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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
I think the only thing that could make Cohen slightly sympathetic is the idea that while he was on board with all of the corruption, etc., he didn't go in expecting Trump to be a Politically Incorrect Villain, and was genuinely opposed to that, when he learned about that side of Trump.
This is certainly how Cohen is trying to present himself. I think it's... possible that this is true to some extent, as I don't know if Cohen (or anyone) really expected Trump's infamous "fine people on both sides" common regarding Charlottesville.
But like this was far from the first sign of Trump being super-racist and Cohen knew and worked for him for years without protest. And while I'm not sure of examples off-hand, I'm positive that Cohen publicly defended Trump's bigotry at various points.
Yeah, that's BS. Cohen was in every step of the way as Trump was running his housing projects in a nakedly racist fashion. Maybe he had moral problems with it, but the money and influence drowned those out quite thoroughly.
Edited by Fighteer on Feb 27th 2019 at 11:47:40 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"If Cohen has any sincere qualms I doubt it was about the racism or corruption, both were things that Trump has been engaging in for quite a while.
Rather I think it doesn't beggar belief that he was fine with "harmless" business corruption but became uncomfortable with the political crimes. After all, there's a reason that Trump's crimes never attracted significant attention from law enforcement before he became President, they were very much the norm. But political crimes are not the norm and thus change things, hence why I would not be surprised if he's sincere.
Which, as I've said, doesn't make him a good person. It just means he's a bad person who has some standards. No redemption involved.
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji YangCohen only turned on Trump after he was indicted by law enforcement and presented with the litany of his offenses. It was the prospect of spending the rest of his natural life in prison that got him to flip... and, ironically, Trump attacking his character after it leaked that he might do so.
Who knows; he may have some kind of newly discovered moral backbone, but I doubt it. His public repentance is pure PR as far as I am concerned.
Edited by Fighteer on Feb 27th 2019 at 11:54:33 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"![]()
Although The Mafiya =/ Putin and his circle (although there's definitely some overlap), Cohen himself had longstanding Russian mob ties, such that I'm not even sure I'd give him that much credit.
Edited by Hodor2 on Feb 27th 2019 at 10:53:32 AM
@HailMuffins
: In order:
- A supermajority in the US Congress is 66% of the vote, rather than any value that is above 50% of the vote.
- The formula that I should have used is number of yes-votes / total number of voting congresspeople, with total number of voting congresspeople obtainable simply by summing yes-votes with no-votes.
- What I actually did is simply divide the no-votes by the yes-votes... which is a nonsensical operation when it comes calculating anything vote-related, as it doesn't give any useful result whatsoever.
I didn't mean in the thread, I mean during the hearing. Norton or Maloney mentioned it and Cohen has mentioned it more than once.
Edit: The GOP are a bit broken record on attacking the witness's credibility.
Edited by GoldenKaos on Feb 27th 2019 at 5:06:10 PM
"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."Everyone thinks of themselves as the hero of the story. That's why our judiciary doesn't run on the honor system.
Everyone who does something shitty says, "It's okay that I did what I did. If you'd just hear me out, you'd understand why it's okay. If you just see things from my point of view, you'll realize that I was justified."
It's the job of other people to look at them and go, "Yeah, I get that you think you were right. But you weren't. You are, in fact, a garbage person."
Think of it like writing. Every writer thinks that what he just wrote is the hottest shit around, but that's why peer editing is so important. A trial judge and jury is the editorial staff on civilization.
People tend to be overly forgiving of themselves more than anyone else.
Edited by TobiasDrake on Feb 27th 2019 at 10:05:27 AM
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Now THAT's not true at all ![]()
![]()
Edit: wow, so my first impression of Gosar is 'what an unpleasant piece of work' and then I find out he promoted a Charlottesville "false flag" conspiracy theory...
Edited by GoldenKaos on Feb 27th 2019 at 5:08:55 PM
"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."As a UK resident, I'm not that familiar with relatively rank and file US politicians (if we consider members of congress rank and file) - these Republicans have been quite eye-opening...
Edit: here we go again, Michael Cloud (REP) opening with essentially 'for the record, this guy is going to jail for being a lying liar who lies'.
Edited by GoldenKaos on Feb 27th 2019 at 5:49:19 PM
"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."Here are the documents Michael Cohen brought to Congress
I'm inclined from all I've read to believe that Cohen is the ultimate sleazy lawyer BUT there is one Sympathy for the Devil motive in that he expected Trump to not turn on him completely after decades of work together.
But Trump is an aversion of Even Evil Has Loved Ones.
That betrayal at least stung a little.
But it's a small violin. Like toy size.
Edited by CharlesPhipps on Feb 27th 2019 at 12:06:25 PM
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.It may be worth a toy violin for Cohen, but it broke him into cooperating with the government, so it's a really big deal in the grand scheme.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
You're welcome. I got it from a live blog/forum What the Fuck Just Happened Today has been doing over the hearing
https://www.c-span.org/video/?458125-1/michael-cohen-testifies-house-oversight-committee&live

The only time's redemption has been mentioned has been to argue against it.
Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Feb 27th 2019 at 11:43:44 AM
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang