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memyselfandI2 Dunsparce Cloud from The Biosphere Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hooked on a feeling
Dunsparce Cloud
#7626: Sep 4th 2012 at 8:42:49 PM

First of all, will still say I'm iffy on the idea of more Delta mons in the ownership of PCs. Second, link to the moves?

Dunsparce didn't stop being a thing or anything.
Tropeless Dry Paratroopa from World 8. Since: Jun, 2011
Dry Paratroopa
#7627: Sep 4th 2012 at 8:48:31 PM

[1] [2] [3] [4]

EDIT: Silent brought up a point of using Gems as a sort of Energy Card replacement, although upon further discussion we decided that as a Delta, they probably wouldn't require the Energy to pull off the moves. Mystic Water would probably get a larger boost than normal from gathering such Energy. Thoughts?

edited 4th Sep '12 9:48:26 PM by Tropeless

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Eskay64 Since: Nov, 2010
#7629: Sep 5th 2012 at 8:07:22 AM

So, I'm grounded, starting when I get home from school today. Yay. That throws off what I have planned... quite a bit.

If anyone has any need or desire to have my characters involved in something, I'll allow R Cing for anyone I can trust. If you're not sure if you're one of those people, don't risk it. It won't end well.

As for what I'm doing now, I'll just time-shenanigan it on the weekend with anyone who wanted to be involved.

edited 5th Sep '12 8:17:28 AM by Eskay64

Crewe Li'l Punk from Gravity Falls, Oregon Since: Apr, 2010
Li'l Punk
#7630: Sep 5th 2012 at 9:57:20 AM

So I had an idea earlier that I proposed to the chat, and as it didn't meet with immediate rejection, I'll repost it here to get more input.

So Crewe manages to acquire a Moon Stone in some fashion (probably by, like, climbing Mt. Moon and finding one or something, because buying it would just be too easy and also she has no money) and somehow figures out that by either having a 'mon use Moonlight on it, or leaving it out in the moon, she can sort of "imbue" it with moonlight, so that when she wears it as like a pendant or whatever, she can phase whenever she wants.

To avoid it being broken, here are some side effects/restrictions:

  • The stone has to be recharged, and when it starts running out of charge, the transformations both take longer, require more concentration, and may leave her with a headache (which gets worse as the charge decreases). The stone can only hold enough charge to last for about a month.
  • Leaving the stone out in the full moon for a night will fully recharge it; using Moonlight on it or leaving it in a not-full moon replenishes it less.
  • Maybe using Moonlight too many times in a short amount of time on it will make it break? (So you can't just keep recharging it every day or whatever)
  • After a while of using the pendant, Crewe becomes so dependent on it for phasing that she can't do it without it, even with the aid of Moonlight or the actual moon.

Questions? Comments? Objections? Suggestions?

Victory! Honor! Destiny! Mutton!
BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#7632: Sep 5th 2012 at 1:36:47 PM

I almost feel like the balancing breaks it too much in the other direction.

The stone has to be recharged,

Sounds good.

and when it starts running out of charge, the transformations both take longer, require more concentration,

Also good.

and may leave her with a headache (which gets worse as the charge decreases).

This one seems unnecessary to me. There are already established limits, so there's no need for it to cause physical discomfort as a balance.

The stone can only hold enough charge to last for about a month.

This is great, because intentionally or not, you've picked the time span in which the moon cycles completely.

Leaving the stone out in the full moon for a night will fully recharge it; using Moonlight on it or leaving it in a not-full moon replenishes it less.

This is a cool idea. If I might also offer a suggestion, perhaps leaving it out under a new moon might drain it at a faster rate?

Maybe using Moonlight too many times in a short amount of time on it will make it break? (So you can't just keep recharging it every day or whatever)

This doesn't need to be a thing. If Moonlight doesn't charge it as well as a full moon does, and it lasts for almost exactly the amount of time as a moon cycle, there should always be enough charge in it to actually use, unless you've left it under a new moon. So the only time you'd ever need to really use Moonlight to charge it anyway is in an emergency.

After a while of using the pendant, Crewe becomes so dependent on it for phasing that she can't do it without it, even with the aid of Moonlight or the actual moon.

Not sure about this, either. The stone is basically moonlight in a jar, so the actual moon not working is a little wonky. "Magic A" Is "Magic A", and all that.

strawberryflavored Since: Sep, 2010
#7633: Sep 5th 2012 at 1:41:18 PM

If you don't have any plans on where to get it, Mt. Moon is the perfect place for that.

DarkerShining (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#7634: Sep 5th 2012 at 1:44:22 PM

[up][up] Hi Wolf! Did you see that I put up chapter 6 of my fanfic?

BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#7635: Sep 5th 2012 at 1:47:55 PM

I did see that, although I wasn't able to read it. I tried to, but I couldn't get wifi at school.

I'll read it soon. smile

Crewe Li'l Punk from Gravity Falls, Oregon Since: Apr, 2010
Li'l Punk
#7637: Sep 5th 2012 at 3:07:06 PM

Wolf: I like the new moon idea! That's a good one.

The Moonlight breaking it was mostly to prevent "Oh, it's getting low and getting harder, might as well just recharge it now"; so she has to feel the side effects if she wants to use the pendant.

The "normal moon doesn't work" is to make it so Crewe isn't just able to transform with no disadvantages now. It also opens the possible subplot "oh shit it's gone what do I do now?".

I actually kind of like the idea of it being broken... Meta-wise it's pretty much just an excuse for me to be able to phase her without having to mess with the moon, but in-universe it allows the possibility of her friends thinking that maybe she shouldn't be using the pendant.

Victory! Honor! Destiny! Mutton!
BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#7638: Sep 5th 2012 at 3:47:52 PM

Counter-proposals:

It won't break, but using Moonlight has a contingency. It depends what time of the month it is. Let's say that if Moonlight is used within two days, on either side of a full moon (so a period of five days per lunar cycle), Moonlight can charge it from empty, to enough charge for one transformation. Anything outside of that would be less, and if it's a new moon, Moonlight would have the same effect on it.

In keeping with this, perhaps Crewe has the limitations you set out, but can still use a full moon. Sort of like selective lycanthropy. tongue

I see your point here, but I think that you should be careful about whether using it doesn't balance out compared to the risks. If there's a small amount of things that can go wrong, it's balanced. If there's a large amount, it starts to be a question of why Crewe would use it in the first place, you know?

Crewe Li'l Punk from Gravity Falls, Oregon Since: Apr, 2010
Li'l Punk
#7639: Sep 5th 2012 at 4:25:20 PM

Hm... I like those proposals.

That's part of the point; she might start using it to be able to, say, phase during the day without asking a nearby mon to use Moonlight for her, but by the time she discovers the side effects she's so used to it and dependent on it that she refuses to stop using it.

Victory! Honor! Destiny! Mutton!
Sixthhokage1 Since: Feb, 2013
#7640: Sep 5th 2012 at 8:00:40 PM

Tonight, I realized what a terrible situation I got myself into with my summer reading. I have tomorrow to get through ~300 pages of The Name Of The Rose, with the exam on Friday. Basically, unless I were to have an excused absence for some reason on Friday, there's no way I can pass that exam. So I am about to be in a LOT of trouble again, and therefore won't be able to be around. At all. While I'm gone, don't worry about my characters, I don't want to stress anyone with them. Goodbye for now…

edited 5th Sep '12 8:01:13 PM by Sixthhokage1

BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
PippingFool Eclipse the Moon from A Floridian Prison Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
Eclipse the Moon
#7642: Sep 5th 2012 at 8:46:31 PM

Also, new plans for Rt AU

Mr. Gone will be the commander of a splinter group, while Lars (PEFE!Fool's helper Druddigon) will have some role of another etheir being the helper to Propaganda!Lenore or a member of Commander!Gone's junta force.

edited 5th Sep '12 8:47:08 PM by PippingFool

I'm having to learn to pay the price
BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#7643: Sep 6th 2012 at 12:01:45 PM

I finished the chapter, DS!

It was really good. The characters are interesting, and unique (as usual), and there was a lot of fun action. Does Chiaki remind anyone else of Rex? Or is it just me?

strawberryflavored Since: Sep, 2010
#7644: Sep 7th 2012 at 6:35:28 PM

Crossposting from the test forum, since Mind Posted it there:

On another note altogether... DUN DUN DUNNNN! I... HAVE... THE TRUUUUUTH! ...Kind of.

Ahem... Earlier, I was discussing the idea of a possible future arc regarding Deoxys being connected to Mew in some way. Multiple ideas were tossed around, and eventually I just decided to investigate the matter myself. The main theory goes that Deoxys is, in a fashion, a kind of "alien Mew." Not a direct clone of Mew, but a being identical to it in purpose... For another planet. Now, what caused Deoxys to become split up, what exactly is the deal with the meteorites, how Deoxys would react to contact with Mew, these are all questions for another time.

Right now, what I intend to provide evidence toward is simply that Deoxys is, and always was, a Mew for another world.

First off, lets start with the basic properties and similarities. Both Pokemon are Psychic, with an innate ability to levitate at all times purely by the power of their minds. In addition, they both carry the ability to read minds with merely a thought, both of which are apparently unbeatable by any telepath, human or Pokemon. Deoxys' own brain scan ability is even harmful, while Mew's is merely infinitely deep.

However, their shared abilities go deeper than that. Deoxys has the innate ability to shift it's bodily form, typically through the use of the meteorites, though it's also able to regrow any damage not including it's core. Mew actually has an identical ability, as it's able to shift it's own form to use moves it's body wouldn't normally be able to use. This is detailed in the PEFE on TV Tropes. This shared ability to freely shift their body at will implies a shared natural trait, though the limitations Deoxys has implies that it's own version is weaker for some reason.

Diet is a more questionable matter. Deoxys has no actual means of consuming food, while Mew happily eats sweets and so forth that it finds or is given. However, Mew's own apparently perfect body can provide the answer for this. While Mew can eat sweets and so forth, it doesn't need to. It would be perfectly fine without, but enjoys the sense of taste from sweets anyway. This also explains why it's a herbivore... Because it sees no purpose in eating another mon, when it doesn't need to eat at all.

Finally, they have a similar behavior set. Both are likely to simply flee enemies that don't pose a threat, or swiftly deal with them if they do. The reason Mew is more comfortable with playing with it's foes, however, is because it effectively is invincible, while Deoxys' imperfect form has a weakspot in it's core. This explains the slight shifts in their personalities; Deoxys fights only for survival. Mew fights when it's bored.

So let's go over this... Physical abilities, psionic abilities, diet, behaviour... Anything else? Oh, right. They both have the underlying trait of being super-beings based on their genetic code. While Deoxys is more unstable and less complete than Mew, they both draw their power from the infinite possibilities locked inside their DNA. As far as I'm concerned, Deoxys is, and always was, a Mew from another world.

The above was found directly from the PEFE articles on both mons, which should be canon to the RP if I'm correct.

edited 7th Sep '12 6:40:21 PM by strawberryflavored

BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#7645: Sep 7th 2012 at 6:44:50 PM

PEFE is not necessarily canon. Elements of it can be canon, but any writer is perfectly allowed to ignore what a PEFE article says in favour of their own characterization. Also, there are some really out there PEFE articles that I think even some of the people who write for it tend to ignore (I seem to remember one of them being particularly bad...Litwick, maybe? I dunno. Whatever it was, it was weird.)

I don't really have too many issues with that idea, although I have a couple of concerns/questions. Why is there more than one Mew, but only one Deoxys (and I do believe there is only one Deoxys)? Why Deoxys, when Mew has more in common with Jirachi (and Celebi, and Victini, and...)? How is this going to be established? I know we've gotten pretty crazy at times (we have a multiverse, for one thing), but developing a whole other planet is something that I really don't think we should try to do. At least in any arc that doesn't take place in the far future, or something, where everything is Star Wars/Star Trek/Jetsons-esque. Wouldn't you say that Deoxys has more in common with Mewtwo? Perhaps there are creative avenues to be explored there?

I'm not saying no, or even that it's a bad idea. Just helping you develop the idea. smile

Tropeless Dry Paratroopa from World 8. Since: Jun, 2011
Dry Paratroopa
#7646: Sep 7th 2012 at 7:01:03 PM

I see several "comparisons" that aren't actual evidence, such as:

1) The ability to levitate with just a mere thought. Two problems here: One, it's a trait that any Pokemon with Levitate has, and two, neither Mew nor Deoxys get Levitate.

2) This supposed unrivaled mindreading ability. I don't remember either of them being known for their ability to read minds. Like above, neither of them can even learn Mind Reader.

3) The transformation ability. Deoxys's form changing is no different than any other Pokemon that can change form based on an item/location/whatever. While yes, the anime shows that Deoxys can change form at will, the same can be said about Castform, since it naturally learns all of the moves that changes its form. (Or, if you don't think it's quite Deoxys level, Meloetta requires only a single move to do the same, and won't change due to external factors)

4) Diet. No legendary needs to eat due to the whole being a god thing (YMMV on this, though.) There are many, many non-legendaries that don't need to eat either. Also, every Pokemon has some form of food consumption due to the fact that Berries work on all of them.

So, basically, the only thing that they have to support this theory is the relation to genetics. Even then, Ditto does as well.

edited 7th Sep '12 7:05:08 PM by Tropeless

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strawberryflavored Since: Sep, 2010
#7647: Sep 7th 2012 at 7:07:02 PM

Actually, It's not required to know Mind Reader to be able to read minds. And Mons without levitate can levitate, so long as they are able to(Mew for example, but not a Aggron), but they are not immune to ground moves.

Tropeless Dry Paratroopa from World 8. Since: Jun, 2011
Dry Paratroopa
#7648: Sep 7th 2012 at 7:14:35 PM

No, but it means they're outclassed in mind reading, and in both cases it's in no way something that makes them uniquely like each other (as Wolf pointed out, Mew has more in common with the likes of the Lake Trio and Jirachi).

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BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#7649: Sep 7th 2012 at 7:21:45 PM

Actually, not the Lake Trio.

What I was referring to was the practice of giving a small, cute Legendary Base Stats of 100 in every category. Which includes Mew, Celebi, Jirachi, Manaphy, Shaymin, and Victini.

MindGamer Help... My hand's stuck. from In your mind. Obviously. Since: Mar, 2010
Help... My hand's stuck.
#7650: Sep 7th 2012 at 7:24:59 PM

If I'd be allowed to defend my viewpoint...

First, Wolf's points. There have actually been several Deoxys, in different canons. The PMD games had one cave I recall literally filled to capacity with Deoxys. And even the Movie had two different Deoxys in that one canon. However, my reasoning for that is more along the lines of Deoxys being split into different pieces, but that's another line of logic. Mew is my comparison to Deoxys because they share almost every trait, except for the actual extent of their powers. Unless it's all supposed to be coincidence, in which case all of this is moot. But then, that's not interesting. My point for how this was to be established was actually an avenue to be explored in of itself... Deoxys having it's forme changed by contact with Mew. Namely, becoming whole by filling in the gaps in it's genetic memory through Mew. But that's something else, again.

Next, Tropeless. Yes, Levitate is an innate ability a lot of mons have. However, most mons with Levitate don't get the ability to also fly at insane speeds with it. Mew and Deoxys do, purely on psychic power. You won't see a Magneton or Metagross keeping up with Mew or Speed Forme Deoxys. On the mind-reading subject, while the reference I made was from the PEFE, their psychic abilities do provide for more than enough to establish that in all things psionic, they're unparallelled. Oh, and Mew can learn Mind Reader. Because it can learn all moves? On transformations, Deoxys changes on not just one level, it changes into multiple formes. Castform is a man-made mon, and thus can be treated as a special case, since it could be built to transform as it does. However, no other mon (save Rotom and Ditto) can make as many physical transformations as Deoxys can, naturally. Further, Rotom "transforms" by possessing different objects, while Ditto merely makes an imperfect copy of another mon. Deoxys transforms in a completely different way, not having just an alternate form or different evolutionary lines. Lastly, on the note of berries, this was merely pointing out how they can be similar if Mew eats and Deoxys... Doesn't.

My point I'm trying to make is that Deoxys can be connected to it's own planet in the same way Mew is. Mew supposedly has the DNA of every mon on Pok Earth. My theory... Is that's true of Deoxys as well. Just for another planet.

Give me a mind, I will play with it. A character, I will roleplay it. Not so different.

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