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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#154701: Nov 13th 2016 at 2:56:34 PM

Hmmm, looks like Bannon is only an advisor, so I'm not sure if he has a really position of authority or if he's just put in the WH to placate Trump's base.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#154702: Nov 13th 2016 at 2:58:59 PM

Jesus H. Christ. So a racist, anti-Semitic domestic abuser now holds a key position in the White House.

That's no way to talk above the president-elect!

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#154703: Nov 13th 2016 at 2:59:43 PM

His position is key?tongue

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
nightwyrm_zero Since: Apr, 2010
#154704: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:06:35 PM

I think this may be rather shrewd of Trump. By placing Bannon and hence the alt-right in an advisory role instead of an actual position of power, Trump prevents the alt-right from building a powerbase in the actual government and forces them to go thru him to have any influence. If Trump falls, they fall as well, so they have to keep supporting him. Meanwhile, Trump can play the alt-right and the establishment off against each other.

Xopher001 Since: Jul, 2012
#154705: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:09:18 PM

You think Trump actually cares about that sort of stuff ?

PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#154706: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:09:28 PM

While he Golfs in his new Trump Tower Taco Bowl mini-golf course. wild mass guess

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#154707: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:11:05 PM

I doubt Trump is the one making the appointments half the time.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#154708: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:16:52 PM

@Xopher: Who knows, but at this point I still really can't get a good read on Trump; he's either ridiculously lucky or a fair bit smarter (though no less vile) than people think he is. If nothing else, I think he intuitively understands the basic principles of power.

edited 13th Nov '16 3:18:35 PM by CaptainCapsase

Xopher001 Since: Jul, 2012
#154709: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:17:25 PM

Trump's probably just going to be a figurehead , while the real work is done by Pence

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#154710: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:18:22 PM

[up][up][up][up][up] At this point we should stop underestimating the guy. Yesterday a few of you were saying he could be either president tyrant or president celebrity. It's probably better to assume he'll be the first, be prepared for that, and then be relieved after 4 (or, may the citizens of the US forbid, 8) years if he ended up being the second.

edited 13th Nov '16 3:18:58 PM by IFwanderer

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
nightwyrm_zero Since: Apr, 2010
#154711: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:18:30 PM

[up]x3 That. It's very difficult to get a read on the man with so many conflicting reports on him. But I would not underestimate him again.

edited 13th Nov '16 3:18:42 PM by nightwyrm_zero

AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#154712: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:20:09 PM

Cap, I'd say a bit of both. These rich and famous because they're rich and famous types tend to be savvy on how to capitalize on opportunities. Plus, he basically had most of the Republican establish fold over the primaries and try to make him look legit. (Or saw their own opportunities to capitalize on.)

It says something that he doesn't actually appear to be bragging about his win, though. This was probably not his end game.

edited 13th Nov '16 4:12:59 PM by AceofSpades

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#154713: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:21:39 PM

Well, of course not. POTUS is a site of actual responsibility, but Trump has always acted as if he has no patience for that whatsoever...

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#154714: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:29:12 PM

I agree with Ace Of Spades. I'm not sure that I'd call Trump a political mastermind or anything but it does seem to me that he caught onto a lot of things that he could tap into as part of his campaign (white resentment, economic anxiety, xenophobia, use of social media as a propaganda tool, etc) and figured he might be able to get away with campaigning on that platform. He might also have recognized that being a celebrity would mean a lot of instant publicity from people's baser instincts, when you have a media/tv figure running as a candidate people will immediately pay attention. If it didn't work out, then he would still get a load of attention for himself which is good for business.

I do think it's possible that he might have underestimated all those factors, which is why he didn't expect to (or want to) win.

edited 13th Nov '16 3:30:36 PM by Draghinazzo

BonsaiForest Since: Jan, 2001
#154715: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:31:45 PM

That video on the previous page, I think, is a great one. I'm glad it's making the rounds. I'm seeing both conservatives and liberals in the comments section agreeing with it, and it's something that's frustrated me about my fellow liberals - and the echo chamber we've had in this thread. You can't just dismiss the other side as nothing but racists and bigots and the like - and if they are, you have to fucking talk with them and try to open minds.

It wasn't just bigots that won the election, but desperate people who didn't like being called "bigot" or "desperate" or being told that their jobs were going to disappear (something Hillary said about coal) as if it's a good thing.

Right now, the right feels they have reason not to get out of their echo chamber, since they probably feel vindicated by this big Republican win. We need to penetrate their echo chamber with ideas, and that's done by actually opening up dialog and talking.

A little at a time. We can start by providing personal stories of people who are/were affected negatively by Republican policies. Personal stories are harder to argue with than abstract concepts.

nightwyrm_zero Since: Apr, 2010
#154716: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:33:32 PM

I'm currently debating between two interpretations of Trump and his recent actions. He could be either:

a) Someone who is uninterested in actually governing and just wants to do the fun POTUS events, rallies, parades etc. and change a few things to enrich himself. This is the less disastrous interpretation.

b) A Great Man who wants to do Great Things because that's how he imagines being the POTUS would be like. He is uninterested in the gritty details of everyday governance but wants to do cool stuff that will go down in history books. This is the much more dangerous interpretation.

Right now, it's unclear which one he'd be. But nonetheless, Trump is a charismatic man with a good instinct on how to manipulate people and power structures. It would be extremely foolish to think otherwise.

edited 13th Nov '16 3:37:29 PM by nightwyrm_zero

Vampireandthen In love with an Uptown Girl from Northern Ireland Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: A teenager in love
In love with an Uptown Girl
#154717: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:34:21 PM

Quick! Anyone know how bad the protests are getting, and if Trump is going to be a tyrant.

Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#154718: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:35:52 PM

Protests are mostly non-violent, but there have been a few incidents.

Too early to tell if Trump will only ruin everything using legal measures, or if rule of law will take a hike as well.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#154719: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:37:02 PM

[up]And if it does, then there's a Civil War for you.

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#154720: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:38:30 PM

It's not heartening that many people seem to be hanging their hopes on the idea that "maybe now that Trump's won, he will just suddenly become a completely different person than he has been for his entire campaign."

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
Vampireandthen In love with an Uptown Girl from Northern Ireland Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: A teenager in love
In love with an Uptown Girl
#154721: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:39:30 PM

Fuck me. The Republic of Michigan seems very appealing now.

However, since we can no longer underestimate this smug ass troll, we have to ask ourselves, was this maybe the better choice? Cause Trump did say he would not have accepted a defeat, and he has the power to reach out to all the militia movements in America.

Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#154722: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:40:12 PM

More like people are banking on the idea that Trump doesn't necessarily want or is interested in doing much based on his personality and his history. People have made comparisons to Italy's Berlusconi, who I don't think did much besides passing a bunch of legislation to benefit himself, and I think there's a good chance that will be true of Trump as well.

That still leaves us with Pence doing most of the legwork though, which is horrible.

edited 13th Nov '16 3:41:59 PM by Draghinazzo

kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#154723: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:44:30 PM

[up]Regardless, I still don't think either of them is going to do anything outright unconstitutional, because neither of them want a Civil War. And that's what will happen if they violate the very foundations that America is built upon.

vandro Shop Owner from The little shop that wasn't Since: Jul, 2009
Shop Owner
#154724: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:47:59 PM

I hold a far more grim thought. The civil war II won't happen, the US military would not split itself over this.

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#154725: Nov 13th 2016 at 3:49:20 PM

[up][up] However, if they manage to gain dominance over nationwide state legislatures (which they are perilously close to achieving), then they'll be able to ratify constitutional amendments.

Frankly, I am having a hard time seeing any other end than "we are all completely screwed." We are ticking off every box on the rise-of-fascism checklist, and even the best-case scenarios are horrifying.

edited 13th Nov '16 3:49:34 PM by RBluefish

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."

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