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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
Speaking of which, anyone know how reliable The Daily Beast is? Because this article on Mike Cernovich might be relevant.
I'm already reluctant to link the actual article, because they never fired Nico Hines like they should have.
Anyway, Cernovich (popular right wing creep) suggests he's going to burn the place down if Bannon is fired, but given how much he pushed the ridiculous "Pizzagate" thing I don't really think that speaks to his competence.
edited 15th Apr '17 11:20:39 AM by Pseudopartition
Cernovich has also pushed the "The Syria gas attacks were photoshopped" story, so yeah. Scumbag.
Also, hearing that a few executions in Arkansas have been halted by a court ruling. Apparently Arkansas had lied to the pharmaceutical company who made the substances the state was about to use for the executions about what the medicals were to be used for. I notice that half of them were black.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard FeynmanThe US education system—at least as far as Metro Atlanta goes—teaches critical thinking on certain tracks.
I remember sitting through public health classes where the rest of the class brazenly slept through the entire lesson just as well as AP courses where we discussed the social and philosophical arguments in books (old and new) and current events and accurately researching and arguing one's own POV on a topic as if we weren't stupid children. Also, we heard the actual uses of chemistry and advanced math from teachers who liked the subject.
By university, though you still don't learn real civics (as opposed to the theme park version) unless you're in a dedicated public management/policy program.
edited 15th Apr '17 11:53:17 AM by CenturyEye
Look with century eyes... With our backs to the arch And the wreck of our kind We will stare straight ahead For the rest of our livesWell, I shall paraphrase Dumbledore: "I am very clever, and so my mistakes are much worse."
Smart people can be victim to fallacy, sadly.
I would agree that I would not get into bed with a Neo Nazi. I might break bread with a conservative, but not with Hitler or Palpatine. Too dangerous. I know it's better to have them pissing out of the tent than into it, but there's gotta be a line, right?
Yes, I am aware Sanders' may not actually be teaming up with Nazis. This is just a personal view of things.
edited 17th Apr '17 12:14:21 PM by PolarPhantom
I don't actually think people disagree with you. The pushback looks more based upon: breaking bread with neo-nazis will grant us support and maybe at acceptable cost, but it links our movement with theirs (even if superficially—the optics are damaging) and by so doing "legitimizes" their movement, therefore making said neo-nazis and their policy preferences a long term problem.
If the republic's on the verge of extinction, the latter may not be much concern, but, in the past, this very action is what pushed fragile republics over the edge. In any case, tis not like the best course of action can be experimentally proven—before it's too late anyway.
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Even universal healthcare is worth sacrificing if it means denying Neo-Nazis a seat at the table. And this isn't World War II — the fate of Western Civilization isn't at stake. Sanders is grubbing for the worst possible allies like a fucking mongrel begging for food with far lesser stakes, and if we follow in his footsteps, we're going to pay for it
edited 15th Apr '17 1:47:53 PM by CrimsonZephyr
"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."Please don't compare politics to the World War Two. It's tasteless to use the tragedy of millions for your petty debates.
If Sanders and his ilk are serious about this thing, it's a sign of their moral bankruptcy. We have to make compromises from time to time, but the line needs to be drawn somewhere. Pragmatism is all well and good, but enabling Spencer? Really? Is Sander's camp this desperate to be relevant? Is the WWC vote all you care about? If you guys really are willing to make that kind of alliance, you can count me and other moderates out.
edited 15th Apr '17 1:26:36 PM by Mely
There's a moment we make a decision Not to cower and crash to the ground The moment we face our worst demons Our courage found
I'll have to go hunting for whatever tweet actually prompted this, but I suspect you're overreacting to an attempt to justify Sanders' assertion that single payer healthcare is broadly popular among the American public by linking to articles suggesting surprising levels of support for such policies among the alt right.
edited 15th Apr '17 1:28:14 PM by CaptainCapsase
@Century Eye: After thinking about it more, I'd actually say that the risk is more the opposite. That trying to "break bread" with neo-nazis would delegitimize the movement of social democratic reform rather then to legitimize the fascist.
Single-payer healthcare is still associated with the "radical left" in the states while fascism already has it's candidate in the White House (even if some fascist think he's flaking out).
The Left has far more to loss from such a gamble then the neo-nazis have to gain, which probably why it won't/shouldn't happen.
edited 15th Apr '17 1:32:38 PM by Mio
What article are you talking about?
Indivisible group in Virginia makes town hall diorama made of peeps.
thanks
edited 15th Apr '17 1:39:25 PM by megaeliz
So yeah, the article in question that caused this massive stir was this
.
I'm honestly not sure where the idea that this was calling for a coalition between the progressive left and the alt-right, just arguing that Trump supporters are not totally unreachable.
edited 15th Apr '17 1:44:12 PM by CaptainCapsase
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Huh, one can tell alot about an article based upon the picture it uses...This paragraph alone makes me question their expertise on anything note
A nitpick, but CA and NY have comparable populations and economies (by raw GDP) to Canada or any given Scandanavian state. What's it mean to say they lack the resources for single payer policies?
@Mio That seems valid to me too. Something just like that happened to the PS in France.
It's not so much that they lack the resources as much as it is somewhat difficult to implement this sort of thing on a state level.
@@Mio: For the record I'm not proposing "breaking bread" with the alt-right as in the real dyed in the wool neo-fascists in the sense of offering any meaningful concessions to try and gain their support. If they will vote for single payer ballot referendums and the like however, I don't see any reason to toss those plans away simply because of that support.
I'm honestly not even sure what this whole argument is about.
edited 15th Apr '17 2:04:05 PM by CaptainCapsase
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The difference between say, Sweden and Denmark, and New York and California as far as implementing Single-Payer is concerned is that the former are independent sovereign nations while the latter are not.
While still being in the Union NY and California would not be able to levy enough to taxes to fund a true single-payer system, never-mind that they would not have a lot of means to keep private health companies, other states, or even the federal government from trying to undermine their system.
That was just something I threw out their as a response to those who thought such a scenario would legitimize the fascists, nothing more.
edited 15th Apr '17 2:07:38 PM by Mio
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Aye. You know, "breaking bread" could be the bones of a 2020 slogan given the state of the union by then...
More Fast Times at the ATL Warring Republicans try to unite against Ossoff in Georgia’s Sixth
Republicans face a daunting enthusiasm gap in the 18-candidate race to represent the 6th District, and the leading GOP contenders have spent the final days feuding with each other.
At a GOP voter drive in the district’s western flank of Marietta, about 30 volunteers and officials turned out to make calls and listen to several likely Republican statewide candidates.
“This is personal,” said Attorney General Chris Carr, who lives in Dunwoody. “We have great candidates. But whoever you support is better than the other side. They are trying to embarrass us, but let’s show them this district is Republican red.”
At a GOP breakfast on the district’s eastern De Kalb outskirts, state Sen. Fran Millar criticized Democrats who think it’s a “done deal that this kid’s going to become the Congressman.”
“I’ll be very blunt: These lines were not drawn to get Hank Johnson’s protégé to be my representative. And you didn’t hear that,” said Millar. “They were not drawn for that purpose, OK? They were not drawn for that purpose.”
Ossoff, a 30-year-old ex-congressional aide, has marshaled thousands of volunteers – and droves of paid staffers – to blanket the district.
State Rep. Sam Teasley of Marietta said Ossoff’s platform is chock-full of “left wing priorities.”
“The national media would love to make this a story about a turning tide,” said Teasley. “But we aren’t going to let that happen.”
Georgia GOP chair John Padgett compared the surge of attention around Ossoff’s campaign to the failed 2014 bids of “little blue-headed folks” Jason Carter and Michelle Nunn.
“What got them beat is you. You got out and outworked them,” he said. “And you’ll do it again.”
Samuel L. Jackson on Georgia vote: ‘Stop Donald Trump’
The ad's on the article page, short, and quite blunt.
Gingrich makes late push for Hill in Georgia special election
“If we’re going to seize on this opportunity to move America in a bold new direction and reverse the last eight years of decline,” he said, “we must vote for the only person with the proven record who can defeat Nancy Pelosi’s candidate, Jon Ossoff.”
edited 15th Apr '17 2:08:18 PM by CenturyEye
Look with century eyes... With our backs to the arch And the wreck of our kind We will stare straight ahead For the rest of our lives

Or maybe it's the base rate fallacy in action - well educated people will consume more media and information, period. Including bogus one.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman