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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#271051: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:09:24 AM

@Wisewillow, I agree. While I may disagree about the state of the system, I think we have similar ways of dealing with that issue.

>Come out against this shit when the right attacks.

So what I was doing.

BlueNinja0 The Mod with the Migraine from Taking a left at Albuquerque Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Mod with the Migraine
#271052: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:11:31 AM

Do you condemn the violence of Antifa?
Of course! They're not being nearly violent enough!
Can we not do the "you're not explicitly condemning this so obviously you support it" shit?

Please?

Kinda hard for some people not to mimic Faux News, even when they should know better.
It's basically an argument for giving Northam a prize for basic decency, with the caveat that basic decency is abnormal in a teeming hive of racism and slavery.
I find it somewhat hard to believe that no white people in Virginia can surpass the base requirement of "basic decency."
I feel that we currently have s system where fascist violence can be taken care of by the system.
Currently, the fascist violence is supporting the system, because the head of the system is the one praising the fascists.

That’s the epitome of privilege right there, not considering armed nazis a threat to your life. - Silasw
Eschaton Since: Jul, 2010
#271053: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:11:55 AM

Of course the right-wing would present "antifa" solely as a violent threat. It serves their own narrative and allows them to deflect, while simultaneously discrediting the wider work of anti-fascist organizations.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#271054: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:16:53 AM

I haven't even heard of antifa doing anything at all recently.

SciFiSlasher from Absolutely none of your business. Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#271055: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:18:24 AM

[up][up][up] [awesome][awesome][awesome]

So what I was doing.

Nope, you opened up with "So do you support Antifa?" and then acted like we should just not talk about it.

You don't get a pass on this, and you're certainly not just gonna weasel your way out of this one.

Edited by SciFiSlasher on Feb 12th 2019 at 1:18:39 PM

"Somehow the hated have to walk a tightrope, while those who hate do not."
Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#271056: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:25:22 AM

Yeah, Soble, what you did (intentional or not) was blatant both-sides and "whataboutism."

Maybe it's not your intention. But it's what you did.

Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#271057: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:25:53 AM

Yeah, Soble, what you did (intentional or not) was blatant both-sidesing with a false equivalence and a dash of whataboutism.

Maybe it's not your intention. But it's what you did.

Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#271058: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:28:47 AM

I find it somewhat hard to believe that no white people in Virginia can surpass the base requirement of "basic decency."

The Democrats in Appalachia and its immediate neighbors aren't exactly that great.

I remind you, the guy underneath him is being investigated for sexual assault. He denies it and he should get a fair hearing (the GOP actually have had tried to frame people for it in recent months plus love throwing the rapist accusation around — see Roger Stone and Bill Clinton) but given the fact the top 3 Democrats...before a Republican takes over....all have major scandals.

Well...maybe he is the best guy for the job right now.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#271059: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:29:46 AM

Yeah this an interesting statement about a person when their natural response to right-wing violence is not to condemn it, but to ask others to condemn other unrelated violence.

As for police racism, in some of the more severe cases you need criminal charges against both the racist officers and also their fellow officer who knew but didn’t arrest them and their commanding officers who covered up the instances of racial abuse/violence.

You then need to look at the people who trained, hired and oversaw the trouble officers, with such people either undoing retraining (as they failed to correct problem behaviour) or possibly being fired and given a lifetime ban from police work.

Dealing with police corruption doesn’t just mean firing the racist cop who attacked a black man, it means jailing him, his squad mate who stood idly by, his commander who covered it up, firing his trainer, the guy who hired him, his seargant who didn’t care that he was a racist piece of shit and his commander’s boss who didn’t care/notice that the commander was covering up abuses of power.

You need to jail not just the commiter of a crime but everyone crime adjacent who covered it up and then you have to fire/retrain everyone who had a responsibility for the crime adjacent people.

[up] Perosnally I find the AG to be better based on how he’s handled his scandal, though honestly it’s not the worst idea to have the lieutenant governor step down, hold a special election in November and then have Northam hand things over to the new lieutenant.

Edited by Silasw on Feb 12th 2019 at 7:34:11 PM

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#271060: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:32:57 AM

I will certainly say that I am not intentionally "both sides" as pushing someone around and beating them with sticks are not the same degree. What I was trying to say is that both are in the same category of beyond what we should have in or political discourse. Those are two different things to say.

Neither is what I was trying to do whataboutism. I was not trying to say that pushing the camera-man around wasn't wrong because antifa is also violent. I was trying to say that pushing the camera man around and everything more then that is wrong.

If you can't see the difference, I'm not sure I can help you.

TechPriest90 Servant of the Omnissiah from Collegia Titanica, Mars, Sol System Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Servant of the Omnissiah
#271061: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:34:01 AM

Frankly, my only argument against Antifa is that they're not targeting the right ones.

Going after the idiots at far-Right rallies is not going to solve much. But whacking their leaders sure as hell will deliver some results. Seen Richard Spencer anywhere much these days without someone to protect his scrawny ass after that punching incident?

  • inb4 I get chastised for advocating violence -

I'm not. But when someone is threatening violence against me because I'm not them, I'll be damned if I just try to save my hide. And that is precisely what Antifa is doing. I don't see them going and torching houses of worship or shooting up people or telling people like me to "go back home". This is my home.

I don't like their brutish ways, but even I can't deny that they get results - Which is intimidating neo-Nazi assholes into going away and not showing their ugly mugs in public with their vitriol. As long as they do that, works for me and I'm not complaining.

Feel free to crap on me for that.

The World is not black and white. And pacifism doesn't work with people who advocate genocide.

I hold the secrets of the machine.
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#271062: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:39:46 AM

The Democrats in Appalachia and its immediate neighbors aren't exactly that great.

I remind you, the guy underneath him is being investigated for sexual assault. He denies it and he should get a fair hearing (the GOP actually have had tried to frame people for it in recent months plus love throwing the rapist accusation around — see Roger Stone and Bill Clinton) but given the fact the top 3 Democrats...before a Republican takes over....all have major scandals.

Well...maybe he is the best guy for the job right now.

I don't see how a man who plausibly committed sexual assault is superior to blackface.

I mean, blackface is really bad but it's not a literal crime.

There have been two accusers so far and at least one of them has made themselves public, there has yet to be any evidence of a frame-up.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#271063: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:41:14 AM

[up]The wording was actually a bit ambiguous, is he saying Northam is the best guy for the job or that the lieutenant governor is the best guy?

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#271064: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:41:37 AM

I read that he as referring to Northam.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#271065: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:48:18 AM

Yes, I mean that our current situation is if Nothman resigns and the guy beneath him is guilty then he should resign.

And the guy beneath THEM is also guilty of blackface....and if he resigns then the Republicans take over.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#271066: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:48:22 AM

Oops, I misread that.

My objection is withdrawn.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
BlueNinja0 The Mod with the Migraine from Taking a left at Albuquerque Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Mod with the Migraine
#271067: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:50:57 AM

[up] I thought he was referring to the AG, who publicaly apologized for his own blackface incident without the right-wing media jumping on him first.

That’s the epitome of privilege right there, not considering armed nazis a threat to your life. - Silasw
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#271068: Feb 12th 2019 at 11:56:18 AM

Which, if nothing else, shows he's better at getting ahead of and dealing with his own scandals.

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#271069: Feb 12th 2019 at 12:01:00 PM

Yeah, of the three the AG is probably in a survivable situation.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#271070: Feb 12th 2019 at 12:20:14 PM

I find it somewhat hard to believe that no white people in Virginia can surpass the base requirement of "basic decency."

I find it hard to believe that there are places in the United States today where flying a Confederate flag and expressing your support for the KKK can get you a high five instead of a punch in the face. Yet here we are.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Oruka Since: Dec, 2018
#271071: Feb 12th 2019 at 12:27:45 PM

[up]It took active and deliberate effort to get there, whole PR campaigns. This is cultivated racism.

@Tech Priest: thank you. When a guy starts talking about killing, imprisoning, or exiling folks like me, my friends, my loved ones, my colleagues... I can't just sit on my hands and wait for it to pass.

Edited by Oruka on Feb 12th 2019 at 12:36:34 PM

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#271072: Feb 12th 2019 at 12:32:44 PM

This discussion about Uncle Phil is more fitting to either the Politics in Media or Race Relations threads.

Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#271073: Feb 12th 2019 at 12:34:18 PM

>And the whole family is in admiration before Donald Trump.

I'm not familiar with the lore here. This is early 90's Trump?

Oruka Since: Dec, 2018
#271074: Feb 12th 2019 at 12:37:08 PM

Yes. I took it to the Politics in Media thread.

TroperOnAStickV2 Call me Stick from Redneck country Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Call me Stick
#271075: Feb 12th 2019 at 12:46:22 PM

@ TechPriest: Yes. It's kind of like the original meaning of "outlaw".

Hopefully I'll feel confident to change my avatar off this scumbag soon. Apologies to any scumbags I insulted.

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