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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#175251: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:11:03 PM

Of course, there's always the possibility of this biting everyone in the ass if we ever get a Trumpesque candidate who also wins the popular vote, but I think there's enough potential benefit to outweigh the risk.

edited 21st Feb '17 2:11:17 PM by sgamer82

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#175252: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:17:30 PM

EDIT: NVM misread.

edited 21st Feb '17 2:19:10 PM by Draghinazzo

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#175253: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:19:42 PM

Quite. The main purpose of the electoral college is to rig the system in the GOP's favor. It's based on the elitist idea that dumbf*ck citizens are too stupid to know what's good for them so we need controls in place to keep democracy from happening to our republic.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Lanceleoghauni Cyborg Helmsman from Z or R Twice Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: In my bunk
#175254: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:25:32 PM

or, ostensibly, to keep an unfit, unqualified populist from stealing the presidency. That Sure Worked Out Well

"Coffee! Coffeecoffeecoffee! Coffee! Not as strong as Meth-amphetamine, but it lets you keep your teeth!"
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#175255: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:27:19 PM

So I have a question. What do "alt-left" and "alt-right" mean? Because, from the contexts I keep hearing them from, 'alt' sounds like a prefix synonymous with eeeevil.

The legend has returned.
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#175256: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:30:53 PM

Realistically I don't think the EC is ever going to do that. The electors aren't these Great Wise Men who live separated from modern society and not beholden to its pressures and traditions. Electors going faithless would undoubtedly cause political instability and nobody wants to do that, they chose to do so even when faced with Trump.

If America is going to shoot itself in the foot by electing a populist, authoritarian demagogue, then it should be because that populist authoritarian demagogue was chosen by the majority of the people and so he has a mandate to unleash his terribleness. At least then you can say that America chose its own fate, unlike this scenario with Trump where he lost the vote by a factor of 3 million or more last I checked.

[up]The alt-right is essentially a new right-wing movement mostly buoyed by younger people who grew up in a culture of cynicsm, apathy and nihilism on the internet. They are basically a natural extension of the kind of people you see on 4chan, coupled with revanchism from mostly white males who resent women and people of color making advances in society and fearing that their economic and social privileges are being compromised. They are very driven by stereotypical ideas of masculinity and strength which is why they hate "SJW's" and call people "cucks", they think they are weak and pathetic.

edited 21st Feb '17 2:35:30 PM by Draghinazzo

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#175257: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:34:49 PM

[up][up]That sounds about right RE the evil part.

So, there's a Wikipedia article on the term Alt-Right, which is what its members coined to call themselves. The tl; dr version is that it's pretty close to the Dark Enlightenment idea- basically people who support conservatism and have moved away from supporting democracy because democracy doesn't guarantee the desired results/allows poor and/or non-white people to take part in the system.

I don't think Alt-Left is really a thing. I've seen the term variously used by people to designate people on the Left (i.e. Bill Mahr) who share the quasi or openly racist ideology of the Alt-Right, as well more or less the opposite, being used as a criticism of non-racist people on the political left by people on the Alt-Right.

edited 21st Feb '17 2:35:03 PM by Hodor2

Balmung Since: Oct, 2011
#175258: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:35:39 PM

Alt-right is basically a politically correct term for neo-nazis. They're far right on issues of women's rights, lgbtq rights, racial issues, immigration, non-Christian rights, and social welfare. They want women back in the kitchen, gays back in the closet, minorities back in chains, immigrants back where they came from (or at least not here), non-Christians forcibly converted or killed, and the poor left to starve (unless they're poor white people, who are instead precious nuggets of "real America" who must be saved from all the other things the alt-right hates). If you don't believe me when I say they're neo-nazis, they literally heiled Trump and victory when he was inaugurated. Also, if you remember The Hashtag That Must Not Be Named, a lot of those guys went on to found the alt-right.

The so-called "alt-left" is basically a hypothetical neo-communist backlash that doesn't actually exist in any meaningful numbers.

edited 21st Feb '17 2:37:34 PM by Balmung

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#175259: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:37:25 PM

[up][up][up]The alt-right is a loose collection of reactionaries, white supremacists, opportunists, and trolls that (before Trump got nominated) the mainstream conservative movement wouldn't touch, at least openly.

The alt-left isn't really a thing, apart from a slur used against progressives, liberals and even moderates by the above[up]. The far-left, as in actual communists and hard socialists, has little power or influence in the US. Closest thing you'll get are some quacks in the Green party and a handful of questionable Democrats who are (for now) outside of the party's ruling factions.

[up][nja]

edited 21st Feb '17 2:38:04 PM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#175260: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:37:57 PM

The left equivalent to the alt-right is pretty much people like the nutjobs in PETA and Greenpeace who literally attack people for not agreeing with them.

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#175261: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:45:59 PM

The main difference between "Dark Enlightenment" and the alt-right is that the latter is much bigger and frankly much more puerile.

The alt-right wants to make its ideas mainstream, and the stereotypical alt-righter is a white male between the ages of 14-30 something who acts in a really petulant, arrogant manner, bemoaning "SJW's" and harassing and insulting people they don't agree with. I'm not really scared of them because I understand them, their chest-beating bravado betrays how insecure and pathetic they really are.

Dark Enlightenment / N Rx/etc is a much smaller community composed of a few loosely-associated bloggers who don't really care to make all the media fuss the alt-right does (they actively refuse to speak to journalists), and what I have seen from them is FAR more frightening than the alt-right, mostly because hey're not motivated by petty spite and insecurities like the alt-right. They are 100% ideological, they have stared into the abyss and laughed pleasantly afterwards. There was an article posted a while back where they talked about the founder and the guy is utterly chilling, he talks in a pretty polite, genial way except he seriously asks "what was so bad about the nazis?" and justifies it by saying the people opposing them were really no better and since then nobody's cared about any minorities anyway. He's so convinced of himself that he doesn't feel the need to chest-beat or hide who he is.

edited 21st Feb '17 2:47:43 PM by Draghinazzo

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#175262: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:53:18 PM

Of course, there's always the possibility of this biting everyone in the ass if we ever get a Trumpesque candidate who also wins the popular vote, but I think there's enough potential benefit to outweigh the risk.

Then again, the EC, which was made to avoid disasters that the populace preferred, bestowed upon the planet the gift of Trump and Dubya, so I'd say it clearly hasn't fulfilled it's purpose.

So I have a question. What do "alt-left" and "alt-right" mean? Because, from the contexts I keep hearing them from, 'alt' sounds like a prefix synonymous with eeeevil.

Alt-Right is the Politically Correct term for neofascism, used, of course, by the people who decry Political Correctness, yet get offended if you wish them happy holidays. Alt-Left is an attempt by the right to keep playing the game of "the left is just as bad as we are, so vote us". The main difference, the Alt-Right chose that moniker, the "Alt-left" is an external imposition (another term used is "ctrl-left".

If America is going to shoot itself in the foot by electing a populist, authoritarian demagogue, then it should be because that populist authoritarian demagogue was chosen by the majority of the people and so he has a mandate to unleash his terribleness. At least then you can say that America chose its own fate, unlike this scenario with Trump where he lost the vote by a factor of 3 million or more last I checked.

[awesome] agreed 100%

EDIT:[nja] everywhere

[up] Was it this article?

edited 21st Feb '17 2:56:42 PM by IFwanderer

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#175264: Feb 21st 2017 at 2:59:16 PM

It's possible that a populist demagogue like Trump could win with the popular vote but I find that unlikely. He lost it by 3 million votes. Even if we account for the fact that people that otherwise wouldn't have voted would have voted for him the same is true of Hillary.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#175265: Feb 21st 2017 at 3:07:49 PM

The EC itself also contributes to reducing voter turnout, which is another reason it needs to go. The common knowledge is that your vote doesn't actually matter so why bother voting? It's not entirely true, but it kind of is true. If your state doesn't go your way, then your vote actually doesn't matter. Only the votes of the side that won the state mattered.

As much as we talk about trying to reduce the GOP's voter suppression, one of the most effective cornerstones of voter suppression is the f*cking system we use to vote!

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#175266: Feb 21st 2017 at 3:16:28 PM

Pretty much. Everybody complains about New York and Cali dictating things but those states also have massive Republican populations too. Take California for example. While it's true it gave Hillary a solid win it's also notable that Trump got almost a third of the votes. That's millions of Republicans who have no say in who gets to be President. Forget votes not meaning as much across different states. Why should they get no say in who gets to be President?

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#175267: Feb 21st 2017 at 3:37:15 PM

That very thing happened to my county. My county's primarily Republican, but Virginia, the state I'm from, pulled for Hilary.

The legend has returned.
NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#175268: Feb 21st 2017 at 3:38:51 PM

Miami Marlins owner Jeffrey Loria is being considered for ambassador to France. (And he was also maybe going to sell the Marlins to the Kushner family, but they apparently decided that was one too many conflicts of interest, even for them.)
Worth noting that if the Kushners were negotiating to buy the Marlins, they were doing so illegally, since they hadn't informed MLB of the discussions, as they're required to.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
Krieger22 Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018 from Malaysia Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: I'm in love with my car
Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018
#175269: Feb 21st 2017 at 3:51:37 PM

The Anne Frank Center doesn’t think much of Trump's attempts to portray anti-Semitism as bad.

The Texan plan to defund Planned Parenthood has been blocked by a judge.

I have disagreed with her a lot, but comparing her to republicans and propagandists of dictatorships is really low. - An idiot
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#175271: Feb 21st 2017 at 4:25:07 PM

I would think that would be standard practice for any US president.

I pity the bastards that have to do it this time though.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#175272: Feb 21st 2017 at 4:34:05 PM

[up]RUSSIAN AGENT: Okay, let's see here... Make America Great Again, okay, nothing there... 'Bad hombres'; uh, alright, don't know what the hell that's about, but okay... 'Grab em by the pussy?'

{Some time later...}

RUSSIAN AGENT: Uh, yes sir, I'd like to request a transfer...

edited 21st Feb '17 7:23:00 PM by kkhohoho

FictionAddiction Lurker turned Troper from My Home, duh Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Singularity
Lurker turned Troper
#175273: Feb 21st 2017 at 4:40:19 PM

Regarding the Alt-right movement I want to add that another characteristic of them is a strong bias against Globalisation. Most alt-right supporters think culturally and more importantly economically in the framework of a nation missing the connected socioeconomic reality of today.

This is just a personal assessment. I do not think that all critics of Globalisation are part of the alt-right movement.

I am a simple man, I like stories therefore I dissect and discuss them.
carbon-mantis Collector Of Fine Oddities from Trumpland Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Married to my murderer
Collector Of Fine Oddities
#175274: Feb 21st 2017 at 4:40:22 PM

[up][up]By the time he gets to the sexual proclivities he'll be begging for Siberia.

[up] Also, more often than not if you see an alt-right rag using "Globalist" they're usually implying "TEH JEWZ"

edited 21st Feb '17 4:42:15 PM by carbon-mantis

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#175275: Feb 21st 2017 at 4:50:22 PM

[up]Pretty much. :/

Glad to hear that a judge is blocking Planned Parenthood defunding in Texas. IDK if they can prevent it, but at least the courts are sticking it to the corrupt GOP madness.

edited 21st Feb '17 4:50:54 PM by BearyScary

Do not obey in advance.

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