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Is Barack Obama a good leader?

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Midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#151: May 7th 2011 at 10:13:35 AM

and with the economy seeming to be picking up steam if the latest reports are much indication, and that trend continues, whoever the republicans pick as candidate is going to have the fight of his life.

Karkadinn Karkadinn from New Orleans, Louisiana Since: Jul, 2009
Karkadinn
#152: May 7th 2011 at 10:24:47 AM

When was the last time an uncumbent president lost, anyway? I'm not particularly concerned about the next election. It's the one AFTER that that's got me nervous.

Furthermore, I think Guantanamo must be destroyed.
Meeble likes the cheeses. from the ruins of Granseal Since: Aug, 2009
likes the cheeses.
#153: May 7th 2011 at 11:00:17 AM

Bush Sr, so not that long ago politically speaking.

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Midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#154: May 7th 2011 at 11:02:06 AM

Course, Bush Sr's reign went under due to a variety of factors. such as recanting on the no new taqxes thing when he realized that sounded nice, but was politically as attainable as flying donkeys. Not to mention somewhat of an economic downturn. The poublic tends to blamne congress and the president for economic downturns and credit them with economic upturns, whether or not their policies had a large effect or not.

In short. Its much harder to vote out an incumbent if the economy is on the upswing and theyve at least accomplished some measure of policy goals in their first term.

edited 7th May '11 11:05:44 AM by Midgetsnowman

johnnyfog Actual Wrestling Legend from the Zocalo Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Actual Wrestling Legend
#156: May 7th 2011 at 9:41:25 PM

Bush Sr "went down" as a result of Reaganomics doin' their inevitable thang. There was no way he was going to keep hold of the shitstorm Ron left him with.

I'm a skeptical squirrel
MarkVonLewis Since: Jun, 2010
#157: May 7th 2011 at 11:18:02 PM

Thread Hop: I'd say Obama is a passable leader. He's not a great leader, but he's not terrible either. He's doing the best he can with the shitty situation Bush handed him.

rjung He's just some guy, you know? from Fifth and Main (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
He's just some guy, you know?
#158: May 7th 2011 at 11:59:01 PM

[up] This, plus some of the more unrealistic expectations of his more energetic supporters. I simply figured if he was slightly left of Bill Clinton it'd be good enough, especially considering the alternatives.

—R.J.

MarkVonLewis Since: Jun, 2010
#159: May 8th 2011 at 12:04:33 AM

Exactly. I knew once he'd been elected that he was going to catch a LOT of flak, because too many people would have wanted him to do too many things in only 4 years. Aside from the fact that it seems the entirety of Congress have their heads so far up their asses they'd need to unbutton their collars to take a shit... Man's doing the best he can given the circumstances.

I wouldn't say I'm a huge supporter, but I do give him credit for doing his best despite everything.

EricDVH Since: Jan, 2001
#160: May 9th 2011 at 5:12:32 AM

The one and only reason I supported him over Hilary was her husband passing NAFTA/GAT, in the naive hope that he might reverse the Democratic course on neoliberalism. What I feared about Obama was that he might not have the “oomph” to plow through obstructionism that Hilary (as a battle-scarred veteran of politics) does, and I think my fears ultimately came true.

He took ages longer to stop the wars (pullout didn't start until 9 months after inauguration,) passed a regurgitation of the Republican-authored counter to Clinton's 90s healthcare plan, and crumpled like wet tissue paper on numerous smaller freebie issues (I.E.: extending the Bush tax cuts for wealthy Americans.)

I'm not saying he's worthless or hasn't accomplished anything, but I am saying he's ineffectual and unassertive.

Eric,

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#161: May 9th 2011 at 8:47:00 AM

[up] The only thing I wanna mention is I think all of the democrats share that blame, not just Obama.

They buckle on everything.

EricDVH Since: Jan, 2001
#162: May 9th 2011 at 9:07:47 AM

If he'd called them on their BS instead of wasting his time (seriously, the Democrats had a majority in both houses, the Republicans had zero leverage) negotiating with Republicans, he could've gotten far more done. Bipartisanship was no longer a realistic concern, it was just something the Blue Dogs were hiding behind to justify their insubordinate attitude to the will of the voters who elected them.

Eric,

Morven Nemesis from Seattle, WA, USA Since: Jan, 2001
Nemesis
#163: May 9th 2011 at 11:36:26 AM

For how long a period did the Democrats have a 60-vote, filibuster-proof majority in the Senate? As I recall, not very long at all. Still, they did much less with it than I'd expect — and didn't let the Republicans look bad for holding things up all that much, either.

Bipartisanship, though, was a pointless endeavor. Nothing useful was going to happen, not with the way that Republican operatives were going after any Republican congress-member who showed any signs of not being sufficiently zealous.

edited 9th May '11 11:37:40 AM by Morven

A brighter future for a darker age.
Midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#164: May 9th 2011 at 11:37:13 AM

the supermajority never really existed. A lot of those democrats were conservative Blue Dog democrats.

They didnt get elected into office by promising to be insanely progressive, they did it by promising to basically be conservatives in democratic party clothing.

edited 9th May '11 11:37:57 AM by Midgetsnowman

GameChainsaw The Shadows Devour You. from sunshine and rainbows! Since: Oct, 2010
Morven Nemesis from Seattle, WA, USA Since: Jan, 2001
Nemesis
#166: May 9th 2011 at 11:39:18 AM

Because both parties love the ability to stop the other guys doing things way more than they love actually being able to do anything. It's much easier to say "We could have done all these cool things, but Those Evil (Republicans|Democrats) blocked it!" than have to live up to promises for real.

A brighter future for a darker age.
Midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#167: May 9th 2011 at 11:40:37 AM

Not to mention getting rid of it would piss off a bunch of the electorate. They hate it when the "bad guys" (IE, the opposition party) uses it, but see it as heroic when their own party does it.

Its kind of how politics work in general in america. Our politicians are very good at setting it up to look like the "other side" is just that. alien, other, incapable of rational tought and blinded by not being 'real americans" (

IE, city politicians painting smalltown people as religious hyperconservative troglodytes and small town politicians painting big city life as being elitist and incapable of understanding simple, honor-filled smalltown work and life)

edited 9th May '11 11:43:49 AM by Midgetsnowman

rjung He's just some guy, you know? from Fifth and Main (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
He's just some guy, you know?
#168: May 9th 2011 at 11:46:46 AM

Yeah, I get tired of hearing that the Senate Democrats had a "supermajority". When you're counting on folks like Joe Freakin' Lieberman to be in your "majority", you're boned.

—R.J.

GameChainsaw The Shadows Devour You. from sunshine and rainbows! Since: Oct, 2010
The Shadows Devour You.
#169: May 9th 2011 at 11:47:54 AM

Sounds like the Democrats don't function like a party. More like several parties in a broad coalition.

No wonder the Republicans get away with murder.

The term "Great Man" is disturbingly interchangeable with "mass murderer" in history books.
blueharp Since: Dec, 1969
#170: May 9th 2011 at 11:50:37 AM

Sometimes. Though they're showing some signs of schisms.

EricDVH Since: Jan, 2001
#171: May 9th 2011 at 12:28:10 PM

@rjung: That's not my point, my point is that Obama acknowledged neither the traitorous behavior of Democratic legislators, nor the utter irrelevance of Republicans. Instead, his speeches and bargaining reflected a political fantasyland of weakness and compromise that didn't exist, and his results suffered for it. Whether or not the supermajority was practically real, he should've brought his real enemies to task for it.

Eric,

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#172: May 9th 2011 at 12:29:56 PM

You're only as good as your allies and I don't think Obama could have done anything about them.

Meeble likes the cheeses. from the ruins of Granseal Since: Aug, 2009
likes the cheeses.
#173: May 9th 2011 at 1:02:10 PM

I do agree that Obama should have made better use of the bully pulpit. The opposition has shown that they have little interest in bipartisanship over obstructionism, and Obama has squandered opportunities to take them to task for it.

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MajorTom Since: Dec, 2009
#174: May 9th 2011 at 1:10:57 PM

The bully pulpit is a double-sided sword unless you are a master Magnificent Bastard. You'd get torn apart in the court of public opinion as a fascist, power-hungry politician who cares not for what everyday Americans think.

EricDVH Since: Jan, 2001
#175: May 9th 2011 at 2:22:24 PM

65% of Americans supported single-payer, and 59% were against the war. I think demagoguery would've been a pretty easy ride for him.

Eric,


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