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In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#266826: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:43:56 PM

Individual opinions on the connotations of the word aside, not using the word when asked really isn't something to particularly difficult or something to really question.

Edited by LSBK on Jan 12th 2019 at 10:44:41 AM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#266827: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:44:24 PM

We generally try to avoid more gendered insults here.

Disgusted, but not surprised
RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#266828: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:46:35 PM

Is focusing on the gender implications an American thing? Since it seemed completely appropriate to me.

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#266829: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:47:38 PM

... c*** is INCREDIBLY rude and VERY gendered in America. There were awful t-shirts calling Hillary a c*** in 2016.

AzurePaladin She/Her Pronouns from Forest of Magic Since: Apr, 2018 Relationship Status: Mu
She/Her Pronouns
#266830: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:48:02 PM

[up][up] Pretty much. It gets thrown around a lot more in the UK and Australia, which makes listening to people swear in those locations uncomfortable at times.

Edit: [nja] again.

Edited by AzurePaladin on Jan 12th 2019 at 11:48:22 AM

The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -Fighteer
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#266831: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:50:15 PM

Is focusing on the gender implications an American thing? Since it seemed completely appropriate to me.

Not to downplay anything, I'm still curious why it apparently has those connotations in the U.S. versus everywhere else, apparently. But I guess the "why" isn't as important as the "is".

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#266832: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:51:25 PM

I did stop, I agreed that the other c-word was more appropriate. Really, both are gendered in their own way (though obviously with vastly different connotations if used in that context), and I believe both share a film rating zone with "fuck" in that a PG-13 film is allowed to have exactly one in it before it's bumped up to R. I could be wrong, though.

I have heard it used more often in recent years in non-gendered contexts as just another severe insult, and I've seen people explicitly trying to remove the gendered connotations the word has, so I was under the impression that it was a progressive movement, like when other slurs are reclaimed and/or stripped of their offensive connotations. Maybe to bring it more in line with the UK and Australia, as mentioned above.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jan 12th 2019 at 9:52:46 AM

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#266833: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:52:22 PM

Slang varies by country. And the term has very gendered implications by its very nature; it’s basically the ultimate swear word in the US, and it’s generally only used to be nasty and sexist.

HAHAHA oh. Using the female c-word is an immediate R rating.

[down] Correct. I can call myself queer, but if a random straight person calls me queer that might be very offensive depending on context.

Edited by wisewillow on Jan 12th 2019 at 11:53:52 AM

RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#266834: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:52:38 PM

I'm pretty sure reclaiming a slur means directing it at yourself to show people it has no power over you, not using the slur in the exact way it's always been used to refer to someone you don't like.

It's been fun.
nombretomado (Season 1) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#266835: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:52:56 PM

Kind of feels like we're getting off-topic here. C*** is a much more serious and offensive term in the US than UK/Australia and with it, gendered connotations, there's a lot of Americans here, let's keep that in mind for civil conversations.

And we can all agree Trump is abysmal.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#266836: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:55:31 PM

I mean, I wasn't using it to degrade a woman, I was using it to insult Trump, a sexist man, who deserves every insult in every language.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jan 12th 2019 at 9:55:50 AM

AzurePaladin She/Her Pronouns from Forest of Magic Since: Apr, 2018 Relationship Status: Mu
She/Her Pronouns
#266837: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:56:01 PM

[up] Pushover, do yourself a favor. Please. Drop. It. You're digging yourself deeper now.

Edited by AzurePaladin on Jan 12th 2019 at 11:56:32 AM

The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -Fighteer
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#266838: Jan 12th 2019 at 8:58:53 PM

Okay, dropped. I was ready to drop it earlier, but people kept continuing it. Now, it's dropped, and won't be picked up again.

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#266839: Jan 12th 2019 at 9:00:38 PM

EDIT: Removed.

Moving on- Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and others have been calling out CBS News, who just unveiled their 2020 election coverage team.

Their team doesn’t have a single black journalist. When white supremacy and voter suppression are major 2020 election issues.

Edited by wisewillow on Jan 12th 2019 at 12:06:22 PM

nombretomado (Season 1) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#266840: Jan 12th 2019 at 9:03:38 PM

The next person who continues in this vein will get thumped; I don't care if you're trying to clarify or if there's a different topic in the rest of the post. Everyone has already made their points clear enough.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#266841: Jan 12th 2019 at 10:05:02 PM

I liked that. It was pretty tactful, yet firm. As a Congresswoman, AOC needs to watch how she acts around the press, because she's in a position where the First Amendment is an actual thing to be cognizant of and not just a set of words that assholes break out whenever nobody wants to listen to their hate speech.

Unlike Trump's "Fake News" shit, this was a very specific criticism leveled at a clearly identified network over a legitimate problem, issued from her personal twitter account and not in any formal capacity as Congresswoman. In one tweet, AOC put every remark Trump's ever made about the press to shame.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#266842: Jan 12th 2019 at 11:14:33 PM

The Washington Post broke this story late yesterday night.

President Trump has gone to extraordinary lengths to conceal details of his conversations with Russian President Vladi­mir Putin, including on at least one occasion taking thepossession of the notes of his own interpreter and instructing the linguist not to discuss what had transpired with other administration officials, current and former U.S. officials said.

Trump did so after a meeting with Putin in 2017 in Hamburg that was also attended by then-Secretary of State Rex Tillerson. U.S. officials learned of Trump’s actions when a White House adviser and a senior State Department official sought information from the interpreter beyond a readout shared by Tillerson.

The constraints that Trump imposed are part of a broader pattern by the president of shielding his communications with Putin from public scrutiny and preventing even high-ranking officials in his own administration from fully knowing what he has told one of the United States’ main adversaries.

As a result, U.S. officials said there is no detailed record, even in classified files, of Trump’s face-to-face interactions with the Russian leader at five locations over the past two years. Such a gap would be unusual in any presidency, let alone one that Russia sought to install through what U.S. intelligence agencies have described as an unprecedented campaign of election interference.

The new details about Trump’s continued secrecy underscore the extent to which little is known about his communications with Putin since becoming president.

Rep. Eliot L. Engel (D-N.Y.), the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, said in an interview that his panel will form an investigative subcommittee whose targets will include seeking State Department records of Trump’s encounters with Putin, including a closed-door meeting with the Russian leader in Helsinki last summer.

“It’s been several months since Helsinki and we still don’t know what went on in that meeting,” Engel said. “It’s appalling. It just makes you want to scratch your head.”

The concerns have been compounded by actions and positions Trump has taken as president that are seen as favorable to the Kremlin. He has dismissed Russia’s election interference as a “hoax,” suggested that Russia was entitled to annex Crimea, repeatedly attacked NATO allies, resisted efforts to impose sanctions on Moscow, and begun to pull U.S. forces out of Syria — a move that critics see as effectively ceding ground to Russia.

At the same time, Trump’s decision to fire Comey and other attempts to contain the ongoing Russia investigation led the bureau in May 2017 to launch a counterintelligence investigation into whether he was seeking to help Russia and if so, why, a step first reported by the New York Times

It is not clear whether Trump has taken notes from interpreters on other occasions, but several officials said they were never able to get a reliable readout of the president’s two-hour meeting in Helsinki. Unlike in Hamburg, Trump allowed no Cabinet officials or any aides to be in the room for that conversation.

Trump also had other private conversations with Putin at meetings of global leaders outside the presence of aides. He spoke at length with Putin at a banquet at the same 2017 global conference in Hamburg, where only Putin’s interpreter was present. Trump also had a brief conversation with ­Putin at a Group of 20 summit in Buenos Aires last month.

Trump generally has allowed aides to listen to his phone conversations with Putin, although Russia has often been first to disclose those calls when they occur and release statements characterizing them in broad terms favorable to the Kremlin.

In an email, Tillerson said that he “was present for the entirety of the two presidents’ official bilateral meeting in Hamburg,” but he declined to discuss the meeting and did not respond to questions about whether Trump had instructed the interpreter to remain silent or had taken the interpreter’s notes.

In a news conference afterward, Tillerson said that the Trump-Putin meeting lasted more than two hours, covered the war in Syria and other subjects, and that Trump had “pressed President ­Putin on more than one occasion regarding Russian involvement” in election interference. “President Putin denied such involvement, as I think he has in the past,” Tillerson said.

Tillerson refused to say during the news conference whether Trump had rejected Putin’s claim or indicated that he believed the conclusion of U.S. intelligence agencies that Russia had interfered.

Tillerson’s account is at odds with the only detail that other administration officials were able to get from the interpreter, officials said. Though the interpreter refused to discuss the meeting, officials said, he conceded that Putin had denied any Russian involvement in the U.S. election and that Trump responded by saying, “I believe you.”

Senior Trump administration officials said that White House officials including then-National Security Adviser H.R. Mc Master were never able to obtain a comprehensive account of the meeting, even from Tillerson.

“We were frustrated because we didn’t get a readout,” a former senior administration official said. “The State Department and [National Security Council] were never comfortable” with Trump’s interactions with Putin, the official said. “God only knows what they were going to talk about or agree to.”

Because of the absence of any reliable record of Trump’s conversations with Putin, officials at times have had to rely on reports by U.S. intelligence agencies tracking the reaction in the Kremlin.

Wouldn’t it be the icing on the cake to have one of the fisa warrants they got be to listen in on trump’s insecure phone line?

Edited by megaeliz on Jan 12th 2019 at 2:34:16 PM

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#266843: Jan 12th 2019 at 11:41:07 PM

Is Trump's phone line STILL insecure?

Do not obey in advance.
RandomTroper#89235 Since: Jan, 2014
#266844: Jan 12th 2019 at 11:49:35 PM

[up][up]Not that I'm not interested in reading these things (I am), but this post seems a tad long for this thread. Don't suppose you have a link to that Wa Po, or at least put it in a folder?

Edited by RandomTroper#89235 on Jan 13th 2019 at 3:50:29 AM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#266845: Jan 13th 2019 at 12:02:18 AM

Short version:

Trump has had a lot of secret meetings and conversations with Putin he's covered up.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Oruka Since: Dec, 2018
#266846: Jan 13th 2019 at 1:03:48 AM

According to Tillerson, one of them went "Did you interfere in the election?" "No." "For realsies?" "For realsies." "I believe you!"

TheRoguePenguin Since: Jul, 2009
#266847: Jan 13th 2019 at 1:13:29 AM

[up]x4 Unless someone in the White House managed to pry it away from him, yes.

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#266848: Jan 13th 2019 at 1:54:54 AM

Trump's phone is secure enough.

It's just that Trump is insecure. (This is not a pun.)

TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#266849: Jan 13th 2019 at 2:01:10 AM

[up]

Apparently he refuses to use the secure phone and prefers his own.

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#266850: Jan 13th 2019 at 2:28:42 AM

But her emails, or whatever. Sigh.

Do not obey in advance.

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