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Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#279401: May 3rd 2019 at 4:37:45 PM

[up][up] Any interaction between nations where they attempt to exert influence over one another could be described as competition.

As far as ideological carnism, yes, that’s a thing. I think it’s more just a facet of a reactionary worldview though, as people who act like that will usually oppose almost anything they see as “progressive” in any way on principle. I doubt there are many, if any, pure ideological carnists out there.

I’d suggest doing a little research on the human diet. There’s a lot of psudeoscience out there, usually walking hand in hand with other more harmful nonsense like on that channel, but it’s fairly easy to find good stuff.

Edited by archonspeaks on May 3rd 2019 at 4:39:01 AM

They should have sent a poet.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#279402: May 3rd 2019 at 4:40:03 PM

How can a democracy function when its main means of informing the public are compromised this way? What is even the will of the people if the people make decisions based on false premises?

On the off change that you’re genuinely asking.

It can’t and it doesn’t exist.

The U.K. has serious fundamental problems with its democracy, Murdoch has been in power since at least 1979, that’s 40 years. 40 years of only people who get his backing getting into Number 10.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Oruka Since: Dec, 2018
#279403: May 3rd 2019 at 4:40:42 PM

I'm happy not to share pseudoscience, but don't know whether I'm doing that. I'm happy to abstain from opining about fields in which I'm not equipped to tell the difference. Are you a nutritionist, biologist, or medical scientist, Archon? What's harmful about the stuff on that channel?

Though, to be fair, wouldn't limit the on-topic discussion here to Iaculus and few others here who are trained in the Social Sciences and the Humanities?

Edited by Oruka on May 3rd 2019 at 4:43:39 AM

Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#279404: May 3rd 2019 at 4:41:37 PM

[up]Please. Not least because the two oldest tools on record are digging sticks (for those roots the crackpots are so fond of)... and cleavers/ handaxes for bone-smashing to get at meat and marrow.

We're opportunistic omnivores with a penchant for hunting, gathering and scavenging (which is why we can handle alcohol and cheese — less scavenging, less ability to deal with yeasts and currently friendly bacteria we wouldn't find very friendly without building a report over millions of years of nicking pieces off feline, hyenid and canine carcasses, as well as regular river-, lake- and beachcombing). We didn't grow our brains on starch alone: it takes fat.

Also, about sanctions and boycotts: they van work in conjunction with other pressures. Just ask anybody from South Africa. tongue

Edited by Euodiachloris on May 3rd 2019 at 12:48:14 PM

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#279405: May 3rd 2019 at 4:48:50 PM

Guys take the food discussion to the food thread, or if you wanna talk the morality of it to the philosophy thread. But this not on topic here.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Oruka Since: Dec, 2018
#279406: May 3rd 2019 at 4:50:51 PM

[up][up]I'm happy it worked out.

"Any interaction between nations where they attempt to exert influence over one another could be described as competition."

That's not how the term is usually employed. A generalization? Is it some game theory jargon or something similar?

Edited by Oruka on May 3rd 2019 at 4:54:20 AM

archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#279407: May 3rd 2019 at 5:07:43 PM

[up] That’s the political science and economics usage, which I’d say is probably appropriate for the topic of this thread.

Edited by archonspeaks on May 3rd 2019 at 5:08:27 AM

They should have sent a poet.
Oruka Since: Dec, 2018
#279408: May 3rd 2019 at 5:11:00 PM

Well, I'm a layperson in those fields. Please elaborate.

@Murdoch: I can't wrap my head around the magnitude of the catastrophe. No wonder the UK has been in decline all this time. The government and population have lost their feedback loop.

Edited by Oruka on May 3rd 2019 at 5:14:53 AM

archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#279409: May 3rd 2019 at 5:20:41 PM

[up] I can’t tell if you’re stonewalling on purpose or not, but I’m just going to direct you back to my previous posts in this thread. Nations compete for political, ideological and economic supremacy through a variety of means, everything from diplomacy to sanctions to warfare.

They should have sent a poet.
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#279410: May 3rd 2019 at 5:28:02 PM

The Late Show Monologue last night:

How does Trump get through the Witch Hunts? They just do it.... and think about God.

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#279411: May 3rd 2019 at 5:54:52 PM

@Everyone: Guys, don't feed the sealion.

megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#279412: May 3rd 2019 at 6:21:34 PM

This came up

President Donald Trump said he briefly discussed special counsel Robert Mueller's report in a call with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Friday, but didn't warn his Russian counterpart to not meddle in the next US election.

"We didn't discuss that. Really, we didn't discuss it. We discussed five or six things. We also went into great detail on various things," Trump told reporters in the Oval Office after the phone call, which occurred on Friday morning.

Earlier, Trump tweeted he'd discussed the "Russian hoax" with Putin, along with other issues, during their hour-long phone call.

In the Oval Office, Trump said "(Putin) sort of smiled when he said something to the effect that it started up as a mountain and ended up as a mouse. But he knew that because he knew that there was no collusion. Pretty much that's what it was."

Friday's phone call was the first between the two leaders since the release of the Mueller report, which found that members of the Trump campaign expected they would benefit from Russian efforts to influence the 2016 election, but didn't find that they conspired with the Kremlin.

Trump, who has repeatedly undercut US intelligence agencies' conclusion that Russia influenced the 2016 election, claimed earlier this week that his predecessor, President Barack Obama, "did nothing" to stop Russian interference, though in fact Obama told Putin "to cut it out" and vowed "serious consequences."

Intelligence officials believe that Russian interference in US public affairs continues. But efforts to focus the administration's efforts in countering that meddling have been met with resistance from the President, who has viewed any suggestion that Russia helped him win the election as a challenge to his legitimacy.

According to the Mueller report, "[T]he investigation established that the Russian government perceived it would benefit from a Trump presidency and worked to secure that outcome, and that the campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts." The Mueller report also details Russia's efforts at interference during the 2016 election, which led to charges against several Russians and Russian entities.

The Kremlin said the phone call was initiated by Trump. In a readout, Moscow did not mention the Mueller investigation and said Trump and Putin discussed "the current state and prospects for bilateral relations with an emphasis on economic cooperation."

Speaking to reporters earlier Friday, White House press secretary Sarah Sanders said the Mueller report was discussed "very, very briefly."

She would not directly answer questions from reporters on whether Russian interference, as shown in the Mueller report, was discussed between Trump and Putin, only saying, "the conversation on that part was very quick, but what I can tell you is that this administration, unlike the previous one, takes election meddling seriously. And we're going to do everything that we can to prevent it from happening. That's why we've taken a whole-of-government approach."

Pressed about Trump's decision not to bring up election meddling with Putin during Friday's call, Sanders later said, "The President's made clear to everybody, every person that's not an American voter has no business in our elections. We've said it a lot and we're actually doing things to prevent everybody from meddling in our elections, something the other (Obama) administration failed to do."

Edited by megaeliz on May 3rd 2019 at 9:23:06 AM

megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#279413: May 3rd 2019 at 6:21:52 PM

Accidental double post

Edited by megaeliz on May 3rd 2019 at 9:22:27 AM

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#279414: May 3rd 2019 at 6:39:48 PM

Saw an interesting story the other day. A poll on which Democrat people would vote for was conducted but without giving any options. People just chose whoever they could think of. The percentage of support Biden, Sander, and a few other got dropped like 5-7%.

Which told us something we already knew, that a good chunk of support the leading candidates are getting comes from name recognition. And, more amusingly, those people will gravitate towards the name they recognize only if you remind them of their names in the first place.

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#279415: May 3rd 2019 at 6:41:03 PM

Saw an interesting story the other day. A poll on which Democrat people would vote for was conducted but without giving any options. People just chose whoever they could think of. The percentage of support Biden, Sander, and a few other got dropped like 5-7%.

Which told us something we already knew, that a good chunk of support the leading candidates are getting comes from name recognition. And, more amusingly, those people will gravitate towards the name they recognize only if you remind them of their names in the first place.

You got a link to this? I would be interested in seeing the exact numbers.

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#279417: May 3rd 2019 at 7:02:19 PM

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/05/03/us/minnesota-marital-rape-repeal/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

Minnesota just closed a legal loophole that made martial tape legal.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
DrDougsh Since: Jan, 2001
#279418: May 3rd 2019 at 7:12:19 PM

I assume you mean "marital rape", but I highly encourage you not to correct that amusing typo.

MorningStar1337 The Encounter that ended the Dogma from 🤔 Since: Nov, 2012
The Encounter that ended the Dogma
#279419: May 3rd 2019 at 7:21:43 PM

This roll of tape is a certified lethal weapontongue

Jokes aside, I hope that Minnesota was the only state that had to do that. What led to the loophole in the first place?

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#279420: May 3rd 2019 at 8:51:27 PM

Fun Joe Biden video: “The younger generation now tells me how tough things are, give me a break ... I have no empathy”

I... I didn’t know I could be angrier at him?

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#279421: May 3rd 2019 at 8:53:30 PM

Every time Biden says anything I continue to sour on him. I think calling these things "gaffes" are actually too generous, he just seems to be an old centrist with some downright poor views who looked good by virtue of being next to Obama.

AzurePaladin She/Her Pronouns from Forest of Magic Since: Apr, 2018 Relationship Status: Mu
She/Her Pronouns
#279422: May 3rd 2019 at 9:11:44 PM

[up][up] There was no date attached, but the particular book he seems to be selling seems to be one published in 2017.

So, no one can defend it by saying its an old quote.

And, welp. He's really trying to get to that coveted number 1 worst candidate spot. Sorry, Biden. You can merely sit a sliver above it.

Edited by AzurePaladin on May 3rd 2019 at 12:13:01 PM

The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -Fighteer
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#279423: May 3rd 2019 at 9:14:09 PM

Thanks to their dreadful positions on foreign policy alone, he's still above Gabbard and Sanders. That's about it.

Edited by Rationalinsanity on May 3rd 2019 at 1:14:31 PM

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#279424: May 3rd 2019 at 9:15:21 PM

But as far as I'm aware Gabbard isn't really being considered seriously, so that's something right?

I honestly have to wonder why he even wants to be President.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#279425: May 3rd 2019 at 9:16:52 PM

Sadly that probably will look good for his base of older people.

It must be hard to empathize with a generation that has to become Uber drivers to make ends meet.

Biden must be counting on young people not voting much in the primaries to win.

Edited by M84 on May 4th 2019 at 12:17:58 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised

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