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Discussion about renaming: Nakama

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CaissasDeathAngel House Lewis: Sanity is Relative from Dumfries, SW Scotland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
House Lewis: Sanity is Relative
#51: Jul 9th 2011 at 9:33:22 AM

I recall that I actually added the debate on Nakama's rename to Troper's Law, long ago. People have been banned over the issue before.

Still, that doesn't change the fact that it needs to happen. A key problem has been a new name that completely works. Fellowship screams LOTR, Comrades screams communism, etc.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#52: Jul 9th 2011 at 9:42:15 AM

Then use camaraderie; it's an English loanword from French.

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
EnglishIvy Since: Aug, 2011
#53: Jul 9th 2011 at 9:56:15 AM

At this point, I'm not sure that it matters which of those terms we replace Nakama with. Any one of them would be a great improvement.

nuclearneo577 from My computer. Since: Dec, 2009
#54: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:02:11 AM

I'm good with any thing new as long as it's clear.

KrisMahai Hm? Since: Jan, 2013
Hm?
#55: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:03:28 AM

I did like Unshakeable Camaradarie, which was mentioned earlier. Either way, the single prop is supposed to be up for at least three days (or longer, if voting hasn't stabilized) before we change it to an Alternative Names crowner.

“Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?”
Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#56: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:05:07 AM

Unshakeable Camaradarie sound good to me.

If we can just through out names though while we wait for the next few days, I always thought "Thicker Than Blood" sounded cool.

CaissasDeathAngel House Lewis: Sanity is Relative from Dumfries, SW Scotland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
House Lewis: Sanity is Relative
#57: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:08:58 AM

Certainly no harm in considering alternative names, and Unshakeable Camaraderie works for me too.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.
KrisMahai Hm? Since: Jan, 2013
Hm?
#58: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:09:25 AM

Not sure if I like Thicker Than Blood, but I get it. Closer Than Family is pretty straightforward too.

edited 9th Jul '11 10:09:38 AM by KrisMahai

“Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?”
IanExMachina The Paedofinder General from Gone with the Chickens Since: Jul, 2009
The Paedofinder General
#59: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:20:34 AM

Another for the support of the rename, as well as agreeing Unshakable Camaradie works well as a name.

By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!
CaissasDeathAngel House Lewis: Sanity is Relative from Dumfries, SW Scotland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
House Lewis: Sanity is Relative
#60: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:25:13 AM

[up][up] Closer Than Family doesn't work for me. It's about the closeness of one relationship, not how it's specifically closer than another. Family aren't relevant one way or the other to Nakamas.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.
Worldmaker Title? What Title? Since: Jun, 2010
Title? What Title?
#61: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:27:48 AM

Unshakeable Camaraderie for the win.

edited 9th Jul '11 10:27:57 AM by Worldmaker

Being in a Japanese-produced work is not enough of a difference to warrant its own trope.
juancarlos Faith in the self. Since: Mar, 2012
Faith in the self.
#62: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:46:54 AM

I'm OK with Unshakeable Camaraderie as well.

"My life is my own" | If you want to contact me privately, please ask first on the forum.
Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#63: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:50:44 AM

Leave the single-prop up for a few days, then we'll do the alt-titles.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
StarryEyed Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: If you like it, then you shoulda put a ring on it
#64: Jul 9th 2011 at 10:54:25 AM

The problem with Unshakable Camaraderie is that's an adjective phrase. It's not a noun. We want something we can pop into a sentence like "The Hero and his [blank] save the world with The Power of Friendship."

edited 9th Jul '11 10:54:46 AM by StarryEyed

Sackett Since: Jan, 2001
#65: Jul 9th 2011 at 11:00:34 AM

Use one of the redirects, like comrades.

edited 9th Jul '11 11:00:40 AM by Sackett

Ghilz Perpetually Confused from Yeeted at Relativistic Velocities Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Perpetually Confused
#66: Jul 9th 2011 at 11:07:13 AM

or just use Camaraderie, which is a noun

Daremo Misanthrope Supreme from Parts Unknown Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: If it's you, it's okay
#67: Jul 9th 2011 at 11:09:45 AM

I'm opposed to a rename. No valid reason for one has been presented. It doesn't have low usage in either wicks or inbounds, so 'argument to obtuseness' is out the window. Is it being misused? Please demonstrate such. Is there some special problem with the name, like being offensive? How so?

A few people have claimed Nakama doesn't mean what we use it for in Japanese. Other than being perhaps a bit more idealized and intense, how is it different? I don't really know how it's used in One Piece, as I've never read that, nor watched the show. When I see Nakama I think of the 3x3Eyes OAVs, in which the main character becomes a zombie, and hangs out with his biker friends for a while, trying to be normal, leading to an inevitable monster attack, and commencement of Walking the Earth. His friends had already been freaked out by the zombie thing, and the monster attack was the last straw. As... main character...(Yakumo?) apologizes for their near death experience, the girl who turned him into a zombie(Pai Pai?) says something like, "Hey, I know you all, you were in that picture Yakumo carries everywhere, you're his friends!", and one member says, "That's right, we're his nakama.", and the rest feel ashamed at letting little things like joining the ranks of the undead and almost killing them all with his mere presence get in the way of their eternal bond. They reaffirm their friendship and see him off, telling him to hurry and come back once he's human again.

And that was years before One Piece existed.

Ah, it seems 3x3 Eyes needs one of those custom title thingies. Is there a topic for requesting those?

edited 9th Jul '11 11:18:44 AM by Daremo

Creed of the Happy Pessimist:Always expect the worst. Then, when it happens, it was only what you expected. All else is a happy surprise.
TriggerLoaded from Canada, eh? (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Healthy, deeply-felt respect for this here Shotgun
#68: Jul 9th 2011 at 11:43:28 AM

It's.... it's beautiful... I wondered if I would ever see the day... The day when Nakama would be purged from the Wiki, finally.

Don't take life too seriously. It's only a temporary situation.
EnglishIvy Since: Aug, 2011
#69: Jul 9th 2011 at 11:52:50 AM

@Daremo: We have gone over reasons for renaming. Many, many times.

FastEddie Since: Apr, 2004
#70: Jul 9th 2011 at 11:59:11 AM

'Unshakeable Camaradarie' isn't quite there. 'Camaradarie' seems more casual and only-light-hearted than the bond being described here.

Maybe we should be bold and just make up a good word. I betcha Framily would catch on.

edited 9th Jul '11 12:00:51 PM by FastEddie

Goal: Clear, Concise and Witty
EnglishIvy Since: Aug, 2011
#71: Jul 9th 2011 at 12:02:33 PM

We really ought to go down the list first, before coming up with new terms...

Daremo Misanthrope Supreme from Parts Unknown Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: If it's you, it's okay
#72: Jul 9th 2011 at 12:04:14 PM

If that's the case English Ivy, then it should be easy to reiterate them. All I've seen so far is, "It should be bad, though it's clearly not." and "I don't like it."

Creed of the Happy Pessimist:Always expect the worst. Then, when it happens, it was only what you expected. All else is a happy surprise.
TheJackal Lurker from the UK Since: Dec, 2009
Lurker
#73: Jul 9th 2011 at 12:16:39 PM

[up] The word nakama in Japanese has none of the nuances we're ascribing to it, which were added by a subsection of One Piece fandom. So it isn't just Japanese for the sake of Japanese, it's wrong Japanese for the sake of Japanese. Not to mention that, as noted numerous times in the thread, there are a large number of equivalent English titles for this that are a lot clearer.

EnglishIvy Since: Aug, 2011
#74: Jul 9th 2011 at 12:18:01 PM

Also, it sounds horribly nerdy when used as jargon in an English-language site.

Nyarly Das kann doch nicht sein! from Saksa Since: Feb, 2012
Das kann doch nicht sein!
#75: Jul 9th 2011 at 12:23:50 PM

What the hell? This is wrong, this is totally wrong! What where you thinking?

The crowner should ask what name should be picked, not whether Nakama should be renamed.

People aren't as awful as the internet makes them out to be.

AlternativeTitles: Nakama
11th Jul '11 8:18:19 PM

Crown Description:

Vote up names you like, vote down names you don't. Whether or not the title will actually be changed is determined with a different kind of crowner (the Single Proposition crowner). This one just collects and ranks alternative titles.

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