain of the Dead City
#282523: Jun 11th 2019 at 8:28:01 AM

[up]I see we have Ender Wiggin in the thread.

Edited by GoldenKaos on Jun 11th 2019 at 4:28:11 PM

"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#282524: Jun 11th 2019 at 8:30:09 AM

[up][up] Yeah, there's no actual evidence backing that up. Bullies bullied just become worse bullies.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#282525: Jun 11th 2019 at 8:44:09 AM

... defending yourself against a bully is not bullying a bully. What, would you suggest lying down instead?


Total posts: 417,856
Top