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carbon-mantis Collector Of Fine Oddities from Trumpland Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: Married to my murderer
Collector Of Fine Oddities
#173751: Feb 10th 2017 at 12:59:29 PM

Maybe we'll be starting to see more an inverse of the Your Approval Fills Me with Shame trope? If Trump twitter bashes it it must be doing something right.

Wryte Since: Jul, 2010
#173752: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:11:02 PM

@Wryte: Old news; I think that was brought up, what? Ten pages back?

In my defense, I skipped over the 15 pages that have been posted since I last checked in yesterday morning. This thread is lightning.

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#173753: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:25:09 PM

Conspiracy Theory Theory: Why are so many people convinced that Donald Trump has a master plan? {Slate} An article that puts forth the idea that, yes, Trump is actually that incompetent, he is not intentionally trying to bring down democracy. I don't want to underestimate the guy, but you know, the article has a point that we shouldn't overestimate them either.

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#173754: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:27:21 PM

[up] At this point, that is honestly my thinking: That Trump is just so incompetent. The minute I learned he didn't even write the EO that banned people from 7 Nations immigrating to this country was the minute I realized he's clueless about US Politics.

Now Steve Bannon, he's the real danger to this nation...

edited 10th Feb '17 1:27:51 PM by DingoWalley1

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#173755: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:29:30 PM

The problem with Trump is not that he's some evil mastermind. That would actually be a more manageable issue than the truth. The truth is that he's an incompetent, know-nothing, self-aggrandizing narcissist who surrounds himself with people whom he personally likes rather than people that are competent at their jobs.

Those people are the ones with vicious, destructive political and personal agendas who will tear the nation down.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#173756: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:31:02 PM

All Trump wants is the money and attention being president brings. Everything else can go fuck itself seemingly in his eyes.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#173757: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:34:19 PM

@Ifwanderer: Reading about that movement feels like looking into an abyss with no end. What really creeps me out is how nonchalant most of the people in it are about their goals and what they believe in. The main guy the article talks about defends slavery like it's no big deal and asks "what was really so bad about the nazis?" with complete sincerity, following it up with a nihilistic justification about how the people fighting against them were not really any different from them. It's like I'm looking at the creepiest Straw Nihilist ever, except he's real.

Which I think shows that being superficially "pleasant" and "polite" really doesn't have much to do with how moral you are or is any indication that you should be taken seriously, a fact which seems to elude most people who think that all reactionaries are going to be virulent and openly hateful, and not merely casual about it as many of them are.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#173758: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:36:26 PM

In "I told you so" news: California Farmers Backed Trump, but Now Fear Losing Field Workers.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#173759: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:38:19 PM

[up] What the fuck did they think would happen?

/sigh

Also, great page topper.

edited 10th Feb '17 1:38:30 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#173760: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:49:22 PM

They were presumably thinking that Trump would fix the water issues. Which - cynically - he's probably in a better position in than many other people, considering that environmental protection and in lesser measure big cities suck up much of it.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#173761: Feb 10th 2017 at 1:59:55 PM

Some important things to note about getting and staying involved, and staying loud:

Part 1 Part 2.

It's been fun.
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#173762: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:18:48 PM

This was several pages back now, but the election I was talking about was for Rep. Price's seat. It's being seen as wide open, so this is a chance for the Dems to show they are serious about the downticket.

tricksterson Never Trust from Behind you with an icepick Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Never Trust
#173763: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:27:08 PM

Price is Republican or Democrat? What state?

Trump delenda est
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#173764: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:31:14 PM

You know that guy on the internet who can't f*cking shut up about his credentials as though it automatically entitles him to win the discussion? You know that guy. We all know that guy.

"Well, maybe if you had a PHD in psychiatry like I do, you would understand why my version of the character is correct." "Excuse me, but my doctorate disagrees with your take on that movie." "You think what about economics? How old are you?"

That's Trump. That's basically the entire point of his Presidency. He thought that being President entitles him to win every conversation. He sees it as the ultimate "Congratulations, you win at life!" achievement.

And now he's pissed off because he didn't understand that no, in fact, being the President is NOT the greatest argument-finisher of all time.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
tricksterson Never Trust from Behind you with an icepick Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Never Trust
#173765: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:34:38 PM

He also uses his business background the same way, ignoring the evidence that he's not a very good businessman either ethically or in terms of success

edited 10th Feb '17 2:36:33 PM by tricksterson

Trump delenda est
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#173766: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:40:18 PM

My favorite part is when people use those credentials as a trump(heh)-card when the field isn't even relevant to the question.

Being a brain surgeon does not make you qualified to weigh in on whether certain people deserve to have rights or not.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#173767: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:49:44 PM

Just popped into my phone

"Trump says he is considering a 'brand new order' to ensure travel ban stays in place" - Get updates at Reuters.com

That's all I got currently

Journeyman Overlording the Underworld from On a throne in a vault overlooking the Wasteland Since: Nov, 2010
Overlording the Underworld
#173768: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:52:04 PM

Considering he's only being attacked on one part of it that a half page correction could have fixed, he really would only have to issue a new order exempting Green Card holders/long term residents from this ban. After that it would take a Democrat powerbloc to overturn it in congress.

Wryte Since: Jul, 2010
#173769: Feb 10th 2017 at 2:59:35 PM

What the fuck did they think would happen?

I can't help but boggle at the people who don't seem to realize that the fact they were actively hoping he wouldn't fulfill his campaign promises should have been a good reason not to vote for him.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#173770: Feb 10th 2017 at 3:05:03 PM

Can't people argue that any ban would still be religious discrimination though? He's made it pretty obvious that the ban is primarily meant to apply to Muslims.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#173771: Feb 10th 2017 at 3:05:04 PM

Well, Trump isn't exactly known for honesty. Or maybe they simply wanted to disagree with "these dirty Angelenos" or whatever.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#173772: Feb 10th 2017 at 3:06:21 PM

Would be even do as suggested above and remove the green card part? An article posted earlier said when it was brought to his attention he just gave me authority to one of his people on the matter rather than change the order.

From section 2 of http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/3-key-trump-mistakes-that-led-to-travel-ban-court-defeat-234884 "The McGahn fix"

One of the steps the Trump team settled on to save face while stemming the legal and public outcry over the order's impact on U.S. residents essentially blew up in the White House's face Thursday.

Once the concern about green-card holders was identified, Trump could have simply signed a half-page tweak to his executive order, making crystal clear that U.S. permanent residents were exempt from the order. But he didn't do that, apparently because he or his aides did not want to admit any flaws in the drafting or vetting process. A formal change to the order would have amounted to a concession of such imperfections.

Instead, Trump and his advisers settled on having his official lawyer — White House Counsel Don Mc Gahn — sign a memorandum purporting to offer "authoritative guidance" that the order did not apply to green-card holders. The memo did not say that Trump instructed Mc Gahn to tweak the order or even that the president approved the new "guidance."

"The White House counsel speaks for the president in this context," Justice Department lawyer August Flentje insisted during Tuesday's oral arguments in response to skeptical questions from the only Republican appointee on the three-judge panel, Richard Clifton.

Despite the claims by Mc Gahn and Flentje that the counsel's memo was conclusive, the three judges nearly ridiculed that position.

10_donald_trump_14_gty_1160.jpg WHITE HOUSE Appeals court panel rules unanimously against Trump travel ban By JOSH GERSTEIN "At this point, however, we cannot rely upon the Government’s contention that the Executive Order no longer applies to lawful permanent residents. The Government has offered no authority establishing that the White House counsel is empowered to issue an amended order superseding the Executive Order signed by the President," the judges wrote, adding curtly: "That proposition seems unlikely."

And the appeals judges didn't leave it there.

"Nor has the Government established that the White House counsel’s interpretation of the Executive Order is binding on all executive branch officials responsible for enforcing the Executive Order. The White House counsel is not the President, and he is not known to be in the chain of command for any of the Executive Departments," the court wrote.

Some legal experts said the Trump administration's contention that Mc Gahn could clarify the order was bizarre. If Trump wanted to change it, he could have in moments with the stroke of a pen, but the bravado exhibited by the president and his aides seemed to foreclose that possibility.

"There were other options," said George Washington University law professor John Banzhaf. "The president's counsel has no official standing at all ...The Homeland Security Secretary does, the Secretary of State does. Maybe it's not as good as the president himself, but it's a hell of a lot better than the counsel, the president's dog, his wife or his son, all of whom have no official standing whatsoever in the government.

edited 10th Feb '17 3:08:43 PM by sgamer82

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#173773: Feb 10th 2017 at 3:09:53 PM

@Kostya: he can just do what the Bush administration did and also ban North Koreans just because.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#173774: Feb 10th 2017 at 3:17:10 PM

A bit more info on the new immigration order

"Trump looks at new immigration order, no Supreme Court appeal" - http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-immigration-court-idUSKBN15O2XS

EDIT:

Federal agents conduct sweeping immigration enforcement raids in at least 6 states

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/federal-agents-conduct-sweeping-immigration-enforcement-raids-in-at-least-6-states/2017/02/10/4b9f443a-efc8-11e6-b4ff-ac2cf509efe5_story.html?utm_term=.7b6e4c74e819

edited 10th Feb '17 3:19:46 PM by sgamer82

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#173775: Feb 10th 2017 at 3:23:49 PM

Kasich seems to already be preparing to try and primary Trump in 2020.

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV

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