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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#276776: Apr 7th 2019 at 10:49:51 PM

Yeah, your statement seems to imply Chelsea Clinton is some important member of the democratic party, but that really isn't the case. This isn't to say that she doesn't merit being criticized if she's doing something harmful, but the context in which you brought her and Mc Cain up feels like it's giving them undue importance.

It's not about an "easy target" but rather who exactly is the bigger contributor to the problem.

I really don't think this is an issue of not being able to call out democratic politicians who are problematic - Joe Biden has been taken to task numerous times in this thread for his inappropriate behavior towards women, being shitty to Anita Hill, dumb comments about "millenials", and so on.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Apr 7th 2019 at 1:51:26 PM

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#276777: Apr 7th 2019 at 10:50:18 PM

Meghan Mc Cain is notorious for making everything about her. That's really her only role on "The View", whatever the topic, she always manages to somehow present herself as the poor victim. And she is great in distracting from the topic at hand by trying to bring something more or less unrelated and throw accusations as various known Democrats or left-leaning organisations. The mental gymnastic is often impressive to watch. Though it is only fun, when the other panel members call her out on her BS.

I'm not aware that Chelsea Clinton has a TV show or is in any position of power in the government, so I don't see why her opinion doesn't matter more than the opinion of anyone else. Just because her surname?

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#276778: Apr 7th 2019 at 10:50:35 PM

I mean I just find the entire jump non-sequitur, like the guy didn’t rant about how he was going to kill her to defend Israel, he didn’t bring up the recent accusations of anti-semitism, it was a pretty standard “mooslims bad, me shoot” rant from my understanding.

Like if you want to talk about the general issues with conflation of criticising Israel and being anti-Semitic that’s a fine conversation to have and there’s plenty of ground to cover. However, when you bring it up in response to an assassination attempt that has a different motive it seems like you’re not talking about the attack’s causes so much as trying to shoehorn in a discussion you wanted to have anyway.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
golgothasArisen Since: Jan, 2015
#276779: Apr 7th 2019 at 10:50:39 PM

Ah yes, the definition of trolling: Calling for a healthier atmosphere of discourse after a planned terrorist attack motivated by the mainstreaming of an unhealthy atmosphere of discourse.

If you want other names than just these, look at a list of any and all Democrat Congressmen and women who are affiliated with AIPAC. While a select few (the most notable names being Sanders, Warren, O'Rourke) refused to attend this year, the star speaker was Nancy fucking Pelosi. AIPAC's complicity in the shift of discourse towards attacks on Islam cannot go unmentioned, and anyone who attends the conference or receives funds from them is similarly complicit.

It's pretty ironic that people here are saying that "actually, there was a push against Chelsea Clinton," considering others in here are also defending her.

Edited by golgothasArisen on Apr 7th 2019 at 12:51:46 PM

"If you spend all your heart / On something that has died / You are not alive and that can't be a life"
AzurePaladin She/Her Pronouns from Forest of Magic Since: Apr, 2018 Relationship Status: Mu
She/Her Pronouns
#276780: Apr 7th 2019 at 10:52:27 PM

Okay. I've got several things.

One, not everyone on the Left and Center who agreed with Clinton "is in bed with AIPAC". AIPAC is not some huge entity that can do anything it wants, its a lobbying group for politicians. 2, I'm going to note that "Zionism" is being used unironically as a pejorative to point out that the word refers to the desire for a Jewish state to exit - you can oppose the actions of the modern state of Israel while still supporting its right to exist.

[up] AIPAC, again, is not all powerful - there are plenty of other sources of Islamophobia. We shouldn't single out AIPAC.

Edited by AzurePaladin on Apr 7th 2019 at 1:54:26 PM

The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -Fighteer
golgothasArisen Since: Jan, 2015
#276781: Apr 7th 2019 at 10:57:07 PM

I am not unironically using the word Zionism. The whole point is that they're using it to defend their bigoted beliefs. Zionism isn't inherently an Islamophobic movement (although one could argue that the state of Israel itself is). It's like when a Christian uses the Bible to defend homophobia. The Bible doesn't actually say any shit that's very anti-gay (aside from a couple passages that are rendered void with the New Testament), it's just an excuse they have.

And the whole point is that, yes there are other perhaps larger sources of Islamophobia on the right. But the important thing is to criticize sources of Islamophobia on the left as well. Do not allow it to fester.

Edited by golgothasArisen on Apr 7th 2019 at 12:59:25 PM

"If you spend all your heart / On something that has died / You are not alive and that can't be a life"
AzurePaladin She/Her Pronouns from Forest of Magic Since: Apr, 2018 Relationship Status: Mu
She/Her Pronouns
#276782: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:02:32 PM

[up] Wasn't planning to let it fester. However, this does feel like it could be brought up in the Islamophobia thread or something, and not as some of the first posts about a far-Right assassination plot.

The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -Fighteer
TheRoguePenguin Since: Jul, 2009
#276783: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:02:43 PM

It's important, sure, but how is it relevant? What about this guy's motives suggest he was anything other than some racist jackass?

You're conflating two different things because they share the barest of connections.

golgothasArisen Since: Jan, 2015
#276784: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:09:42 PM
Thumped: This post has been thumped with the mod stick. This means knock it off.
"If you spend all your heart / On something that has died / You are not alive and that can't be a life"
Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#276785: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:20:11 PM

I mean, I'd love to see them apologize for any islamophobic comments they might have made, but it's a little weird to call them out specifically after this incident, as if they're directly at fault for it.

But sure, it'd be cool if literally everyone who's made islamophobic comments in the past all collectively apologized right now. Really cool.

golgothasArisen Since: Jan, 2015
#276786: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:23:47 PM

You're not really helping by strawmanning here, y'know. I'm not asking for everyone to collectively apologize for bigotry, that's silly. I'm asking for people to notice these dogwhistles and other sources of bigotry on both sides - not just the opposing side - and condemn those who use them. Show that there isn't any place for people who will casually shift to these talking points.

"If you spend all your heart / On something that has died / You are not alive and that can't be a life"
Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#276787: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:26:27 PM

How's that a strawman? Everyone should apologize. Which side they're on doesn't matter.

I mean, they don't have to do it all at once. Literally all of them should apologize though.

Edited by Clarste on Apr 7th 2019 at 11:27:03 AM

golgothasArisen Since: Jan, 2015
#276788: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:27:55 PM

Sorry, it just sounds like you're sarcastically simplifying my argument there. If that's not the intent, I apologize.

"If you spend all your heart / On something that has died / You are not alive and that can't be a life"
BlueNinja0 The Mod with the Migraine from Taking a left at Albuquerque Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Mod with the Migraine
#276789: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:29:39 PM

When you read about a nonsensical rule, your first question shouldn't be "What idiot comes up with rules like these?", but "What incident made this rule necessary?"
IMX, about 9 times out of 10, when you read a law, the answer to the second question is usually "Some idiot did something utterly, butt-clenchingly, stupid (and/or fatal)." The other 1 out of 10 times tends to be corruption.
Of course he cooperated. He didn't think anything bad would happen to a white man for threatening a Muslim Somalian-American woman.
Anyone want to bet Trump pardons him during the election season?
It's because of people like them that Ilhan Omar has become such a reviled figure in US politics that gains enough attention from either side to receive this many attacks or threats.
I cannot see how you're serious. Do you know what Ilhan Omar did to become a "reviled" figure? Be publically Muslim. That's it. End of story. It's literally the only thing that Fox News viewers need to convince them to threaten to kill her.
and faux pundits like Mccain and Clinton
Since when was Chelsea Clinton a pundit of any kind?

That’s the epitome of privilege right there, not considering armed nazis a threat to your life. - Silasw
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#276790: Apr 7th 2019 at 11:35:59 PM

Chelsea Clinton is a pundit?

Edit:[up] Oh, good, I was fearing I was completely ignorant about something important.

Edited by Swanpride on Apr 7th 2019 at 11:36:56 AM

3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#276791: Apr 8th 2019 at 1:09:05 AM

Nielsen ist out'. Trump Tweet.

Kevin Mc Aleenan, the Commissioner for US Border Protection and Customs will take over as Acting Secretary.

"You can reply to this Message!"
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#276792: Apr 8th 2019 at 1:29:57 AM

Anyone wanna take bets on Sheriff Joe getting the nomination for the position going forward?

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#276793: Apr 8th 2019 at 2:24:11 AM

Bernie outlines his agenda with Trevor Noah.

Honestly, I'm very impressed.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#276794: Apr 8th 2019 at 2:24:40 AM

Also, that claim that Trump has been mostly quiet on Rep. Omar? That's not true.

From Vox: Trump attacks Rep. Ilhan Omar hours after a supporter was charged with threatening to kill her

President Donald Trump sought to drive a wedge between Jewish voters and the Democratic Party on Saturday by reigniting allegations of anti-Semitism against Rep. Ilhan Omar — just hours after one of his supporters was charged for threatening to kill her.

Speaking before the Republican Jewish Coalition’s annual convention in Las Vegas on Saturday, Trump referenced a weeks-old controversy involving Omar, a freshman Democrat from Minnesota and one of the first Muslim women to serve in Congress.

In February, Omar alleged on Twitter that pro-Israel sentiment in Washington was being bought by pro-Israel lobbyists. Her remarks prompted politicians from both parties to condemn her remarks, with some labeling them as anti-Semitic. The Congresswoman later apologized for her tweets.

On Saturday, Trump gave the Congresswoman a back-handed compliment about the dust-up.

“Special thanks to Rep. Omar of Minnesota,” the president said. “Oh, I almost forgot. She doesn’t like Israel ... I’m so sorry!”

Trump delivered his disparaging remarks against Omar just hours after police in New York charged a man for threatening to assault and murder her.

Patrick Carlineo Jr., an avowed Trump supporter, was arrested Friday for calling Omar’s office and delivering an expletive-filled rant that included violent threats against the elected official.

“Do you work for the Muslim Brotherhood? Why are you working for her, she’s a fucking terrorist? I’ll put a bullet in her fucking skull,” Carlineo allegedly told staffers, according to the criminal complaint filed by the US Attorney’s Office in the Western District of New York.

The 55-year-old suspect reportedly later told investigators that he “loves the president and that he hates radical Muslims in our government.”

This is part of Trump's ongoing efforts to alienate Jewish voters from the Democratic Party.

Edited by M84 on Apr 8th 2019 at 5:26:50 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Grafite Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: Less than three
#276795: Apr 8th 2019 at 2:34:17 AM

He is the one who courted and excused the "Jews will not replace us" chanters and yet it is the democratic party that is anti-semitic, sure.

Life is unfair...
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#276796: Apr 8th 2019 at 4:20:23 AM

I feel like right-wing Islamophobic extremism and the way it manifests among moderate circles are two separate conversations we need to be having. Because while both have real-world consequences... the latter doesn't led to the former. And Chelsea Clinton isn't important to anyone except her own family, so if we're going to namedrop her as complicit, we might as well namedrop everybody whose ever said something Islamophobic. Now, obviously we don't have the time or resources to find all those names, we need to focus on talking heads with a following, people who reach an audience. So we can talk about Meghan McCain, but if you're looking for such a person on the left, Bill Maher is a more relevant name than Chelsea Clinton here.

i'm tired, my friend
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#276797: Apr 8th 2019 at 4:23:05 AM

Bill Maher's been at it a lot longer too.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#276798: Apr 8th 2019 at 4:44:31 AM

Bill Maher belongs to the "left"? That's news to me....

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#276799: Apr 8th 2019 at 4:52:08 AM

Yes,he's a pundit with left views,just like Glen beck is a ring wing pundit

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#276800: Apr 8th 2019 at 4:53:07 AM

Glenn Beck actually changed his tune entirely after Trump got elected, surprisingly enough.

Watch Symphogear

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