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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
RainingMetal (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#276002: Mar 29th 2019 at 8:55:41 AM

The fact that the English language has failed to have gender neutral pronouns all this time means that we've failed as a society.

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archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#276003: Mar 29th 2019 at 8:56:10 AM

Republicans care about issues. Republicans couldn't care less about race, and because they dont care about race are seen as racist. Because not caring about race is somehow racist.

I’m just gonna stop you right there. What?

Do you honestly believe this, or is it just a dogwhistle for something far worse?

They should have sent a poet.
StephanReiken Since: May, 2010
#276004: Mar 29th 2019 at 8:56:47 AM
Thumped: This post was thumped by moderation to preserve the dignity of the author.
3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#276005: Mar 29th 2019 at 8:57:28 AM

[up][up]Honestly, that was the moment this went away from a discussion and became yet again another debate.

Edited by 3of4 on Mar 29th 2019 at 5:01:44 PM

"You can reply to this Message!"
RainingMetal (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#276006: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:00:45 AM

The pragmatic thing for the Republican party to do is to reject their racist base and try to reach towards the common folk. Hijacking minority states could turn election results in their favor if they gave up the losing strategy of white power.

Of course, they are anything but. No sane person would consider Trump representation to be good PR.

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Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#276007: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:01:35 AM

Going to change the subject a moment,because the democrats want to " subpoena Mueller report if it’s not delivered by Tuesday deadline"

Source

They can do that? If they do attempt to do this does it have a chance of succeeding?

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#276008: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:03:26 AM

Republicans couldn't care less about race

...<facepalm>

Edited by M84 on Mar 30th 2019 at 12:03:45 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#276009: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:03:32 AM

[up][up][up][up][up] So...you genuinely believe the Republican Party has no issue with racism? None at all?

Do you live under a fucking rock?

Edited by archonspeaks on Mar 29th 2019 at 9:05:56 AM

They should have sent a poet.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#276010: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:03:58 AM

There were many attempts to get the Republicans to appeal to conservative Hispanics and blacks over the past 40 years (starting under reagan). Every time, the Republican party doubled down on racism and worked to disenfranchise black voters and make use of voting laws so their votes didn't count.

Because there is a serious white supremacist movement in the party. I recommend people watch the Netflix Documentary 13th.

As for votes being erased, the premise of that statement depends on the idea that no one can build a state-based coalition. Which the whole idea of the EC and state-based democracy is about.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Mar 29th 2019 at 9:07:06 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#276011: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:06:13 AM

There was a time when it didn't, back when the Republican party was actually the progressive one.

But that was then, and this is now, and right now the Reds are very much outrageously racist.

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#276012: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:07:07 AM

The GOP's base has been radicalized by the likes of Fox News; the flames of white supremacy have been fanned for too long. That's kinda the problem: they're stuck in a position where they have no choice but to double down, essentially, because it's what their base wants.

RainingMetal (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#276013: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:07:32 AM

After all Lincoln was the first Republican. Then at one point in history the two parties did a "Freaky Friday" Flip.

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Fighteer MOD Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#276014: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:08:56 AM

We're going to have a mod chat with Stephan Reiken about this propaganda they seem to believe in.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
GoldenKaos Captain of the Dead City from Cirith Ungol Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Captain of the Dead City
#276015: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:09:06 AM

The Democrats have become more and more identitarian. They care about race. They specifically go out of their way to talk about this. They use race as a way to gain power.

Republicans care about issues. Republicans couldn't care less about race, and because they dont care about race are seen as racist. Because not caring about race is somehow racist.

I find this laughable to be honest. Republicans ARE identitarian. They play identity politics all the time, it's just "white people" or "Christians" instead. They have numerous individuals who think "the blacks" would have been better off in slavery rather than free and "on welfare".

Democrats acknowledge racism is still an institutional problem within the US. The Republicans deny that. They're not ambivalent towards race, they're ignoring it because the current balance favours them - acknowledging that would mean either having to come out as being actually racist (rather than simply fine with being institutionally and systemically racist) or by taking steps to fix it.

"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."
ShinyCottonCandy Everyone's friend Malamar from Lumiose City (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Everyone's friend Malamar
#276016: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:11:21 AM

I'd like to add that not treating a person of a minority race differently than the majority race is not the same as not being racist. Keeping on your shoes when you enter a Japanese person's house is very disrespectful, even if you keep them on inside your white colleagues' houses. That's just the first example that I thought of.

My musician page
wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#276017: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:11:54 AM

Speaking of rural voters, here’s a twitter thread by someone from the rural south.

I grew up in the South. Many of my family members lived in “rural areas.” So, let’s be clear about something. The dogwhistles about “coastal elites” are about diversity and education.

I know which of the family members I don’t communicate with are Trumpers. They’re the ones that tried to make me feel bad for knowing things. The ones who mocked my enjoyment of learning as a child. They’re the ones who resented the kid that read instead of encouraging her.

They’re the ones who shocked me as a child by using racial slurs around me I’d never heard before. And yes, even as a kid I recognized that they used them in front of me, but not my grandmother who would have stood up to them.

They’re the ones who threw temper tantrums when my grandmother refused to force me to go to church with them. They’re the ones who stood right there and said I was going to end up in hell.

They’re the ones we stopped visiting after that.

Obviously, that’s not all rural voters. But that’s the driving force behind the salt-the-earth politics of the GOP base. I know these people. Don’t bullshit me about this average Joe sitting in the diner worried about his mom and pop shop bullshit.

They love to say it’s because of “coastal elites” trying to tell them how to live. The reality is their resentment of not being able to impose their way of life on others. And no matter how much you try and accommodate them, they just resent harder.

When the media outlets and “nice guy” politicians use the “coastal elites” dogwhistle, those of us who grew up aware of those family members know exactly who is being pandered to.

It’s not “real America” — it’s RESENTFUL America. That’s why they champion bully tactics.

People worry about their jobs everywhere. People worry about their kids everywhere. Living in a bigger city doesn’t make you less concerned about any of the normal things those in the outskirts are worried about.

Only one party is trying to control the bodies of half the population. Only one party is trying to impose their will on who can marry. Or serve their country. Or use the fucking bathroom.

And it’s not the party always bitching and moaning about “coastal elites” trying to tell them what to do.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#276018: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:15:02 AM

In 13th, they basically argued it went like this:

  • Black voters went with the Democrats under the New Deal because shitty as it was for blacks, it was still better than the Republicans who weren't talking economics at all.
  • Nixon created the War on Drugs and used dog whistled to bring the Southern Democrats in.
  • Reagan doubled-down on the idea that The War on Drugs could be used as a racist dog whistle to terrify whites about Angry Black Man criminals in their neighborhood. He also created the idea that Latin America was full of rapists and psychopaths bringing poison into schools.
  • George H.W. Bush continued these policies by expanding the bureaucracy behind them.
  • The Democrats actually adopted a "tough on crime" initiative under Bill Clinton to steal a lot of these racist votes. The price being horribly fucking over many offenders for minor crimes.
  • Republicans believed that they had to play to white fears even more so in order to win those votes back. Attempts to appeal to Hispanic and black voters gets thrown out by ultra-conservatives who argue they should just make their votes not matter with legalese by even more blatant methods.
  • Dubya and the privatization of prisons increased dramatically. Corporate money flowing into GOP coffers for the oppression of blacks in America and use of them in free labor.

The documentary GET ME ROGER STONE also noted that when Al Gore chaired the hearing on whether a recount should happen for 2000's election, every black Congressman tried to get a recount and said, "You won the election, Mr. President." However, no Senator (during a Red packed senate) would sign off on their bill to do a federal recount. Roger Stone had also paid white men to rush and occupy the recount buildings so they'd be shut down.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#276019: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:16:02 AM

McConnell to Trump: Health care’s all yours – The Senate majority leader signaled in an interview that he’s more interested in taking on Democrats than jumping into a divisive debate within his own party.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/28/mcconnell-health-care-trump-1242865

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#276020: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:17:35 AM

Trump-ism isn't the friend of churches in America.

He's a friend of the corporate churches.

It's a distinction a lot of people without much experience in religion or volunteer work with churches won't get.

But simple put, it's a big one. It's a poison in the heart of America like the subversion of news networks.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#276021: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:18:26 AM

>The Democrats actually adopted a "tough on crime" initiative under Bill Clinton to steal a lot of these racist votes.

I feel like this might be something to explore in more detail.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#276022: Mar 29th 2019 at 9:24:10 AM

The documentary nicely showed a lot of people talking about it who felt guilty about it (including black politicians0 and justified it to themselves as going after the "bad elements."

When the effect was disproportionate and misused horribly on communities as a whole.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#276023: Mar 29th 2019 at 10:03:35 AM

As I mentioned earlier The democrats want to subpoena Mueller's report and I'm trying work if its a logical course of action or not,or if its even possible,if not what are the alternatives?

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#276024: Mar 29th 2019 at 11:27:24 AM

RE: Electoral College

I'll reiterate a point I've made previous times it's come up - keep it in place, but follow the two States (New England area, iirc) that do proportional voting. As in, Clinton won NY State with 59.01% of the vote, Trump got 2nd with 36.52%, Johnson with 2.29%, and Stein with 1.4%

NY has 29 EC votes - therefore, Clinton would have gotten 17 EC votes, Trump would have gotten 11 votes (10.5908), Johnson maybe 1 vote (0.66), and Stein with nothing.

Conversely, Texas has 38 EC votes, and the results were: Trump at 52.23%, Clinton with 43.24%, and Johnson with 3.16% (and Stein at 0.8%).

So the breakdown under that idea would have been: Trump with 20 EC votes (19.76 rounded up), Clinton with 16 EC votes (16.34), and Johnson with 1 vote. Granted, that leaves 1 vote still floating, so not a perfect setup.

And in the swing states, the victory margin would have been nowhere near as pronounced, seeing as Trump carried PA by a paltry 44,000 votes, yet got all of their EC votes.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#276025: Mar 29th 2019 at 11:36:48 AM

Y'know what's better than proportionally assigning Electoral College votes?

Proportionally assigning votes without the Electoral College. It's a radical idea, but here's my pitch. For every vote that is cast for a candidate, we assign 1 vote to that candidate. Then the candidate with the highest number of proportionally 1:1 assigned votes becomes President.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Mar 29th 2019 at 12:36:59 PM

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