Nov 2023 Mod notice:
There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines
before posting here.
Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.
If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules
when posting here.
In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
@Fourthspartan 56: I suppose you might know this, but, actually yes, that is the name of an important Drow (Drizzt's mother is named Malice-she lives up to the title).
I do wonder how much of a Card-Carrying Villain one would have to be to use the name 'Malice'. I suppose, though, some people do use names like 'Savage'. I guess it might be a case of No Such Thing as Bad Publicity or possibly different etymology.
Edited by Protagonist506 on Jan 25th 2019 at 8:05:10 AM
Leviticus 19:34I do wonder how much of a Card-Carrying Villain one would have to be to use the name 'Malice'. I suppose, though, some people do use names like 'Savage'. I guess it might be a case of No Such Thing as Bad Publicity or possibly different etymology.
I actually did not know this!
That just makes it better
To be fair, I think this was probably bad for Trump in general. Most people do blame Trump for the shutdown IIRC. In fact, I think it was Fox News who stated that most people blamed Trump.
I was at my grandparents house and my grandpa plays Fox News all the time. Which is still odd given that they're actually the token democrats of my family.
Leviticus 19:34The funding measure puts an end to the longest government shutdown in US history. Congressional approval of the measure came quickly after the President conceded earlier Friday to mounting pressure over the ongoing shutdown, agreeing to a temporary funding measure that would allow federal employees to return to work but that does not include the billions of dollars in border wall funding he's spent the past month demanding.
"I will sign a bill to open our government for three weeks," the President said in an address on Friday, saying that he was announcing that "we have reached a deal to end the shutdown."
Trump said that "a bipartisan conference committee of House and Senate lawmakers and leaders" will work to "put together a homeland security package for me to shortly sign into law."
"Over the next 21 days, I expect that both Democrats and Republicans will operate in good faith," the President said.
Democrats have insisted throughout the shutdown that the President should sign a measure to reopen the government before they proceed to a debate on border wall funding. After weeks of resistance, Trump agreed to just that on Friday, paving the way for congressional Democrats and Republicans to approve a stop-gap funding bill.
The action on Capitol Hill comes after weeks of negotiations largely going nowhere. And it is not yet clear what kind of a deal can be struck between Democrats and Republicans in the weeks to come over border security.
Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer suggested at a news conference on Friday that the President's decision to accept a stop-gap funding measure amounted to a validation of the position taken by Democrats during the shutdown fight.
"The President has agreed to our request to open the government and then debate border security," Schumer said.
Schumer suggested he is optimistic that a resolution over border security can be reached once the government is reopened.
"We in Congress will roll up our sleeves and try to find some agreement on border security," Schumer said.
Democrats have maintained throughout the shutdown fight that they support border security measures, but not new funding for a border wall, a signature promise of Trump's campaign for the White House.
"We don't agree on some of the specifics of border security. Democrats are firmly against the wall," Schumer said on Friday.
"But we agree on many things such as the need for drug inspection technology, humanitarian aide, strengthening security at our ports of entry. And that bodes well for finding an eventual agreement," he added.
Color me impressed.
I think the fact that this was starting to disrupt air travel was what pushed it over the edge, not for Trump, but for Mc Connell and the senate. Major flight disruptions would be something directly noticeable, it could have major knock on effects, and the republicans lost the messaging war meaning the blame for that would fall on them. Also the fact that three of the more vulnerable Republican Senators, Gardner, Perdue, and Mc Sally, live in states with major hub likely factored into the decision as well.
You know, when Democrats went 'Oh yeah, the real fight back starts now' after the last midterms, I was like 'Yeah, sure, we'll see whether you'll actually get an opportunity for a real fight with the Republicans still in control of the Senate, instead of them just obstructing everything you try to do and then claiming you're the ones being obstructionist, like the last time'.
Of course I should have known that the Democrats and the very few decent Republicans would be helped in handing the Trump administration a major defeat by Donald J. Trump and the Republican Mainstream's two greatest enemies: Donald J. Trump and the Republican Mainstream.
Angry gets shit done.i mean, it's clear that what actually ended the shutdown was the murmurs of protesting by federal employees being furloughed, not actually the democratic party specifically. they hadn't... really changed their course of action at all?
"If you spend all your heart / On something that has died / You are not alive and that can't be a life"AOC gives some interesting thoughts.
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.Does anyone else find it weird that Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez went from "literally who?" to a major player in American politics in a something like a month?
AOC's belief that high income inequality is immoral and incompatible with democracy has historical antecedents that includes some of the founding fathers
cheers,I think the speed in which she's grown in popularity is due to the fact she's a new face in politics so people are eager to support,my concern right now is that Republican are already getting to work smearing her name like they did with Hilary
have a listen and have a link to my discord server![]()
Unfortunately for them, they're failing miserably.
I mean... If right now they found and made public a sex tape where AOC is in bed with a trans little person, the internet would be abuzz with talk of how great it is that AOC supports the sexual freedom of transpeople and little people, guffawing at the idea that her base would be turned off her political views by her showing yet again that she's as human as the rest of us and there would be fifty interviews with the little person asking their opinion on everything from trans rights to the 70% marginal tax rate.
And rightly so, because most of the (non-#MeToo) sex scandals involving Conservative politicians aren't, really, scandalous to anyone outside their base because of what they did... They're scandalous because of what they were spitting fire and brimstone about in their political statements while they were doing it.
Edited by Robrecht on Jan 26th 2019 at 1:44:47 PM
Angry gets shit done.To be fair, Ocasio-Cortez isn't running for president and smear campaigns are much less effective at defeating House majorities than at defeating presidential candidates, as Nancy Pelosi demonstrated last November.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard FeynmanAOC is riding the Streisand Effect like it is a space ship.
Her positions are broadly popular with the public, but so far outside the overton window of the right that fox news and rightwing pundits in general think that describing them accurately is a solid way to attack her.
Spoiler: Having a talking head that earns enough money to be personally impacted by her proposal rail about that proposal is, in fact, a really effective way to help her political standing.
Sooner or later the rightwing media will probably catch on and start just lying about her, like they usually do, but it will be a lot less effective, given that she now has pretty free access to public attention, and is really good at calling out bullshit.
Then there is the just straight out hilarious errors, like using the video of AOC dancing in college to try to attack her. Like, what? How far out of touch do you have to be to think that would work?
There's a lot of Values Dissonance going on here.
Bluntly, my mother who is a die hard Trumpist hates whenever Fox News goes after AOC because she looks like someone's kid sister (her words—and she is 70). A lot of people's emotional response to candidates is completely uninformed by logic. So the attacks that made her hate Hillary for....some reason (being a woman her age) bounce off of AOC in her age/demographic.
A lot of pundits hate her because she is a woman of another age/race and are frustrated that it isn't the killer they hope it is.
Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jan 26th 2019 at 5:45:06 AM
Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.Yeah, I started out skeptical of her, but every day I find myself liking her more and more.
By the way, if you want something to fret over, Trump still has one last card to play- he could still declare a national emergency when the temporary funding is over.
He could, you know he could.
Edited by DeMarquis on Jan 26th 2019 at 8:56:23 AM
I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.

What exactly does hack mean to you? Because the definition I've been aware of is a person who is excessively partisan or mercenary enough to disregard intellectual honesty. And the position that a clear defeat of Trump's is actually an intentional tactic is most certainly a position free of intellectual honesty, hence why we see Shaun Hannity making that exact argument. So it's hardly unfair to call them a hack over that scorching hot take.
Furthermore, while your points about Trump are not wrong per-se they aren't really relevant for whether or not this is a defeat for Trump.
And considering how poorly he's done in regards to the shutdown I'm highly skeptical that this is anything other than a massive setback for him, Trump has clearly been shown that the shutdown is a losing strategy and while he may threaten and bluster he is still a fundamentally weak man and will unlikely be interested in throwing himself to the sharks again.
And if he chooses to do that then things will almost certainly go the same way they did here, Pelosi will run circles around him and his support will be shredded.
Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 25th 2019 at 9:12:41 AM
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang