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M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278201: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:31:02 AM

[up]The idea is that they will feel "betrayed" because she didn't deliver 100% of what they wanted. They didn't get their unicorn, so they're going to take their ball and stay home.

Edited by M84 on Apr 23rd 2019 at 12:32:40 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#278202: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:35:16 AM

I’m pretty sure getting subsidized childcare or student loan forgiveness passed would be enough to get people SPRINTING to the polls to re-elect her so she could finish the job.

Edited by wisewillow on Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:35:25 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278203: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:36:28 AM

Or they will be convinced that she's just another "sleazy politician" and stay home in disgust.

Disgusted, but not surprised
wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#278204: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:37:28 AM

... remember how much people loved FDR? He didn’t get everything passed in his first term.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278205: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:38:42 AM

[up]I remember when Obama's approval ratings fell even though he still managed to be re-elected by a good margin.

Also...the Democratic voter base has changed somewhat considerably since FDR's time.

And hey...even if it does happen with Warren, it probably won't be a serious issue in terms of whether she can get re-elected or not. Obama still trounced Romney, after all.

Why are we even talking about this now? The primaries haven't even really started yet. How did we get into wondering whether Warren's strategy (which we haven't even seen yet because the primaries haven't begun in earnest yet) will hurt her chances of re-election?

Edited by M84 on Apr 23rd 2019 at 12:43:36 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#278206: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:42:43 AM

That’s the nice thing about popularism, she won’t have actually made a promise. Without something specific to call her on people will just make a call on if things are better or not.

As for the unicorn brigade, they never vote for a candidate twice, if we can con them into voting for us once I’ll call it a win, they’ll never vote for us if we get elected even if we could produce a unicorn from thin air.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#278207: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:43:26 AM

The primaries may not have not started but everyone is preparing,it's something of a warm up

His approval rating fell and he lost the senate and house as I recall,

edit:

> will hurt her chances of re-election?

oops that was my doing when i posed a hypethical about Warren winning and dealing with reelecion

[up][up]

Edited by Ultimatum on Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:45:14 PM

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Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#278208: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:44:43 AM

I don't really believe people turning on Warren is worth worrying about, if that's a realistic fear then I don't see any reason to believe it's unique to her. Which means it's just something that might happen and it's not worth focusing on.

And if it's not realistic then it's not a problem and thus doesn't matter.

Either way it's not a problem with Warren specifically.

His approval rating fell and he lost the senate and house as I recall,

That was the normal ebb and flow of American politics compounded by the passage of the ACA which massively boosted Republican turnout.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:45:36 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#278209: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:45:22 AM

Obama spent so much political capital on getting PPACA passed that the backlash cost him Congress. He was unable to move significant legislation after that. It's a risk any Democratic President takes.

What scares me is that we could continue this cycle, with unicorn brigadiers showing up in droves to elect a popular Democrat, watching them push through one or two big pieces of their platform, then getting disappointed when they don't get everything they want, and failing to show up for six years so that Republicans can claw things back.

Edited by Fighteer on Apr 22nd 2019 at 12:46:41 PM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278210: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:45:40 AM

I think it's weird to be talking about this now because Warren isn't even close to being President yet.

Edited by M84 on Apr 23rd 2019 at 12:45:51 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#278211: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:49:33 AM

That's the nature of hypotheticals,it hasn't happened yet but what could happen dude?

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#278212: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:50:48 AM

I think Warren is reasonably close to becoming president, in that it's foreseeable that she might. Way closer than any other arbitrary person, anyway.

Edited by Clarste on Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:51:20 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278213: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:51:43 AM

I just think such a discussion would be more relevant if/when Warren wins in 2020 and we've seen her in action on campaigns and in debates.

[up]Well obviously she's closer than most of the billions of people on this planet. That's not what I meant.

She'll be close when she's the Democratic candidate against Trump and polling well against him.

Edited by M84 on Apr 23rd 2019 at 12:53:08 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#278214: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:52:35 AM

Warren isn't the only Democratic candidate with strong progressive policy proposals, and the same "unicorn" logic would apply to any of them.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#278215: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:53:46 AM

I can’t wait for the debates. It’ll be a glorious mess with this many people. Really hoping we’ll get to see some good policy arguing. I’d love to see Warren verbally obliterate Biden.

I want this too, except I want to see her verbally obliterating Sanders.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:54:01 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#278216: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:53:52 AM

Or they may be concerned of overspending. Just because Republicans have forfeited any credibility on the deficit front with the Trump tax cut does not mean that voters won't worry about the cost.

Regarding PPACA, one big problem with that is that it was healthcare and healthcare is a complicated and personal subject with lots of political minefields. Witness how Democrats leveraged the GOP's Mitchcare as a winning 2018 platform. That's why I am not sold on Medicare For All, IMO it's too politically risky for a modest payoff (as diminishing returns have set in).

As for Warren, my principal argument against her being the 2020 nominee is that she's an underperformer in Senate elections. And the pattern of her 2018 Senate election (following what is said on 538) sounds like a backlash from wealthy suburbanites was a big reason for this, which is a problem considering that the House majority is grounded on suburban voters.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278217: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:53:55 AM

[up][up][up]Yes it will. But we haven't been talking about them for the last couple pages.

[up][up]I want to see both Biden and Sanders beaten down verbally. I'm not 100% sold on Warren, but I'm far less sold on those two.

[up]Yeah, I'm wondering just how much political capital it will take for Warren to pass everything she has proposed so far.

Edited by M84 on Apr 23rd 2019 at 12:56:28 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#278218: Apr 22nd 2019 at 9:57:10 AM

... remember how much people loved FDR? He didn’t get everything passed in his first term.

Remember how his first two Republican Opponents basically said "We don't like the Great Depression, but we're not going to do anything about it because doing anything about it is Unconstitutional"? Pretty hard for anyone to lose against someone who basically says "Do nothing until the problem goes away". Especially when, back then, the Media didn't exist to spin words for Political Parties and Politicians.

Trump certainly isn't going to run a Campaign like that, and even if he did, we now have Fox, Breitbart, and a million other Right-Wing and Fascist/Reactionary Sources that would spin it to be something. So whoever the Democratic Candidate is, they're going to need to have a plan that is both appealing and marketable.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#278219: Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:01:33 AM

Just as a side-note, I find it honestly amusing how Andrew Yang isn't even mentioned anywhere in this thread[lol]

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#278220: Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:02:31 AM

Who?

What's his polices and why should we consider him

(we are now,mission accomplished?)

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278221: Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:02:54 AM

He's an odd duck, being an entrepeneur with pretty much no political experience who supports UBI.

Edited by M84 on Apr 23rd 2019 at 1:03:42 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#278222: Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:03:58 AM

[up]x2The only thing I know about Yang is that he's the only Democrat to support a Universal Income; Something I approve of, but that's literally all I know about his Policies. I do know he got enough unique donors to get into the Debates, though, so we'll learn more about him in the Debates.

Edited by DingoWalley1 on Apr 22nd 2019 at 1:04:14 PM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278223: Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:04:43 AM

He calls it the "Freedom Dividend": $1000 a month to every American from age 18~64.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#278224: Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:04:44 AM

The most "notable" thing about him probably is that he is the next meme-president 4chan wants to get into office, though not to such a crazy degree as Trump.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#278225: Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:05:56 AM

As you might have guessed from the name, he's of Taiwanese descent, born in NY to immigrant parents from Taiwan.

He founded something called Venture for America, a non-profit dedicated to encouraging young entrepeneurs in the USA.

Yang seems particularly concerned about automation and what it will do to the job market. Hence the UBI.

Edited by M84 on Apr 23rd 2019 at 1:11:17 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised

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