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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#264026: Dec 11th 2018 at 7:29:34 AM

I cant speak to that particular survey, but "Evangelical" is the term generally used to describe a particular group of conservative Christians, mostly Protestant, who typically believe in the literal accuracy of the Bible, seek a salvation experience from sin by the spirit of Jesus Christ, and promote an aggressive political agenda.

Also from that article: "...At issue is how much emphasis the party should place on trying to recapture white working-class voters as opposed to maximizing turnout among its new base of minority, millennial and college-educated white voters, especially women and those in urban areas."

Edited by DeMarquis on Dec 11th 2018 at 10:31:17 AM

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#264027: Dec 11th 2018 at 7:31:56 AM

People who use their religion as an excuse to be racist and sexist extremists. We know that it is just an excuse because for all their moral outrage over Obama, they are strangely forgivable towards Trump's exploits.

speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#264028: Dec 11th 2018 at 7:46:00 AM

Speaking of, there was an article a while back about how some evangelicals were frustrated that if you type "evangelicals" into Google, some of the first results that come up are not of the religion, but articles about Trump. When you willingly align yourself with someone you know is amoral for the sake of power, my sympathies are not very high.

EDIT: From the previous page:

As long as the Conservative donor class get their tax breaks and deregulation, and as long as the base get their nativism, he can say or do whatever he wants and nobody on the Republican side cares.
Yup. Orrin Hatch was asked about the latest bombshells, and his reply was basically, "I don't care." Sickening.

Edited by speedyboris on Dec 11th 2018 at 9:49:18 AM

RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#264029: Dec 11th 2018 at 7:49:45 AM

The largest bloc of single-issue voters in the USA (and it's one of the banned topics)

Grafite Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: Less than three
#264030: Dec 11th 2018 at 7:54:37 AM

[up] It's not about moral conduct, love for the neighbour or abortion with evangelicals, just as long as the Republican promotes nativism and the war on Christmas, it's enough for their vote.

Edited by Grafite on Dec 11th 2018 at 6:04:57 PM

Life is unfair...
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#264031: Dec 11th 2018 at 7:59:12 AM

To be fair, Evangelicals have been getting more or less what Trump promised on the campaign trail: "Issues matter more than a person's personal life," Killian said. "The two issues that come up are pro-life - appointment of judges (who oppose abortion), and support for Israel."

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#264032: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:20:14 AM

IIRC "Evangelical" is specific denomination or something of the sort. Though it typically refers to a type of politically active fundamentalist Christian conservative. Basically, your Ned Flanders type or the kind of person 7th Heaven is trying to appeal to, commonly found shopping at Bible Bookstores. Common opinions among them include opposition to same-sex marriage, abortion, and teaching evolution in schools. They commonly mistakenly conflate Atheism with Communism.

Much of my family are basically this, and I used to be too-though eventually I decided evolution was correct (switching to the "Theistic Evolution" school of thought) and thus stopped being a fundementalist. Also my position on LGBT issues softened...ironically after binge-watching a ton of pro-Tea Party youtube videos.

Leviticus 19:34
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#264033: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:24:29 AM

[up] Really? What was in them which convinced you?

Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#264034: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:30:59 AM

Something about small government and opposition to marriage licenses in general.

Leviticus 19:34
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#264035: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:34:49 AM

Re: Single-payer vs ACA: The problem I see with trying to build a new single-payer system is that it'll take up a lot of time and resources... and by the time all the deal-making is done, probably won't be much of an improvement. Might be worse! Reforming an existing system is easier and more reliable

There isn't really any reason to believe this, yes, making a single payer system is obviously not going to be easy or immediate but that is no reason to believe that it wouldn't be a massive improvement over the current system and good in its own right. And everyone reason to belive that it would be.

Furthermore, reforming the existing system runs into the problem of the opposition. When 50% of the political spectrum is fanatically dedicated towards deregulation and the healthcare industry is cancerous (pun intended) trying to push incremental reform that leaves the profit-incentive is just going to open you up to sabotage. So no, it's not more reliable.

If Republicans and the healthcare industry are going to fight us all the way (which they will) there isn't really any reason to hold back or stick with moderate solutions, better to decisively stand for something concrete that can rally the base and general public then incremental reform that can be undone by the next Republican administration.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Dec 11th 2018 at 11:35:56 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#264036: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:40:09 AM

How about a combination of both?

There are so many countries out there with health coverage for everyone. Why not look at all of them and then put something together out of the best elements? Single Payer is one way to have health care for all, but it is not the only one, and arguably not even the most effective one.

Here is why I see a problem with Single Payer healthcare: What if a Republican government just defunds it, the way the Tories did with the NHS?

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#264037: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:41:19 AM

"Blahous’s paper, titled “The Costs of a National Single-Payer Healthcare System,” estimates total national health expenditures. Even though his cost-saving estimates are more conservative than others, he acknowledges that Sanders’s “Medicare for All” plan would yield a $482 billion reduction in health care spending, and over $1.5 trillion in administrative savings, for a total of $2 trillion less in overall health care expenditures between 2022 and 2031, compared to current spending."

This, from a Koch-funded research center. Oops!

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#264038: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:44:32 AM

How about a combination of both?

There are so many countries out there with health coverage for everyone. Why not look at all of them and then put something together out of the best elements? Single Payer is one way to have health care for all, but it is not the only one, and arguably not even the most effective one.

Here is why I see a problem with Single Payer healthcare: What if a Republican government just defunds it, the way the Tories did with the NHS?

I covered this, unlike Germany 50% of our political spectrum is fanatically obsessed with deregulation. If we permit private healthcare companies to exist then they will simply claw back their power with the help of Republicans and Corporate Democrats. I'm well aware that there are forms of universal healthcare other than single payer, I just don't think they would fit the US as well.

Yes, Single Payer can be defunded but it will affect enough people's lives that defunding it should be more difficult than simply making an existing private sector more powerful.

This, from a Koch-funded research center. Oops!

Yeah, it's magnificent grin

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Dec 11th 2018 at 11:50:13 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#264039: Dec 11th 2018 at 8:50:10 AM

[up][up] Yes, I know. There is no doubt that this would save the US a LOT of money, and that's before you get to the broader benefits.

[up] I wasn't necessarily thinking of Germany. I just think that it would be good if the health care cost would be separate from taxes. Because that would make it harder for the Republicans to defund the health care system.

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#264040: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:28:49 AM

The NRCC Chair has weighed in on the Republican Party's path forward.

>> Main problem for Rs was bad messaging to Independents

>> Trump not at fault for '18 or liability in '20

>> no political realignment in suburbs: “That’s not true. It isn’t there”

They've learned absolutely nothing from 2018 and I love it grin

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Dec 11th 2018 at 12:29:14 PM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#264041: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:33:24 AM

"They've learned absolutely nothing from 2018 and I love it"

Oh thank god, they're still stupid.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#264042: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:43:14 AM

Apparently Trump started yelling at Pelosi and Schumer over his wall on camera. They told him to screw himself.

SteamKnight Since: Jun, 2018
#264043: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:43:41 AM

[up][up][up] It's too late for them to turn around at this point, so they might as well double down now. Escalation of commitment at its finest.

Edited by SteamKnight on Dec 12th 2018 at 12:44:02 AM

I'm not as witty as I think I am. It's a scientifically-proven fact.
speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#264044: Dec 11th 2018 at 10:07:52 AM

[up]x2 Okay, NO WAY they used those exact words. They didn't say "Well go screw yourself, Trump."

..........Did they?

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#264045: Dec 11th 2018 at 10:10:08 AM

Man, I wish. But no, sorry if I made that sound literal. They did make it clear they aren't paying for his wall though. After he interrupted them a thousand times.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#264046: Dec 11th 2018 at 10:11:37 AM

The Republican Party leaving Trump would doom them.

Trump is the only candidate with any base whatsoever.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#264047: Dec 11th 2018 at 10:15:39 AM

Did Trump really say he'd be proud to shut the government down for his wall?

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#264049: Dec 11th 2018 at 10:32:58 AM

Wouldn't that mean the military goes without pay? The one that has to stick around the border?

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#264050: Dec 11th 2018 at 10:36:30 AM

I believe there is a contingency for paying the armed forces (in less developed/democratic countries, you get a coup for pulling that stunttongue), and the military personnel on the border are withdrawing soon anyway.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

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