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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#267826: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:22:08 AM

This argument of minorities making jokes at white people's expense being "punching down" gives me a strong feeling of deja vu.

Well that's a page-topper.

Edited by PhysicalStamina on Jan 19th 2019 at 10:22:30 AM

i'm tired, my friend
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#267827: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:24:39 AM

What strawman? I'm just stating a basic rule of comedy: taking shots at an entity more powerful than the joke teller is more acceptable than taking shots at one weaker than the teller.

POC taking shots at white people for not liking spice is the former: white people are dominant in the US, culturally, politically, etc. White people taking shots at other ethnicities for their food choices is the latter; members of the dominant group mocking those beneath them in the broad social heirarchy.

The strawman is that anyone is suggesting otherwise, no-one has said that making fun of white people is just as bad as making fun of minorities.

It's simply completely unreasonable to be surprised if people take offense, making fun of white people is going to piss some white people off. If one doesn't want that then they shouldn't make fun of white people.

The fact someone called it "white tears" simply makes it worse.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 19th 2019 at 1:25:36 PM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#267829: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:26:23 AM

...I didn't?

Yes, you did.

When you say this:

What strawman? I'm just stating a basic rule of comedy: taking shots at an entity more powerful than the joke teller is more acceptable than taking shots at one weaker than the teller.

That implies that anyone said otherwise.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#267830: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:26:38 AM

But someone else did, is the point?

Euodiachloris Since: Oct, 2010
#267831: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:27:33 AM

Punching up is making jokes at the expense of those running Monsanto or making bank convincing people who are living from paycheck to paycheck that burgers, fries, soda and a brick of an "apple" "pie" is a healthy meal.

Making jokes at the people who can't afford the time or money to prepare five servings of fruit and veggies a day with whatever condiments on top? Doesn't matter what their skin colour is — that's crass.

Edited by Euodiachloris on Jan 19th 2019 at 6:30:13 PM

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#267832: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:31:28 AM

But someone else did, is the point?

Is this aimed at me?

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#267833: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:37:01 AM

[up] No.

What I meant was "someone else did say 'white tears'".

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#267834: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:39:00 AM

[up]

Fair enough, I thought as much but I wanted to be sure.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jan 19th 2019 at 1:39:21 PM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#267835: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:51:43 AM

So to bring the discussion back from the brink...

What should Democrats say in response to Trump's offer? Obviously not "yes" as merely prolonging DACA for a while is not enough. I'd consider trading away the border wall for government reopening+HR1 (the great anti-corruption bill the House is working on)+DREAM Act+electoral reform, perhaps also amnesty.

Note that ignoring Senate Republicans/the compromise being unacceptable to them IMO is a feature, not a bug; that way they'll eat the blame for both the shutdown and for Trump not getting his wall if they reject the compromise. By this logic the compromise would have to be a big omnibus bill so that they can't cherrypick the parts they don't like.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#267836: Jan 19th 2019 at 10:58:43 AM

The rules of political hardball are well known (except maybe to Trump). Pelosi and company are working, even as we speak, on a perfectly reasonable counter proposal, based directly on the terms of his offer, which they know perfectly well the Republicans can never accept.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#267837: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:01:59 AM

You know I was thinking,what if they agreed to wall under the condition it was'nt anywhere the Mexican border?Like somewhere far far away from it,it ends up being a gigantic waste of funds,but the shutdown ends,and they have a useless wall thats nearwhere near Mexico and Trump comes off worse for agreeing to the bad deal

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#267838: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:03:52 AM

[up][up] Precisely because it's completely reasonable?

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#267839: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:06:13 AM

"Reasonable" is a matter of perspective, but yes. From our point of view reasonable would be spending that money on enforcing employment law in the border states, but no one is going there.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#267840: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:08:44 AM

This argument of minorities making jokes at white people's expense being "punching down" gives me a strong feeling of deja vu.

I'm kind of torn, personally. On the one hand, the point that white people are so used to a world not offending them that just talking about things honestly is wrongly viewed as hateful has merit. On the other hand, the "honest" in question here is a sweeping generalization based on faulty reasoning.

I'm not going to pretend "haha, White people only eat bland foods!" is anywhere near as bad as most punching down, but I don't really see how going "you know, that doesn't really make sense" is as a defensive as Sci Fi Slasher is trying to make it out to be.

Edited by LSBK on Jan 19th 2019 at 1:09:12 PM

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#267841: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:09:22 AM

Ultimatum's proposal is a little too obviously insincere, in my opinion.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#267842: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:20:13 AM

Yeah I'll admit Trump's not stupid enough to agree that,but he is a bad negotiator so they need to get him to agree to a deal benefits them more then him without him realising,least thats' how I'd do it,take advantage of the guy who's desperate for a good publicity and he'll agree to anything

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Oruka Since: Dec, 2018
#267843: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:22:26 AM

[up][up][up]THAT'S BRILLIANT. WHY IS NOBODY GOING THERE?

Also how to diminish demand of drugs from the US consumers? Aside from legalizing weed, which needs to happen faster.

LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#267844: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:23:53 AM

Stop doctors from getting people addicted for one.

But most of those problems are all vast and interconnected economic issues that there's no single or easy solution for.

Oh really when?
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#267845: Jan 19th 2019 at 11:27:21 AM

Also worth noting is that'd be a lose-lose scenario: The Trump wall is a bad idea primarily because it's a waste of money on something that wouldn't work.

Leviticus 19:34
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#267846: Jan 19th 2019 at 12:19:08 PM

@Oruka: if you are replying to me, its because large agricultural and hotel employers from the border areas benefit from illegals as employees (low wages, no benefits) and they donate large sums to Congressmen from both parties to protect that.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#267847: Jan 19th 2019 at 12:29:17 PM

Step 1: Legalize Weed, this will drastically cut the economy for the Cartels on the general street sale.

Step 2: Pass legalization that both A. dramatically reforms and tightens Pain Medication prescription and B. tightens the screws on the Pharma Industry which is happily enabling said fast prescription.

Step 3: Enhance Rehabilitation programs and favor them over prison sentences for use and possession. Ideally, use and possession (for reasonable use quantities) would be given 'Civil Service' Hours which would be served with Rehab.

Obviously, this is vastly oversimplified and would have to actually be worked out far, far more in detail.

Edited by 3of4 on Jan 19th 2019 at 9:30:05 PM

"You can reply to this Message!"
SciFiSlasher from Absolutely none of your business. Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#267848: Jan 19th 2019 at 12:34:08 PM

I think it's incredibly stupid to make fun of a group of people and then act as of them taking offense is unreasonable or unexpected. Also, "white tears"? Wow, you really are trying to as rude as possible, aren't you?

It's simply completely unreasonable to be surprised if people take offense, making fun of white people is going to piss some white people off. If one doesn't want that then they shouldn't make fun of white people.

Sorry, would you like me to change it to "white fragility" then? Because that is exactly what has happened here. White people hear about jokes that Po C have made about them, white people throw a hissy fit.

But hey, you're also the guy who equated a satirical article talking about "canceling white people" to groups like the Nation Of Islam.

Making jokes at the people who can't afford the time or money to prepare five servings of fruit and veggies a day with whatever condiments on top? Doesn't matter what their skin colour is — that's crass.

So, the working class white families who lost family businesses because of the rise of industrial blandness and industrialised shopping habits in combination with wartime rationing are getting punched up at because white can only mean privileged.

Good to know.

Whole cottage industries and farming communities have died to blandness and cultures changed for the more unhealthy as regional differences were steadily undermined in the race for efficiency. But, hey... punch away.

LOL look at you going to bat for the "white working class." Also, what kind of bullshit excuse is that? "Our food is bland because we can't afford seasoning!" As if Po C are somehow richer than you? And yes, if you are white, you automatically have white privilege. Doesn't matter if you're poor, disabled, LGBT+, or a woman. If you're white, that will still give you a pass on anything.

Let's not forget that you also refuse to see the first wave feminists as racists because they happened to be fighting for women's rights. Not for all women? Who cares, in your eyes, it's obvious that Po C can get fucked.

I'm not going to pretend "haha, White people only eat bland foods!" is anywhere near as bad as most punching down, but I don't really see how going "you know, that doesn't really make sense" is as a defensive as Sci Fi Slasher is trying to make it out to be.

It's not even punching down. Look at the posts I quoted above yours. Pure white fragility. Acting as if being a working class white person is somehow even remotely equivalent to being a Person of Color is the height of total bullshit.

"Somehow the hated have to walk a tightrope, while those who hate do not."
SciFiSlasher from Absolutely none of your business. Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#267849: Jan 19th 2019 at 12:34:43 PM

Also, I'm gonna leave this article here about how white people taking offense at jokes is nowhere the same as what white people have said about-much less done to-Po C.

"Somehow the hated have to walk a tightrope, while those who hate do not."
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#267850: Jan 19th 2019 at 12:34:46 PM

On effective immigration reform, I think that establishment democrats have been as hypocritical as the Republicans in avoiding addressing the real issues.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.

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