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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
And I'm not even saying those three are necessarily bad candidates, I'm not opposed to any of them yet (and haven't really picked a choice yet), but I do think there's an issue and a pattern on what we're choosing to focus on.
I don't see anyone throwing her under the bus, considering her decision a mistake does not mean that she's unacceptable as a candidate.
To me her position on tariffs to be far more serious but even that's not a deal breaker.
And I assure you that I don't give Beto a pass, his lack of experience(!) and spotty record mean that I'm not particularly enthused in him as a possible candidate.
Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 21st 2019 at 2:42:57 PM
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji YangWhat is Beto's issue, other than my complaint about him being better off running for Senate again as a) Senate seats are important and b) the "Rust Belt" path to the presidency seems much safer than a Sunbelt strategy?
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard FeynmanHe’s got a lack of high level experience and it’s unclear how much substance he has to him once one gets past the “younge, attractive, white, man” phenomenon that has the press drawn to him.
Stacy Abrams did just as well as he did in November but he’s the one being pushed to run by top democrats and getting a ton of press attention, it’s hard not to see some racism and sexism in what’s happening.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ CyranYeah and it’s been the Democrats blue whale for a while now, the press love the idea of Texas being a battleground state.
That’s not going to explain all of it though, as Beto would be highly unlikely to actually deliver Texas.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ CyranStacy Abrams did just as well as he did in November but he’s the one being pushed to run by top democrats and getting a ton of press attention, it’s hard not to see some racism and sexism in what’s happening.
Pretty much this, as someone who really liked Abrams I don't really appreciate the disproportionate amount of attention he received.
Made worse by the fact that his legislative record is very questionable, Current Affairs has a great article on it
.
For example, he opposed the funding of Israel's Iron Dome system. A reasonable position considering that Israel is an independent nation that should be able to fund its own defense projects, but he more or less immediately buckled after receiving a torrent of pressure from the pro-Israel lobby. That's not the actions of someone who sticks by their principles, which is a worryingly common trend with him. Beto either proposes something progressive and bold and then backs down later or never proposes anything progressive in the first place.
Upon closer examination, Beto just seems like an affable empty suit.
Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 21st 2019 at 2:58:54 PM
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji YangOn an unrelated note, there's one line in that article that make sme raise an eyebrow:
What are you trying to tell us, Jilani?
i'm tired, my friendYeah, that caused me to do a double take when I first read it.
The article is obviously coming from a pro-Sanders perspective to the point it's almost Bernie-Broish.
I still think the general gist of the argument is valid.
Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 21st 2019 at 3:48:33 PM
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
As they say, even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
Now I'm feeling really dirty for having voted for Beto, though. Between someone like him, and Ted Cruz...man, is there any politician in the U.S. that has some serious fucking principles? Honest question here.
"Somehow the hated have to walk a tightrope, while those who hate do not."Don’t feel dirty having voted for Beto, even at his worst he’s still miles better than Cruz.
Also a lot of the Beto issues aren’t ones caused by him, it’s the press and DNC leadership playing favourites with him over Abrams.
Edited by Silasw on Jan 21st 2019 at 9:17:14 AM
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ CyranExactly my thoughts.
I completely understand how you feel, but honestly, I think there are absolutely politicians with principle. It's just that the ones who don't are more obvious.
I would consider both Warren and Sanders to be principled, they've been consistent with their beliefs and positions even if it cost them (which is the ultimate determinate of whether or not someone truly believes something).
Or Gillibrand who rejected Al Franken even though she almost certainly knew that it would anger people aligned with the Democratic Party (which it did, one of her weaknesses is that some donors dislike her because of that).
This too.
An empty suit is better than a theocrat.
Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 21st 2019 at 4:16:57 AM
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang![]()
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Well, between Cruz and Beto, Beto's the easiest choice. So, don't necessarily regret voting for him, even as you promise not to do so if you can avoid it again.
This Presidential race, none of the candidates are pure and clean of scandal or sin. The goal is to find someone who you think is the best choice, and hope for the best.
Edited by AzurePaladin on Jan 21st 2019 at 4:17:20 AM
The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -FighteerKamala Harris Could Win The 2020 Democratic Primary
On Beto, you might call it cynicism or practicality depending on individual view point, but I kind of expect anyone running for President to have some questionable black marks against them.
Obviously everyone has different breaking points, but I don't see any good in going how voting for the better candidate (which he still was) makes you "dirty" or "lacking in principles". It doesn't help anything.
Politicians with Principles don't last very long. Successful Politicians generally have to play dirty at least sometimes no matter what. Just the nature of things.
Of course, that might be excessively cynical. And that isn't to say that such sorts don't show up (like AOC) but they're rare. And they're to be cherished.
But as several posters here have said, you generally don't have much of a choice except for the lesser of two weevils.
I hold the secrets of the machine.I wouldn’t even consider Beto an evil, it’s not that there’s anything wrong about him, he’d be a reliable democratic vote and support a number of progressive policies. There’s just nothing exceptional about him when it comes to policy or his record.
He’s run off the mill, not an evil (even a lesser one).
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ CyranIt bears repeating that Beto is from Texas — a Texas Democrat isn't going to gel completely with the Democrats' progressive vanguard. Them being angry over this seems like it's borne out of a fundamental misunderstanding of who he is.
The larger issue is that he's miscast as a Presidential candidate. He would be perfect running in the 2020 Texas senate election.
Edited by CrimsonZephyr on Jan 21st 2019 at 5:16:36 AM
"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."I thought Warren's handling of the issue was entirely correct. She made a falsifiable claim, and then she tested it. She took a risk. It could have come out the other way. It didn't.
I value this sort of scientific humility extremely highly. Furthermore, showing Trump's false promise and fundamental lack of integrity for what it was was elegant and beautiful. There could not have been a clearer, more black and white demonstration of good vs. evil, noble vs. vile in my value system.
And Wall Street sure needs regulating. Part if that is normative; their prestige and merit and self image needs to be reframed, for their own good.
Edited by Oruka on Jan 21st 2019 at 2:20:00 AM
I’m not sure on Beto running for the senate in 2020, he did well in 2018 but still lost, if the people of a state just decided not to elect you to a specific office it seems a bit off to try again two years later. I’d rather Beto for VP and have Castro run for the senate seat in 2020.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran

Mainly because a lot of progressives are obsessed with the idea of purity, and a flawless unicorn candidate, when one doesn't, and cannot exist.
New Survey coming this weekend!