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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#268526: Jan 24th 2019 at 6:53:15 PM

I think now would be a good time to point out that AOC has been appointed to the Financial Services Committee and the Oversight Committee. It's not like she's going to be doing nothing but talking and making waves on social media, she has actual important responsibilities in the House. Nor have I seen any indication that she'll brush off the advice of experts who can provide knowledge she lacks when making any decision.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#268527: Jan 24th 2019 at 6:55:37 PM

@wisewillow, M84: Those were intended as examples of the "centrists and establishment Republicans" I said were trying to warn democrats about their own Donald Trump and as examples of AOC either being somewhat ignorant about civics or dishonest; as far as I can tell the factual claims about positions AOC has taken are not untrue. I felt that the Atlantic article about the actual outcome of populists in power being negative regardless of their political leanings spoke for itself since that was based on actual academic work.

Edited by CaptainCapsase on Jan 24th 2019 at 9:58:59 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#268528: Jan 24th 2019 at 6:59:33 PM

You'll understand if I don't take Mike Huckabee sharing a Daily Mail article attacking her, seriously.

Did you even read that Hill article the op-ed linked?

Your sources are once again, unreliable.

And I'm saying this as someone who actually isn't a huge fan of Ocasio-Cortez and thinks populism in general is dangerous.

You've already acknowledged that a lot of conservative attacks on her are ridiculous bullshit. So why are you linking sources that actually treat that sort of bullshit as if it were credible?

Edited by M84 on Jan 24th 2019 at 11:01:51 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#268529: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:00:59 PM

The Week article is strikingly poor, it starts off with a very strong claim and follows up with false equivalencies, weak comparisons, and cherry-picked evidence. Not to mention the blatant strawman that is literally half of the article.

Instead of examining her actual policy it takes incorrect statements she made and acts as if they are representative without actually providing any evidence to back that up. It's the text equivalent of taking a few soundbites and tearing them apart without any greater context.

Literally, every politician makes incorrect statements, that doesn't mean they're something we shouldn't criticize but to act as if that's special or evidence of similarity to Trump of all people is a shocking display of intellectual dishonesty.

I have never pretended that AOC is perfect or even much of a wonk, she isn't. What she is, is a politician who has her heart in the right place who is also greatly charismatic and relatable. Does that mean she should be Speaker or (ugh) President? Probably not, but she's a novice and giving her time to grow before writing Cortez off as the Left's Trump is the actually reasonable thing to do.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 24th 2019 at 10:01:35 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#268530: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:01:12 PM

[up][up] I'm fairly sure I didn't link a hill op-ed? But let's go straight to the source for the week op ed's claims, namely Politifact: one pants on fire, three falses, and one mostly true. That's not a promising start.

Edited by CaptainCapsase on Jan 24th 2019 at 10:02:43 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#268531: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:02:57 PM

[up]You linked a The Week op-ed. The op-ed itself has a link to a The Hill article. The actual article doesn't actually prove the point The Week op-ed is trying to make.

Seriously, it really seems like you just pick random articles and op-eds with catchy headlines that seem to prove your point and hope the rest of us don't actually read them.

Edited by M84 on Jan 24th 2019 at 11:03:39 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#268532: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:03:14 PM

I'm fairly sure I didn't link a hill op-ed? But let's go straight to the source for the week op ed's claims, namely Politifact: one pants on fire, three falses, and one mostly true. That's not a promising start.

The Politifact article is laughably incomplete, to act as if it is a definitive view of AOC when it has such little data is transparently biased.

Especially when you're comparing her to Trump who has hundreds of statements on record.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 24th 2019 at 10:04:21 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#268533: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:04:24 PM

The Atlantic article was the only semi credible source you linked Cap, and that is less about Ocasio-Cortez and more populism in general.

Edited by M84 on Jan 24th 2019 at 11:04:37 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#268534: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:05:38 PM

Edited by CaptainCapsase on Jan 24th 2019 at 10:08:11 AM

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#268535: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:08:24 PM

NVM.

Unnecessary post.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 24th 2019 at 10:08:53 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#268536: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:08:27 PM

[up][up]Not really

Edited by LeGarcon on Jan 24th 2019 at 10:09:17 AM

Oh really when?
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#268537: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:11:27 PM

Something to keep in mind, is that she is really young. She's not even old enough to run for president yet.

Edited by megaeliz on Jan 24th 2019 at 10:15:44 AM

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#268538: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:14:39 PM

[up] Yes and? Either she has the necessary knowledge to make informed decisions befitting a lawmaker or she doesn't. I don't think she does, though looking through some of the stuff other representatives tend to say/do, I'm starting to feel like I've been a bit too hard on her, or too soft on congress in general.

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#268539: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:14:49 PM

Hell looking over AOC statements ranked as false it look to be one incident of her just saying shit (the pants on fire) and three incidents of her not understanding maths and number properly (not realising that Pentagon errors can count the same dollar multiple times, not realising that a person’s listed campaign spending can cover multiple elections and not realising that the military submits both an agreed upon request and a separate “stuff we’d also like” list).

Should she own up to those statments made in ignorance, totally, but that doesn’t make her a left-wing Trump.

Again, this seems more about your personal dislike of normal people having political power than anything else.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#268540: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:41:00 PM

A lot of people hate her for:

  • Overthrowing an established democrat.
  • Being socially media aware and going to the people for election versus the DNC (which people say is populism)
  • Being a young, attractive Hispanic woman who is outspoken (-cough- GOP)

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#268541: Jan 24th 2019 at 7:42:37 PM

As long AOC has the capacity to admit she's wrong, change her views, and adjust her policy views accordingly, I don't see the issue. She's not even thirty yet, and governing takes experience. She's already got the social media game on lockdown (and is going to teach a class to Congressman on how to use Twitter...) and the personality and background to relate to the common man. So on that front, she's going to get a bit of a pass for saying, occasionally, misleading, or outright stupid things. It happens. Even Obama and Hilldawg aren't immune to this, much as I'm loathed to admit it.

New Survey coming this weekend!
Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#268542: Jan 24th 2019 at 8:38:44 PM

So how respectable is the doomsday clock anyway?

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#268543: Jan 24th 2019 at 8:40:24 PM

It's weird that it's moving now of all times.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#268544: Jan 24th 2019 at 8:52:40 PM

I've looked at it's history and it seems rather arbitrary and unreliable.

Lorsty Since: Feb, 2010
#268545: Jan 24th 2019 at 8:53:17 PM

[up][up]I assumed it's moving because of the mess in Venezuela.

Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#268546: Jan 24th 2019 at 9:06:57 PM

[up] How would the Venezuela thing cause nuclear war?

archonspeaks Since: Jun, 2013
#268547: Jan 24th 2019 at 9:09:11 PM

They move it every year. It was 2 minutes to midnight last year as well so it hasn’t actually changed, it’s just in the news because they made an announcement about it.

It’s been staying at 2 minutes because of climate change, global political instability, and the breakdown of several key nuclear weapons treaties.

They should have sent a poet.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#268548: Jan 24th 2019 at 9:09:18 PM

[up][up]Possibility of US military intervention, followed by possible intervention by other nations who disapprove such as Russia...

But that's really unlikely.

Edited by M84 on Jan 25th 2019 at 1:10:18 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#268549: Jan 24th 2019 at 9:19:52 PM

Personally I'm actually really happy that she's doing this Twitter class thing, because just about everyone in Congress needs to learn how the modern day internet works.

And in any case, she literally just got the job. I'm not sure that there's enough of a record to really judge her effectiveness yet, regardless of opinions about populism.

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#268550: Jan 24th 2019 at 10:02:04 PM

They move it only once a year, to be precise, so it doesn't reflect the world at the moment in real time. The whole Cuban Missile Crisis began and ended before they could meet and adjust the clock to reflect the near disaster.


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