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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#174401: Feb 15th 2017 at 8:46:08 AM

[up][up] Personally, I don't know of any other country that actually put that into law.

[up] In other words: Another relic from the past.

edited 15th Feb '17 8:46:52 AM by DrunkenNordmann

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#174402: Feb 15th 2017 at 8:48:03 AM

The electoral college was created in part because the Founding Fathers thought the people would be too stupid to understand the vote. Like, some of them were genuinely worried that someone would stick George III into the running and people would vote for him.

Most countries just do the "x person must be a naturalized citizen" thing.

[nja]

edited 15th Feb '17 8:49:01 AM by Zendervai

carbon-mantis Collector Of Fine Oddities from Trumpland Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Married to my murderer
Collector Of Fine Oddities
#174403: Feb 15th 2017 at 8:49:49 AM

Ah, the EPA bill was put forward by good old "Only God can judge. But we can sure set up the meeting!" and "Ethanol is a NWO conspiracy" Gaetz from Florida.

edited 15th Feb '17 8:50:32 AM by carbon-mantis

CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#174404: Feb 15th 2017 at 8:53:13 AM

"I still don't get why this "must be born in the US" is a requirement - I mean, if this election has proven anything, then that being born in a country doesn't make you automatically less like to serving foreign interests."

It's because the early U.S. was afraid that Europe would subvert their politicians and elected a puppet ruler in service to France or Britain. America has a strain of nativist paranoia that's been there since the beginning. In fact, I would challenge the idea that we started as a Melting Pot. The way the early US is described, I get more of a Hidden Elf Village kind of vibe.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#174405: Feb 15th 2017 at 8:59:04 AM

After I posted above, I was thinking of something similar. Like it's always been an interesting factoid that this was the reasoning, especially because something like that could have hypothetically happened since for instance Napoleon's brother was married to a woman from a prominent Baltimore family.

However, I'm having Fridge Horror now at the fact that by implication, the only non-native born people the drafters considered likely to run for the Presidency were foreign princes. Like it never occurred to them that someone who was an immigrant could be sufficiently patriotic (and let's be honest, also financially successful) to qualify. In fact, there might be decent reason to suspect a conscious nativist motive. Or at best, there doesn't seem to have been a lot of thought about the idea that people would want to emigrate to America.

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#174406: Feb 15th 2017 at 8:59:44 AM

Well, the early US usually accepted European immigrants, and wasn't adverse to trade with Europe. But they were convinced that Europe was basically a Forever War, too many small countries in a small area with bad blood between them. So they didn't want to get untangled in overseas wars. Now, they'd deal with them militarily and diplomatically in the Western Hemisphere, hell they bought/divided/conquered most of North America with/from Europe.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#174407: Feb 15th 2017 at 9:04:08 AM

We had both tendencies tugging us in different directions. In the early years, white immigrants were more than welcome - but the Founding Fathers (particularly the Antifederalists) wanted to keep America the hell out of European affairs, because getting tied to a European power could not possibly end well. Hence, a sort of "no divided loyalties" check.

[nja]

edited 15th Feb '17 9:04:34 AM by Ramidel

DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#174409: Feb 15th 2017 at 9:31:18 AM

The "fake news" backlash continues. I wonder how far the networks will be willing to take it...

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#174410: Feb 15th 2017 at 9:31:58 AM

Trump approves FEMA disaster declaration for 34 California counties hit by storms. That defunding threat was just hot air, seems like.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#174411: Feb 15th 2017 at 9:44:10 AM

https://twitter.com/20committee/status/831872441597194241

From former NSA intelligence analyst John Schindler, when asked "what do you think is going on inside NatSec right now after Trump's "intelligence" tweet this morning?"

Now we go nuclear. IC war going to new levels. Just got an EM fm senior IC friend, it began: "He will die in jail."

https://t.co/e6FxCclVqT

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#174412: Feb 15th 2017 at 9:47:23 AM

Wow. It's going to be leak central at the CIA, I think. How nuts is this becoming?

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#174413: Feb 15th 2017 at 9:59:19 AM

Never before has the POTUS and the IC been so openly up in arms against one another. We truly live in interesting times. I can only hope something good comes out of all of this.

Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#174414: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:08:04 AM

It's hard to say exactly what it will take to cause the Trump administration to fall apart. I think we still need a few more cracks that may or may not materialize before the bottom truly falls out.

Under a hostile congress we already would be heading for impeachment hearings at the very least. Under the current congress it's going to take a bombshell of truly epic proportions. Which I would normally rule out as a serious possibility, but Donald Trump is Donald Trump.

speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#174415: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:08:11 AM

"He will die in jail."

Ironically, this is what one of the tabloids said about Hillary- complete with a nice photoshopped image of an aged Hillary behind bars. It was so bad looking I had to laugh.

iflewaway someone from somewhere Since: Dec, 2016
someone
#174416: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:13:36 AM

Another day, another diplomatic blunder.

President Trump said he “can live with” a one-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict

WASHINGTON — President Trump said on Wednesday that the United States would no longer insist on a Palestinian state as part of a peace accord between Israel and the Palestinians, backing away from a policy that has underpinned America’s role in Middle East peacemaking since the Clinton administration.

“I’m looking at two states and one state,” Mr. Trump said, appearing in a joint news conference at the White House with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel. “I like the one that both parties like. I can live with either one.”

Mr. Trump’s comments were a striking departure from decades of diplomatic orthodoxy, and they raised a host of thorny questions about the viability of his position. The Palestinians are highly unlikely to accept anything short of a sovereign state, and a single Israeli state encompassing the Palestinians would either become undemocratic or no longer Jewish, given the faster growth rate of the Arab population.

Mr. Trump did not address these dynamics, preferring to focus on his confidence that he could produce a breakthrough agreement. “I think we’re going to make a deal,” Mr. Trump said, describing that as personally important to him. “It might be a better deal than people in this room understand.”

edited 15th Feb '17 10:15:57 AM by iflewaway

something
Gilphon (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#174417: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:24:07 AM

Basically, the question is 'are we seeing the beginning of Trump's death spiral, or a rough patch on his learning curve?' Is this Trump at his least functional, or Trump at his most functional?

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#174418: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:24:33 AM

@Dingo: Only from two particular shows, and I will be surprised if the Trump administration doesn't retaliate by revoking press passes and whatnot.

BonsaiForest Since: Jan, 2001
#174419: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:26:39 AM

Russian Spy Ship Patrols 30 Miles off the Coast of Connecticut

Russia seems to be testing us. I totally expect the conservative media to cover this, yo. /s

EDIT: Fox News were the first to report the ship's location. I wonder how conservatives will take this. On the "Trump Regrets" Twitter, there are people who voted for Trump but dumped him over how much he kisses Russia's ass.

edited 15th Feb '17 10:27:21 AM by BonsaiForest

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#174420: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:28:09 AM

[up] That's actually fairly normal as far as Russia goes; they do that sort of stuff all the time to test boundaries.

[up][up][up] Until Trump's base loses confidence in him, he's secure in his position, and thus far Trump's "floor" of 40% seems pretty much impenetrable.

edited 15th Feb '17 10:30:04 AM by CaptainCapsase

3of4 Just a harmless giant from a foreign land. from Five Seconds in the Future. Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Just a harmless giant from a foreign land.
#174421: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:30:52 AM

At this point even if 95% of the country want him gone, the Congress GOP might ignore it.

"You can reply to this Message!"
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#174422: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:32:03 AM

[up] Congressional Republicans are more worried about their own base than they are about the general electorate, particularly in the House where there's major structural factors favoring them; if the Republican base turns on Trump, the Republican congress will as well, but thus far there's no real indications that's happening beyond wishful thinking; his approval rating has a seemingly impenetrable floor of 40% of the electorate, and unless the Republicans are BTFO'd during the midterms, they're not going to suddenly start caring about what people other than their primary voters think.

edited 15th Feb '17 10:33:52 AM by CaptainCapsase

Gilphon (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#174423: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:32:55 AM

'How much would it take to make Trump's base lose faith in him' in an askable question, though. Him looking Strong and actually succeeding at bringing back jobs are important.

iflewaway someone from somewhere Since: Dec, 2016
someone
#174424: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:37:54 AM

All of Trump's insane policies and awful appointments represent his base. They won't abandon trump unless he starts making sane choices.

Trump's base's ideologies are the polar opposite to ours. They are as thrilled as we are horrified.

edited 15th Feb '17 10:44:11 AM by iflewaway

something
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#174425: Feb 15th 2017 at 10:43:29 AM

Now, the former Obama voters and swing voters are already leaving him in droves. And that might be enough, remember how narrow his win was. And if said swing voters team up with Dems, turnout in large numbers, associate Trump with the Republican party, the Democrats taking the House and holding their own in the Senate is not an unlikely scenario.

edited 15th Feb '17 10:44:24 AM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

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