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Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#90801: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:04:45 PM

[up] Of course. So would I, but Republicans oppose all of those things too, because the party as a whole benefits politically from a culture in which everyone lives in fear of everyone else. Never underestimate the hypocrisy or cynicism of this ideology.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#90802: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:05:43 PM

I think the problem is more cultural than there just being guns everywhere though the guns aren't helping things at all. Gun control is certainly a quicker solution than undoing years upon years of this rugged individualism cowboy bullshit.

Though I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't buy thousands of guns if I had the money. Just to have on the wall.

Oh really when?
Aprilla Since: Aug, 2010
#90803: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:18:20 PM

[up] For real. Though, I like picking up guns the same way I like picking up action figures for my collection note .

Joesolo Indiana Solo Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Indiana Solo
#90804: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:27:55 PM

I just want a 22...

I'm baaaaaaack
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#90805: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:32:24 PM

Don't bother, .22 ammo goes fast because people are stockpiling it in case Obama takes all our guns.

Oh really when?
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#90806: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:38:05 PM

I would like to live in a world where I can be fairly certain that my neighbor is not preparing to shoot me if I look at him funny, or if he finds out I'm a liberal.

edited 9th Mar '15 9:38:59 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Canid117 Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#90807: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:40:08 PM

So buy a gun. He'll invite you to his next barbecue.

"War without fire is like sausages without mustard." - Jean Juvénal des Ursins
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#90809: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:49:39 PM

Though that's still just a cultural problem made infinitely worse with the introduction of copious amounts of firearms.

Gun control will be a great band aid but we need a shit ton of time to fix the causes.

Oh really when?
NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#90810: Mar 9th 2015 at 9:56:58 PM

Problem is that I'm not convinced that gun control is a great band aid, given how hard it is to actually keep guns out of the hands of people who shouldn't have them. Not that I'm opposed to stuff like closing the gun show loophole, but still.

Generally speaking, the rabid anti-gun control attitude is the NRA tail wagging the conservative dog, though — which makes it a hell of a lot harder to deal with, as it makes the movement virtually impervious to things like "facts" and "reasoned argument".

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#90811: Mar 9th 2015 at 10:05:04 PM

As I've said many times, I'm not fundamentally opposed to firearms themselves (as noted, keeping them completely out of civilian hands is practically impossible), but to the paradigm in which the debate is being framed. Whenever I hear someone speak out against gun control, it's almost always a form of, "We need to arm ourselves against the tyranny of Big Government," when that is quite possibly the least practical or realistic reason to do so. Secondarily, it's, "We need to arm ourselves against the [blacks|Hispanics|Muslims]," which is just plain old racism. Occasionally you get a more generic, "We need to arm ourselves because the apocalypse is coming," in which case the speaker needs to have fewer guns and more psychiatric care.

The NRA, for its part, has long since ceased to be an advocacy group for gun owners and is instead the lobbying arm of the firearms industry.

edited 9th Mar '15 10:06:49 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
AnSTH Lawful Evil Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#90812: Mar 9th 2015 at 10:05:37 PM

Why not have the government co-opt the NRA and similar groups? Pass a law saying that anyone who wants to own a gun needs to be a member of an accredited firearms group that can provide them with proper safety training and general support. But becoming and remaining a member requires regular membership fees, and losing a membership reduces your rights to own certain firearms.

But that's a story for another time.
ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#90813: Mar 9th 2015 at 10:06:37 PM

[up][up][up]

Yep. Honestly, we should have been talking about what steps might be appropriate in regards to curbing mass shootings (whether in regards to firearms legislation or something else) back after Virginia Tech happened, not 5 years later in a worse instance.

And for my money, I'd want mandated training courses to own a firearm. It would cut down drastically on accidental shootings, and (hopefully) some of the least balanced people could get caught and screened prior to legally owning a gun. Whether or not that would happen is up in the air, but the implication regarding Jared Lee Loughner (Gabby Giffords' shooter) is that everyone who knew him knew he was imbalanced, but since he'd never done anything that would flag him...

edited 9th Mar '15 10:12:11 PM by ironballs16

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#90814: Mar 10th 2015 at 12:28:02 AM

The NRA, for its part, has long since ceased to be an advocacy group for gun owners and is instead the lobbying arm of the firearms industry.

And sometimes even telling the firearms industry what to do...

Train Crashes Into Tractor-Trailer; at Least 55 Hurt

An Amtrak train slammed into a tractor-trailer that got stuck on the tracks while trying to make a difficult left-hand turn Monday. One of the train's cars toppled and the conductor and at least 54 others were injured.

It was the third serious train crash in less than two months. Two deadly crashes in New York and California in February killed a total of seven people and injured 30.

The oversized flatbed trailer involved in Monday's crash was transporting a modular building wrapped in blue plastic and jammed with electrical equipment, said Lt. Jeff Gordon, a spokesman for the North Carolina State Highway Patrol.

One of the troopers escorting the truck from Clayton, North Carolina, to the Virginia border was trying to help the driver negotiate a difficult left-hand turn across the tracks onto a two-lane highway in the town of Halifax, Gordon said. But the 164-foot tractor-trailer combination, longer than half a football field, couldn't navigate it, he said.

During the five minutes or so the trooper and driver spent attempting to get the truck turned and off the tracks, there was no indication of an approaching train, Gordon said. When the train appeared, it set off warning flashers and the crossing arms came down as the truck was still straddling the tracks, he said. The train hit the truck shortly afterward, Gordon said.

He said the truck was unable to back off the tracks before the train hit because traffic had backed up on the road behind him.

edited 10th Mar '15 12:39:05 AM by Greenmantle

Keep Rolling On
NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#90816: Mar 10th 2015 at 5:11:02 AM

The NRA, for its part, has long since ceased to be an advocacy group for gun owners and is instead the lobbying arm of the firearms industry.
That's not actually the case. The firearms industry is terrified of the NRA. In 2000, the NRA nearly bankrupted Smith & Wesson virtually overnight by organizing a boycott against them when they voluntarily complied with gun control rules proposed by the Clinton administration.

This is Smith & Wesson, one of the most iconic gun manufacturers in the country. If the NRA can torpedo them, then no one in the industry is safe, so they pretty much have to be kneejerk anti-gun-control out of pure self-preservation.

Why not have the government co-opt the NRA and similar groups? Pass a law saying that anyone who wants to own a gun needs to be a member of an accredited firearms group that can provide them with proper safety training and general support. But becoming and remaining a member requires regular membership fees, and losing a membership reduces your rights to own certain firearms.
You can expect all kinds of court challenges to that sort of thing. Gun control legislation is always going to be a touchy issue because it involves constitutional law via the second amendment. Personally, I'd love to see some sort of mandatory firearm's license to own a gun the same way you have to have a driver's license to drive a car, but unless some president makes reform like that the defining work of their term (like Obama did with health care) I really just don't see it happening — and even then it's not by a long shot guaranteed that said hypothetical president would be able to push it through.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#90817: Mar 10th 2015 at 6:40:17 AM

Let us stipulate that the NRA has become a reactionary juggernaut that commands immense and self-sustaining political power, such that it has escaped whatever its mandate may once have been and now fights for guns, more guns, and guns all the time.

Frankly, if I had sufficient executive power, one of my first actions would be to seize all of its financial assets and forcibly disband it, but not before I had fortified my residence with all the security available to me in order to fight off the waves of outraged nutjobs that would undoubtedly show up.

edited 10th Mar '15 6:42:44 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
BonsaiForest Since: Jan, 2001
#90818: Mar 10th 2015 at 6:51:49 AM

if I had sufficient executive power, one of my first actions would be to seize all of its financial assets and forcibly disband it

That right there will give people very good reason to think the government has become dangerous. I, a liberal, would be very wary (to say the least) of a government that straight up seizes the assets of and disbands groups it disagrees with. That is not how you solve problems like this.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#90819: Mar 10th 2015 at 6:54:57 AM

Declare them enemies of the American state? A terrorist-sponsoring organization? I don't know... how do we fix this otherwise? Executive tools exist for a reason.

edited 10th Mar '15 6:55:22 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#90820: Mar 10th 2015 at 6:55:24 AM

Punch their CEO in the dick

Oh really when?
BonsaiForest Since: Jan, 2001
#90821: Mar 10th 2015 at 6:57:43 AM

We know damn well that this is one of the most stupidly divisive actions our government could possibly take, if it actually took it, which no left or right winger would do (for right wingers, I of course mean going after a left wing group they hate, and seizing their assets and breaking them up). Again, many liberals will be totally against the idea of our government pulling these kinds of stunts. Many conservatives likewise would not support doing the same thing to a liberal group. People in general think the government shouldn't do this kind of thing at all.

Yes, it sucks to try to fix stupid, but you have to at least, if nothing else, get people on your side before you do something like this.

edited 10th Mar '15 7:00:32 AM by BonsaiForest

speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#90822: Mar 10th 2015 at 6:58:26 AM

[up][up] "Burnsauce, yeah! I'm a complete douche!"

Points to anyone who gets that reference.

EDIT: Re: The media being a big problem with fear mongering in this country: Very very true. How many times have you seen a news talk show go like this: "ISIS may be hiding in your cereal box! More after this!"

edited 10th Mar '15 7:01:02 AM by speedyboris

Joesolo Indiana Solo Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Indiana Solo
#90823: Mar 10th 2015 at 6:59:51 AM

You'd have to push for lobbying reform. Just randomly taking down the NRA through direct action will be like every right wing conspiracy come true. Well, minus the death camps, but still.

I'm baaaaaaack
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#90824: Mar 10th 2015 at 7:03:43 AM

Hell, I'm just talking about a dream. The GOP is already actively trying to take down every organization they disagree with, private or public.

edited 10th Mar '15 7:03:57 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
BonsaiForest Since: Jan, 2001
#90825: Mar 10th 2015 at 7:08:01 AM

How? I mean, when it comes to private organizations.


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