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chihuahua0 Since: Jul, 2010
#226: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:08:57 PM

Hostile Love isn't a clear name for Tsundere, for example. Doesn't establish that it's a character type.

And we have warred over Yandere's name too much.

edited 7th Jul '11 7:09:04 PM by chihuahua0

GoggleFox rrrrrrrrr from Acadia, yo. Since: Jul, 2009
rrrrrrrrr
#227: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:12:12 PM

Tsundere pretty much means "hot and cold," in terms of feelings, so "hot and cold love" or similar would get the feeling across better.

Sakamoto demands an explanation for this shit.
GoggleFox rrrrrrrrr from Acadia, yo. Since: Jul, 2009
rrrrrrrrr
#229: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:14:33 PM

Tsundere is often translated as "hot and cold," or similar, and the moment many see that phrase in that context they know what it's talking about. So I would argue that yes, it does get the feeling across better than "tsundere."

Sakamoto demands an explanation for this shit.
BrightBlueInk It's all a conspiracy. from Colorado, USA Since: Jan, 2001
It's all a conspiracy.
#230: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:15:19 PM

Hmm, "hot and cold love" sounds like an off-again-on-again relationship to me, though, not a girl that swaps from being sweet to Belligerent Sexual Tension.

Current project: Cleaning up the Chrono Crusade examples one at a time. God help me.
Worldmaker Title? What Title? Since: Jun, 2010
Title? What Title?
#231: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:16:42 PM

Even they admit its not a perfect solution... I believe the attitude is that its better to decide on a policy and stick with it, right or wrong, than waffle about it. And their English-Only Titles policy applies to all languages, as long as the word is not a part of the English Language, and not just Japanese.

Also, they're going to be using Pale-Haired and Aloof.

Being in a Japanese-produced work is not enough of a difference to warrant its own trope.
BrightBlueInk It's all a conspiracy. from Colorado, USA Since: Jan, 2001
It's all a conspiracy.
#232: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:18:00 PM

"Pale-Haired and Aloof" isn't bad, but they forgot the "strange" part, which I think probably would need to be said. (Unless "aloof" includes "strange" just because Loners Are Freaks...?)

Current project: Cleaning up the Chrono Crusade examples one at a time. God help me.
FastEddie Since: Apr, 2004
#233: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:23:25 PM

The YKTTW is back up. I guess the naming effort for that one article should move over there.

Goal: Clear, Concise and Witty
chihuahua0 Since: Jul, 2010
#234: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:28:32 PM

[up] Still, I found that you cutting it like that not a good/valid/ethical way to make a point.

Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#235: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:31:02 PM

^ He's backed off a bit from his previous stance. Stop harping on it and work on the YKTTW.

edited 7th Jul '11 7:31:21 PM by Madrugada

Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#236: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:39:49 PM

Anyway, if you have a problem with a specific trope, bring it up in TRS. But you'll need a better complaint than "I don't like this one."

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#237: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:44:38 PM

[up][up] So no summary cutting/renaming of Kuudere or Shut Up, Hannibal!?

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#238: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:44:54 PM

Those might work as redirects but none of them will work as trope titles seriously some are so far from the trope it's not funny... Many of these tropes have been around for a long time.

edited 7th Jul '11 7:47:44 PM by Raso

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
EnglishIvy Since: Aug, 2011
#239: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:57:33 PM

They describe the trope perfectly well.

I hit the Y key, stupid keyboard...

edited 7th Jul '11 8:00:28 PM by EnglishIvy

Cosman246 Another person from Cascadia Since: May, 2009
Another person
#240: Jul 7th 2011 at 7:58:49 PM

[up]Um, I don't understand. Could you please clarify?

Never mind, it's clarified

edited 7th Jul '11 8:02:53 PM by Cosman246

If you eat a live frog in the morning, nothing worse will happen to either of you for the rest of the day.
TuefelHundenIV Night Clerk of the Apocalypse from Doomsday Facility Corner Store. Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Night Clerk of the Apocalypse
#241: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:13:03 PM

I liked the list but some of the names were a bit dry if not effective. Hentai is porn but a specific variety of porn.

Goggle Fox: Tangential learning is all well and good but it is not our job to make it happen. It is a happy coincidence when it does but we should avoid doing it on purpose. Tropes should be clear and concise. Witty is always debatable. Some of those are not clear, concise or both.

Star-Crossed Lovers is actually a good name for the trope. It comes from Romeo and Juliet which is very widely known.

edited 7th Jul '11 8:13:12 PM by TuefelHundenIV

Who watches the watchmen?
CBanana Tall, Dark and Bishoujo Since: Jan, 2001
#242: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:14:39 PM

Of course, sometimes people link to us to help explain a what a commonly used term means. There's absolutely no way Tsundere would have anywhere near the 44,713 non-search engine linkages if it had an English title such as Passive Aggressive Admirer.

and that's how Equestria was made!
chihuahua0 Since: Jul, 2010
#243: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:16:29 PM

That's another point. Most of the people who will be landing on our sites on those pages are either looking for the definition, or are anime fans. No need to displace all those inbounds. And making a fan term page for the title won't work either.

Plus, Passive Aggressive Admirer is clunky.

edited 7th Jul '11 8:16:50 PM by chihuahua0

TuefelHundenIV Night Clerk of the Apocalypse from Doomsday Facility Corner Store. Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Night Clerk of the Apocalypse
#244: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:51:40 PM

We can always turn the Japanese term into a redirect.

edited 7th Jul '11 8:51:50 PM by TuefelHundenIV

Who watches the watchmen?
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#245: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:53:39 PM

[up] But then we're stuck using confusing, and misleading titles in the main which experience tells us leads to massive misuse.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#246: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:55:01 PM

That would kill the trope though. All these titles are not indictitive of the actual trope as well as if you rename that you better rename 90% of the tropes on this site Deus ex Machina, The Mario on down.

We have Laconics for a reason here.

edited 7th Jul '11 8:56:42 PM by Raso

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
Cosman246 Another person from Cascadia Since: May, 2009
Another person
#247: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:55:11 PM

What's more important: 1. English-only 2. Focused, clear tropes

?

If you eat a live frog in the morning, nothing worse will happen to either of you for the rest of the day.
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#248: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:55:35 PM

Focused, clear tropes.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Cosman246 Another person from Cascadia Since: May, 2009
Another person
#249: Jul 7th 2011 at 8:57:21 PM

How will we get this through?

If you eat a live frog in the morning, nothing worse will happen to either of you for the rest of the day.
Catalogue A pocketful of saudade. from where the good times are Since: Sep, 2009
A pocketful of saudade.
#250: Jul 7th 2011 at 9:00:01 PM

I'm somewhere in between. Some of the foreign terms have no decent translation and should stay that way, tsundere in the same was as schadenfreude. But eventually some subtlety will inevitably be lost in translation, and it's okay as long as it's clear enough. We do have trope descriptions to explain the subtlety. I'm sure nakama has nuances not found in camaraderie, but, eh, not very significantly. That is to say, preservation should be reserved for the more obscure terms.

Two cents, etc.

edited 7th Jul '11 9:01:16 PM by Catalogue

The words above are to be read as if they are narrated by Morgan Freeman.

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