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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#280426: May 12th 2019 at 5:07:02 PM

Basically, there’s X public defenders, usually way, WAY less of them than are needed, and any new cases get assigned to them by a judge.

Watch the John Oliver video someone posted earlier, it explains well.

[down] thanks

Edited by wisewillow on May 12th 2019 at 5:22:17 AM

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#280427: May 12th 2019 at 5:20:48 PM

Reposting here for the sake of convenience:

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#280428: May 12th 2019 at 7:21:40 PM

I think it's a mistake to assign any real measure of blame for this problem on the defenders themselves. Legal aid lawyers are making huge sacrifices to make the system even remotely functional. It's like blaming doctors who manage free clinics for the dismal state of USA healthcare.

I blame the issue on the fact that most of us just aren't willing to pay the taxes for this sort of thing. Probably because none of us ever imagine that we will need this. Thanks to way too much media telling us that only guilty people need lawyers, and that lawyers are scum anyway. And rightwing "small government" types are all too willing to exploit this.

Edited by M84 on May 12th 2019 at 10:25:15 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Hylarn (Don’t ask)
#280429: May 12th 2019 at 7:27:43 PM

The main problem is that way too many people get charged with crimes in the US. Too many laws that're easy to break and too low a standard of evidence for charging someone. The system gets overworked and abusive plea bargains are used instead

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#280430: May 12th 2019 at 7:40:11 PM

[up]You're assuming incompetence, not malice. The system is so overworked because the private prison system is literally writing the laws and designing them as an assembly line of injustice. Public defenders being paid shit to take 300 cases at once is just a symptom of that.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#280431: May 12th 2019 at 7:44:45 PM

We probably shouldn't have been surprised this would happen the moment a profit motive was introduced to incarceration. You create an industry where people make more money if more people are in prison — of course this would be the result.

Disgusted, but not surprised
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#280432: May 12th 2019 at 7:47:54 PM

It was a privatization of a public utility.

Dick Jones in Robocop said, "OCP gambled in markets traditionally regarded as non-profit: hospitals, prisons, space exploration. I say good business is where you find it."

That's a joke that's not funny anymore.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#280433: May 12th 2019 at 8:02:03 PM

It wasn't just meant to be a joke in the first place. The first Robocop movie was very much a satire of real problems that were happening in the Eighties.

If anything, the movie Detroit is in a better state than real Detroit in the present day.

Edited by M84 on May 12th 2019 at 11:08:12 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#280434: May 12th 2019 at 8:45:38 PM

Daily Show showed a problem with kids complaining about the Healthy Care Act 2010 (Hope I got it right) and getting greasy food back.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#280435: May 12th 2019 at 9:10:17 PM

I remember back when I was in high school and being kind of amazed at how much fast food they had available for purchase at lunch. Pizza, fries, burgers, you name it.

In retrospect, maybe that was a factor in my massive weight gain in my freshman and sophomore years. It wasn't the sole factor by any means — I've always had a pretty big appetite — but it was a factor.

Basing a school lunch menu on what people want to eat is a recipe for disaster. We crave fats and salts and sugar (due to sugar being somewhat addictive). Children in particular love sweets since their healthier taste buds means that sweets taste better to them than they would for adults. This incidentally is also why they tend to dislike vegetables and other bitter things more.

Edited by M84 on May 13th 2019 at 12:13:26 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#280436: May 12th 2019 at 9:25:23 PM

Also, blame the change in school lunches, moving from fresh cooking to processed/frozen... the vegetables are usually awful and nasty.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#280437: May 12th 2019 at 9:31:02 PM

That's another advantage with fatty and salty stuff — it's easier to preserve without losing flavor.

And while it is possible to make decent meals with frozen veggies, it does take a bit of effort.

But fare that's more suitable for military campaigns and cattle drives isn't what we should be serving to students.

Edited by M84 on May 13th 2019 at 12:32:22 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#280438: May 12th 2019 at 9:35:13 PM

While it's certainly true that taste buds change over time, I think the disgust kids often have towards vegetables is largely cultural. We tell them that vegetables should taste bad, through things like cartoons and whatnot, and they're primed to perceive vegetables that way.

If you look around the world at different countries, they all have their own stereotypes of "the vegetable kids hate most" and the kids in those countries do in fact seem to dislike those particular, stereotyped vegetables, even if kids in other countries like them. In some cultures sweets are considered "girly" so boys train themselves to hate them in order to be seen as masculine. Tastes are extremely cultural. It's almost like a milder form of racism: we teach them from a young age to think healthy foods taste worse, and that becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

And while this is just a personal anecdote, personally I grew up thinking overly fatty foods were disgusting, and broccoli is a comfort food to me. ...I still loved candy way too much though.

Edited by Clarste on May 12th 2019 at 9:37:25 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#280439: May 12th 2019 at 9:41:53 PM

The same thing happens with a lot of stuff, a lot of children's media pushes a lot of bad behavior as acceptable and normal. Right off the top of my head, people in mascot costumes and substitute teachers are extremely common Acceptable Targets in kid's shows for abuse, and that kind of messaging only makes hard jobs harder.

Like, as a kid, I literally thought it was okay and cool to attack people in mascot costumes, just because I saw it happen all the time in tv shows and movies.

RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#280440: May 12th 2019 at 9:45:07 PM

Though good vs bad cooking can make a big difference. Boil any vegetable in mush or exacerbate the bitterness, and...

Different country, but the "there's an obesity crisis so we need to make all food healthier! thing always annoyed me. It seemed to always start with a massive focus on the calorific content of food—that's great and all for tackling obesity, not so much when school food is the majority of your intake.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#280441: May 12th 2019 at 9:45:12 PM

[up][up]Not that media geared towards adults is much better in this regard. A lot of the themes, tropes, etc. that are so prevalent in media are absolutely terrible in real life.

[up]Like I said, there's ways to make even frozen veggies somewhat palatable. Steaming is an option, though whether that's practical for preparing food for an entire school is another matter.

Edited by M84 on May 13th 2019 at 12:48:12 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#280442: May 12th 2019 at 9:48:30 PM

Frozen is fine. Overcooking is the problem. And vegetables are the worst type of food for that—overcooking is horrible and harder to check. But that's more a side note.

megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#280443: May 12th 2019 at 9:52:35 PM

[up] I don't mind frozen at all, actually. The worst is canned vegetables.

There are ways to make them palatable, but not at any school I've been too.

Edited by megaeliz on May 12th 2019 at 12:55:12 PM

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#280444: May 12th 2019 at 10:22:28 PM

This does outline the problem though: If school lunches don't taste good, kids aren't going to eat them, especially if their parents give them either decently-cooked food at home or (of course) give them junk food, especially if junk food is all they can afford.

Steven (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#280445: May 12th 2019 at 10:28:23 PM

And because a lot of public schools aren't well funded, said schools are going to skimp out on food and give the cheapest food they can push out.

Remember, these idiots drive, fuck, and vote. Not always in that order.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#280446: May 12th 2019 at 10:31:33 PM

Just to shit on your feelings of humanity. The Hunger Crisis in Kentucky can basically be summarized as, "The only reason 200,000+ children in Kentucky aren't starving to death is they have 5 meals a week at their school."

On the weekends, they don't eat.

The independent churches fill in as much as the gap as they can but the government has done nothing to cover it and if they can get their shitty charter schools not to serve lunch they will.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on May 12th 2019 at 10:33:55 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Steven (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#280447: May 12th 2019 at 10:39:37 PM

What makes it worse is families in those kind of situations will take any kind of food to feed themselves because it's either eating junk/fast food or going without and slowly starving to death.

Remember, these idiots drive, fuck, and vote. Not always in that order.
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#280448: May 12th 2019 at 10:56:50 PM

Good god, why is Kentucky is such an apocalyptic state? Is the answer simply "Mitch McConnell"?

Do not obey in advance.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#280449: May 12th 2019 at 10:57:45 PM

An apple, a ham sandwich, and a thing of cheese crackers by the local church is a godsend, really.

The stories there involve kids learning to hide them, though, because their parents will steal their food.

http://kentuckytoday.com/stories/shelbyville-church-fills-in-the-gaps-for-people-dealing-with-hunger,3868?

This is 3 years old but the situation hasn't gotten better.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#280450: May 12th 2019 at 11:01:29 PM

Good god, why is Kentucky is such an apocalyptic state? Is the answer simply "Mitch Mc Connell"?

I feel its hard to convey the fact that it is Not Hyperbole that Mitch literally wants to kill the poor in the state. Poor whites, blacks, and Hispanics. His policies aren't designed to do this as collateral damage, but the point. He's blocked medical care, food, government assistance, financial assistance, and helped medical companies flood the state with poison.

Its even weirder that he's loathed by the majority of the state but has a iron grip on the Republican party.

The churches, secular charities, and other groups are trying to bypass all this with the Kentucky Hunger Initiative—but Mitch has tried to shut it down just like he's forced the government to try to get people off Medicare by making sure they need to get a job in two years or lose it (with those who get jobs probably being off it).

https://www.kyagr.com/hunger/

I need to start volunteering.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on May 12th 2019 at 11:02:09 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.

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