TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#263251: Dec 1st 2018 at 9:39:03 PM

I don't understand why the Republicans would decide to re-nominate Trump because of his unpopularity. Unless the Democrat's choice is totally inept, Trump vs the Dem's choice is 9 times out of 10 going to end in the Dem's choice. I could only see them doing it so as to make Donald Trump their sacrificial lamb and start over in 2024

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#263252: Dec 1st 2018 at 9:46:19 PM

They are liable to do it because the process of picking a nominee is more about choosing who they agree with rather than who is most electable.

Democrats may need to fall in love with their nominee to get them elected, but republicans tend to nominate the person they fall in love with.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
TheRoguePenguin Since: Jul, 2009
#263253: Dec 1st 2018 at 9:47:34 PM

They can't refuse him, and if they somehow managed to knock him off (would almost certainly never happen), Trump's cult would never vote for the replacement. They can't get rid of him, only wait him out.

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#263254: Dec 1st 2018 at 9:47:38 PM

The GOP would never acknowledge that they done screwed up by failing to field a candidate that could beat Trump in the first place. They have to go all in on him in order to maybe get some of the hypercapitalist oppression they want passed through into government.

They will probably try to sweep Trump under the rug in 2024. Don't let them succeed.

Do not obey in advance.
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#263255: Dec 1st 2018 at 9:50:54 PM

••• I don't understand why the Republicans would decide to re-nominate Trump because of his unpopularity.

Where to begin with this...

What you don't understand is that while Trump is a historically unpopular president, his approval rating among the Republican base is high. This is because their base runs on white aggrievement and wanting to "stick it to the libs", and as long as Donald appeals to them on those fronts they don't care what he does. He won the primaries for a reason. The GOP is now the party of Trump because he removed the mask and there's no turning back from that now, they're stuck with him.

Republicans are ultimately servile; their base just wants to win the culture war, and their politicians are willing to trade away whatever scruples they may have once had in order to appoint scum like Brett Kavanaugh to the Supreme Court and pass legislation that is massively harmful to the public.

What you're proposing is also technically possible AFAIK, but completely unprecedented in the history of US politics. There's been a lot about this presidency that's unprecedented (in uniformly bad ways), but I don't think the republicans would risk that because it would be tantamount to admitting that they were wrong and that Donald's administration has been bad. Conservatives don't really like their politicians doing that because they see it as a sign of weakness, they want them to double down.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Dec 1st 2018 at 1:54:56 PM

AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#263256: Dec 1st 2018 at 9:54:01 PM

Aside from what all has been said previously, neither party has a habit of holding primaries when they already have a president in office whose record they can build a campaign around. And, as in the case of the recently deceased George Bush, having two people in the same party running in a first past the post system results in one of those guys likely acting as a spoiler and the other party winning the election. And yeah, we all think Trump's record is shit, but he's got a fanatic base and he has so little policy that the GOP can basically just suggest whatever they want and he'll just okay it because he doesn't give a shit most of the time. And they can point to their victories in the Supreme Court and the age of least Ginsburg as a reason to vote for him again.

Add to all this that primaries tend to be expensive and time consuming, and both parties would rather save their resources and energy for the general election if they can, as a practical matter.

(Here's food for thought, in a ranked voting system George Bush might not have lost.)

Edited by AceofSpades on Dec 1st 2018 at 11:54:55 AM

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#263257: Dec 1st 2018 at 9:54:10 PM

I’m trying to think of a single time in US history that an incumbent president has failed to be nominated by his own party. I don’t think it’s ever happened. Ever.

Soban Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
#263258: Dec 1st 2018 at 10:11:16 PM

@wisewillow

https://www.npr.org/sections/politicaljunkie/2009/07/a_president_denied_renominatio.html

It only happened once to an elected president. That was Franklin Pierce, the 14th president, who was elected as a Democrat in 1852. ... Four other presidents were denied the nomination of their party, but none of these were elected in their own right. They were: John Tyler... Millard Fillmore... Andrew Johnson... [and] Chester Arthur

nombretomado (Season 1) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#263259: Dec 1st 2018 at 10:11:16 PM

Franklin Pierce, back in 1856. The rallying cry was "Anybody but Pierce".

Gilphon (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#263260: Dec 1st 2018 at 10:27:23 PM

And there a lots of times when people from the President's party have tried to primary him- generally when the President is an situation similar to the one Trump is in now.

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#263261: Dec 1st 2018 at 10:28:35 PM

Thanks for checking [tup]

I’m gonna point out though- all of those are before 1900.

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#263262: Dec 1st 2018 at 11:04:55 PM

I wonder if it would be worth it to have anyone primary Trump. Considering the state that the GOP is in, it would probably be a race to the bottom.

Edited by BearyScary on Dec 1st 2018 at 10:05:21 AM

Do not obey in advance.
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#263263: Dec 2nd 2018 at 12:22:00 AM

Trump might not even made it to the next election.

AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#263264: Dec 2nd 2018 at 12:34:22 AM

Ok, can we not speculate about people's potential deaths? It's in extremely bad taste. And if you're talking about whether or not he might be impeached/arrested/any other conclusion you can think of, please specify that so that it doesn't look like you're speculating about someone's potential death.

MrAHR Ahr river from ಠ_ಠ Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
#263265: Dec 2nd 2018 at 12:53:18 AM

I'm a bit confused. Like, hatred aside, why is death speculation so bad? I've seen a lot of people do the same thing for people they very much want to stay alive. Is there some social etiquette thing I'm missing?

Read my stories!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#263266: Dec 2nd 2018 at 1:20:53 AM

It's against the rules on TV Tropes to make death threats or to wish that someone would die. Speculation about a person who might die but you don't want them to die is the opposite intent.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#263267: Dec 2nd 2018 at 1:24:15 AM

I actually wasn't necessarily thinking about him dying. The democrats just waiting to bury him and his cronies under lawsuits. Pelosi is in expert in those kind of things. And the Müller investigation is moving, too. This is not like Watergate, where the investigation was still pretty low profile during the re-election in terms of proof. The next two years will be a nightmare for the Republicans and Trump actually might become the first president who is forced out of office instead of resigning himself.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#263268: Dec 2nd 2018 at 1:33:12 AM

His name is spelled Mueller, and I agree: the investigation has been taking down important figures left and right, I wouldn't be surprised if full-on impeachment proceedings were underway by next summer.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#263269: Dec 2nd 2018 at 1:52:17 AM

Yeah, sorry, I keep forgetting.

Not that it is impossible for Trump being taken out by natural causes. He isn't exactly living healthy.

Hylarn (Don’t ask)
#263270: Dec 2nd 2018 at 2:11:31 AM

Trump keeling over from a heart attack is vastly more likely than him getting removed from office. You need a two-thirds majority for that, and I don't think anything short of him raping a man on live television would be enough to convince the necessary number of Republicans

Edited by Hylarn on Dec 2nd 2018 at 2:11:44 AM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#263271: Dec 2nd 2018 at 2:25:41 AM

I have a feeling Trump won't let the impeachment proceedings get him if he knows they'll win,he'd sooner resign and then his republican successor can hastily pardon him,however if Trump knows he can win he'll down fighting and take everyone with him

If Trunp sees an easy way out he'll take it,I know would if it meant dodging a potentially humiliating trial

On the other hand,his successor decides not to offer a presidential pardon and Trump is even more screwed

edit:

"The plenary power to grant a pardon or a reprieve is granted to the President of the United States by Article II, Section 2, Clause 1 of the Constitution; the only limits mentioned in the Constitution are that pardons are limited to federal offenses, and that they cannot affect an impeachment process"-Wikipedia,interesting..

Edited by Ultimatum on Dec 2nd 2018 at 2:41:09 AM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
thok That's Dr. Title, thank you! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Non-Canon
That's Dr. Title, thank you!
#263272: Dec 2nd 2018 at 5:58:55 AM

Trump is unlikely to be convicted of impeachment. That requires 67 Senators (a 2/3 super-majority). I have a hard time finding five Republican Senators who would even consider convicting Trump in an impeachment trail; getting a conviction requires 20.

Trump is almost certainly the 2020 Republican nominee. If he loses in 2020, I wouldn't be shocked if he was the 2024 Republican nominee.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#263273: Dec 2nd 2018 at 6:36:58 AM

Trump will be nominated. Of all people who might theoretically stand against Trump, we absolutely must stop waiting for the Republican Party to do so.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#263274: Dec 2nd 2018 at 7:10:19 AM

It's not like I expect them to stand up to him. I expect that there will be a point where the damage he does is bigger than his use. Well, technically this is already happening, but eventually Republicans will see the writing on the wall, too.

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#263275: Dec 2nd 2018 at 7:16:49 AM

I don't see any reason to assume that, Republican politicians may be theoretically willing to abandon him if/when he outlives his usefulness but the base and media ecosystem aren't and they're the ones who have massive amounts of influence.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang

Total posts: 417,856
Top