Nov 2023 Mod notice:
There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines
before posting here.
Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.
If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules
when posting here.
In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
![]()
![]()
Fighteer, what exactly do you mean by gun ownership not being an established, unalterable fact? I'm slightly confused about your point of view.
x5 It just seems optimistic, sometimes, to hope that legislators actually listen to experts rather than picking and choosing "experts". Especially since the GOP has done its best to get rid of every agency and department meant to supply congress with information.
Oh god now the post numbers/page numbers are broken.
Edited by RainehDaze on Sep 21st 2018 at 4:48:38 PM
Fighteer: Just to echo what was said above, though, how is a legislator supposed to write regulations on automatic and semi-automatic weapons if they don’t know the difference between the two?
They don’t need to be experts, but they should at least do some research. Gun control is a fairly technical subject for better or for worse, and it would be good if legislators could engage those technical details a little more. Not only would that make their job easier, it would shoot down the primary form of opposition to gun control which is gun knowledge gatekeeping.
Edited by archonspeaks on Sep 21st 2018 at 9:35:34 AM
They should have sent a poet.For better or worse, America’s gun problem is at the point of no return. Hell it was too late ten years ago.
The best we can hope for is meaningful legislation that can mitigate the damage that has been caused and will be caused because of our inaction.
And with the advent of 3D printing, it’s only going to get even dicier.
We dug ourselves a hole that’s virtually impossible to climb out of
New Survey coming this weekend!Things 3D printed guns are not useful for:
- Hunting
- Protecting somebody or something
- Arming a combat force
- Target practice
- Mass shootings
- Assassination, if you intend to get away with it.
Things 3D printed guns can be used for, but aren't really practical for:
- Adding to your gun collection
- Being an untraceable weapon (3D printers are not exactly common- the amount of work you'd need to put into to disguise which one it came from is probably comparable to the amount of effort it takes to smuggle a regular gun)
- Suicide (you're not gonna just have one lying around the house; you'd have to go far enough out of your way that another suicide method would be easier)
- Assassination, if you don't intend to get away with it.
Things 3D printed guns are useful for:
- Creating scary headlines
Edited by Gilphon on Sep 21st 2018 at 1:21:32 PM
About the knowledge about guns issue, I've heard many complaints here about the federal assault weapons ban, saying how it was written by someone who knew nothing about guns, but the truth is it worked (it was never meant to stop violent crime) for the time it was present.
But it really seems like americans want to keep having the title of being the developed nation with most deaths due to mass shootings, even after Sandy Hook absolutely nothing was done, with 2017 being the worst so far.
Edited by Grafite on Sep 21st 2018 at 6:52:52 PM
Life is unfair...Edited by Demongodofchaos2 on Sep 21st 2018 at 2:19:29 PM
Watch SymphogearRosenstein Suggested He Secretly Record Trump and Discussed 25th Amendment
Mr. Rosenstein made these suggestions in the spring of 2017 when Mr. Trump’s firing of James B. Comey as F.B.I. director plunged the White House into turmoil. Over the ensuing days, the president divulged classified intelligence to Russians in the Oval Office, and revelations emerged that Mr. Trump had asked Mr. Comey to pledge loyalty and end an investigation into a senior aide.
Mr. Rosenstein was just two weeks into his job. He had begun overseeing the Russia investigation and played a key role in the president’s dismissal of Mr. Comey by writing a memo critical of his handling of the Hillary Clinton email investigation. But Mr. Rosenstein was caught off guard when Mr. Trump cited the memo in the firing, and he began telling people that he feared he had been used.
Mr. Rosenstein made the remarks about secretly recording Mr. Trump and about the 25th Amendment in meetings and conversations with other Justice Department and F.B.I. officials. Several people described the episodes, insisting on anonymity to discuss internal deliberations. The people were briefed either on the events themselves or on memos written by F.B.I. officials, including Andrew G. Mc Cabe, then the acting bureau director, that documented Mr. Rosenstein’s actions and comments.
x5 I brought Chuck Norris up a couple pages ago in relation to politics, so that's how it fits in.
Mr. T was always a highlight whenever he was on Late Night with Conan O'Brien.
Edited by speedyboris on Sep 21st 2018 at 1:26:33 PM
Well said. Yes the damage has been done but that is not the same thing as it being too late, as long as there is life there is the possibility that things can get better and it's not helpful to claim otherwise without significant evidence.
Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Sep 21st 2018 at 2:28:25 PM
"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji YangTactical: The thing is, you could also build a zip gun out of hardware store parts. The threat of homemade guns isn’t any greater now that you can 3D print one.
Grafite: The effectiveness of the AWB is debatable. It regulates by feature, which is overly complex and doesn’t really stop people from still getting those weapons. For example, New York uses the same system. Under that system, this [1]
◊ is illegal and this [2]
◊ is legal, despite the differences only being cosmetic. It would make far more sense to regulate by individual firearm the way many European countries do. People usually say the AWB was written by someone who didn’t know guns because it essentially only regulated certain cosmetic features, particularly ones that give a weapon a “military” appearance.
I believe it should be a privilege, not a right. A privilege that’s very conditional.
Edited by archonspeaks on Sep 21st 2018 at 11:44:17 AM
They should have sent a poet.I think that drawing a distinction between semi-automatic and automatic weapons is a bit of a Red Herring. The key question is whether private (individual) ownership of firearms should be a right at all. My point is that getting drawn into a debate over firing modes and cosmetic features and similar things is a losing game for gun control advocates, since it's inherently conceding that guns have a place in civilian society.
To draw a somewhat vague analogy, it's like arguing over which torture methods we should allow our intelligence operatives to employ.
Edited by Fighteer on Sep 21st 2018 at 2:42:44 PM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"That's true. One of the best deterrents for suicide is minor inconvenience. It's an impulse move easily thwarted by having two seconds to really think about what you're doing, which is why even something as simple as a sign telling people to beware of an edge does wonders for prevention.
I have to imagine that someone impatiently bouncing from foot to foot waiting for their gun to print would have a lot of time to think.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Edited by sgamer82 on Sep 21st 2018 at 12:41:27 PM
Vastly more people die to handguns than to AR-16 knockoffs, yet both gun control advocates and gun rights advocates have distracted us with arguments about "assault rifles". Again, whether you believe that the Second Amendment should allow private gun ownership or not (and it is settled law for the time being), we're having the wrong debate, and the right is completely happy to engage in it.
Edited by Fighteer on Sep 21st 2018 at 2:45:06 PM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
