Nov 2023 Mod notice:
There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines
before posting here.
Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.
If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules
when posting here.
In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
![]()
![]()
Wise? Definitely not? Can it end the Russia-Trump honeymoon? Most likely. Can that mess up be used against Trump? Oh yes!
![]()
At this point it is very hard to deny a Trump-Russia connections, because there are evidence pointing towards the Trump campaign and Russian state support.
I am convinced that Putin thought he could play Trump like a fiddle but it turns out that putting an unpredictable, egomaniac, short sighted and erratic idiot in the White House isn't exactly a smart move.
I think Putin didn't account Trump being Trump as a problem.
edited 8th Apr '17 7:52:37 AM by AngelusNox
Inter arma enim silent legesTrump and Russia absolutely have a connection. There are a lot of links between Russian oligarchs and the Trump businesses, too many for it to be just incidental. It also doesn't help that his cabinet is doing everything they can to hide any connections they have with Russia because if it wasn't anything important, why try to hide it?
While Trump himself may not be taking orders from Putin, there is definitely something going on behind the scenes.
edited 8th Apr '17 7:52:42 AM by Zendervai
Russia warned on Friday that U.S. cruise missile strikes on a Syrian air base could have "extremely serious" consequences, as President Donald Trump's first major foray into a foreign conflict opened up a rift between Moscow and Washington.
The warships USS Porter and USS Ross in the Mediterranean Sea launched dozens of Tomahawk missiles at the Shayrat air base, which the Pentagon says was involved in a chemical weapons attack this week. (Graphic locator map on attack - tmsnrt.rs/2nm68H0)
It was Trump's biggest foreign policy decision since taking office in January and the kind of direct intervention in Syria's six-year-old civil war his predecessor Barack Obama avoided.
The strikes were in reaction to what Washington says was a poison gas attack by the government of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad that killed at least 70 people in rebel-held territory. Syria denies it carried out the attack.
They catapulted Washington into confrontation with Russia, which has advisers on the ground aiding its close ally Assad.
"We strongly condemn the illegitimate actions by the U.S. The consequences of this for regional and international stability could be extremely serious,” Russia's deputy U.N. envoy, Vladimir Safronkov, told a meeting of the U.N. Security Council on Friday.
Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev charged that the U.S. strikes were one step away from clashing with Russia's military.
U.S. officials informed Russian forces ahead of the missile strikes and avoided hitting Russian personnel. (Graphic explaining kind of missile used in attack - tmsnrt.rs/2nkJYWa)
Satellite imagery suggests the base houses Russian special forces and helicopters, part of the Kremlin's effort to help Assad fight Islamic State and other militant groups.
Trump has frequently urged improved relations with Russia, strained under Obama over Syria, Ukraine and other issues, was hosting Chinese President Xi Jinping at his Mar-a-Lago resort in Florida on Thursday night when the attack occurred.
Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin, in Florida with Trump, said on Friday the United States would announce additional sanctions on Syria in the near future but offered no specifics.
Russia's Defense Ministry responded to the attack by calling in the U.S. military attache in Moscow to say that at midnight Moscow time (5 p.m. EDT) it would close down a communications line used to avoid accidental clashes between Russian and U.S. forces in Syria, Interfax new agency said. U.S. warplanes frequently attack Islamic State militants in Syria and come close to Russian forces.
"PREPARED TO DO MORE"
U.S. ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley said on Friday the Trump administration was ready to take further steps if needed.
"We are prepared to do more, but we hope that will not be necessary," she told the U.N. Security Council. "The United States will not stand by when chemical weapons are used. It is in our vital national security interest to prevent the spread and use of chemical weapons."
Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, who also was in Florida with Trump and is scheduled to go to Moscow next week, said he was disappointed but not surprised by the Russian reaction because it showed continued support for Assad.
Iran, which supports Assad and has been criticized by Trump, condemned the strike, with President Hassan Rouhani saying it would bring "only destruction and danger to the region and the globe."
U.S. officials called the intervention a "one-off" intended to deter future chemical weapons attacks and not an expansion of the U.S. role in the Syrian war.
U.S. allies from Asia, Europe and the Middle East expressed support for the attack, if sometimes cautiously.
The action is likely to be interpreted as a signal to Russia, and countries such as North Korea, China and Iran where Trump has faced foreign policy tests early in his presidency, of his willingness to use force.
The United States is now likely to be more aggressive in pursuing intelligence about Syria's suspected chemical weapons program. The Pentagon has also signaled interest in determining any Russian complicity.
"At a minimum, the Russians failed to rein in the Syrian regime activity," a senior U.S. military official told reporters, speaking on condition of anonymity.
The official also said the United States had been unable to determine if a Russian or Syrian aircraft bombed a hospital that was treating victims of the chemical attack.
Russia joined the war on Assad's behalf in 2015, turning the momentum in his favor. Although Moscow supports opposing sides in the war between Assad and rebels, the United States and Russia say they share a single main enemy, Islamic State.
Tillerson said the strike took out about 20 percent of the seventh wing of the Syrian air force and hit a fueling facility. The base's runway was still in use.
Assad's office said Syria would strike its enemies harder.
Damascus and Moscow denied Syrian forces were behind the gas attack but Western countries dismissed their explanation that chemicals leaked from a rebel weapons depot after an air strike.
The Syrian army said the U.S. attack killed six people and called it "blatant aggression" that made the United States a partner of "terrorist groups" including Islamic State. There was no independent confirmation of civilian casualties.
U.S. lawmakers from both parties on Friday backed Trump's action but demanded he spell out a broader strategy for dealing with the conflict and consult with Congress on any further action.
The U.N. Security Council had been negotiating a resolution, proposed by the United States, France and Britain on Tuesday, to condemn the gas attack and push the Syrian government to cooperate with international investigators.
Russia said the text was unacceptable and diplomats said it was unlikely to be put to a vote.
MOSCOW WANTS EXPLANATION
Russia expects Tillerson to explain Washington's stance when he visits Moscow next week, Interfax news agency cited a Russian Foreign Ministry spokeswoman as saying.
Washington has long backed rebels fighting Assad in a multi-sided civil war that has killed more than 400,000 people and driven half of Syrians from their homes since 2011.
The United States has conducted air strikes against Islamic State, which controls territory in eastern and northern Syria, and a small number of U.S. troops are helping rebel militias.
Asked whether the strikes set back any efforts to work with Russia to defeat Islamic State, sometimes known as ISIS, White House spokesman Sean Spicer said:
"There can be a shared commitment to defeat ISIS and also agree that you can’t gas your own people.”
Tuesday's attack was the first time since 2013 that Syria was accused of using sarin, a banned nerve agent it was meant to have given up under a Russian-brokered, U.N.-enforced deal that persuaded Obama to call off air strikes four years ago. (Chart of cumulated reported deaths from chemical gases in Syria - tmsnrt.rs/2o5Xbz6)
Video depicted limp bodies and children choking while rescuers tried to wash off the poison gas. Russian state television blamed rebels and did not show footage of victims.
The U.S. strikes cheered Assad's enemies, after months when Western powers appeared to grow increasingly resigned to his staying in power. But opposition figures said an isolated assault was far from the decisive intervention they seek.
Neither the Trump administration nor its predecessor has laid out a policy aimed at ending the Syrian conflict.
(Additional reporting by Phil Stewart, Idrees Ali, Roberta Rampton and Patricia Zengerle in Washington, Steve Holland in Florida, Roselle Chen in New York and Denis Pinchuk in Moscow; Writing by Alistair Bell and Bill Trott; Editing by James Dalgleish and Lisa Shumaker)
edited 8th Apr '17 8:02:48 AM by AngelusNox
Inter arma enim silent legesAll of this is just the predictable result of egos clashing. Trump, Putin, Assad: all egotistical authoritarians.
Assad was emboldened by Trump saying he'd leave him alone and broke out the sarin gas that Russia claimed they helped eliminate just to prove he means business and that he's not just a Russian puppet.
Trump was humiliated and broke out the Tomahawks just to prove he means business and that he's not just a Russian puppet...though he took the time to warn Russia and Syria.
Putin was pissed since Assad just revealed that Russia fucked up and Trump threatened Assad's power (and by extension Russia's power). So he denies that the sarin gas was used by the Syrian army and chews out Trump to avoid looking weak and ineffectual.
All of this — all of this — is just three assholes in a dick waving contest.
Disgusted, but not surprisedI dunno, the Russians can't singlehandedly invade the West but a paper tiger they are not.
Syria and the Ukraine are showing that all those fancy toys of theirs work and work really well. Any conflict with the Russians will result in catastrophic casualties for our side. Even if we win.
Oh really when?Trump’s Options for North Korea Include Placing Nukes in South Korea
This dense motherfucker
New Survey coming this weekend!
...What. The. Fuck. Is. Wrong. With. This. Man?!
Besides, y'know, fucking EVERYTHING!
China's reaction to this will make their reaction to THAAD look like a child's hissy fit in comparison!
...That's a bit different from the usual tone of your posts. Also, it's probably not something you should be posting here. No advocating violence.
edited 8th Apr '17 8:35:39 AM by M84
Disgusted, but not surprised![]()
![]()
TRUMP: What to do about North Korea? Oh, I know! {Plops nukes in South Korea.}
NORTH KOREAN AID: Sir, those filthy Americans have placed nukes in Seoul!
JONG: Excellent. {Launches a missile at Seoul, promptly exploding Seoul's nukes and taking out the entire capital and the surrounding countryside in one giant blaze of glory.}
TRUMP: ...Hilary did it!
edited 8th Apr '17 8:39:42 AM by kkhohoho

Discussions about Israel are only allowed in the Israel topic guys.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran