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So, why is atheism such a flame magnet anyway (in genaral)?

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Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#151: Apr 16th 2011 at 12:31:25 PM

How much of it, do you think, is perpetuated by other religious people?

No idea, to be honest. The fact that the demographic is already skewed toward religion would mean any statistics would have to go per-capita. Records of that spike of bullshit toward Muslims shortly after 9/11 don't really give much background or motive on the perpetrators. And of course there's China, Soviet Russia, etc., whose atrocities in a few decades basically eclipsed a good chunk of the combined history of interfaith wars, and China is still being violent to religious folk of most colors. And, you know, whose affiliations were inconsistent, and motives were primarily based on power.

Of course atheism is boring. It's like being hatless at a weird-hat convention.

I feel a Touhou joke coming on, but I'll refrain.

I would like to point out that a hundred years ago, prior to the development of reliable contraceptives, laws regarding sex made a lot of sense for medical and social reasons.

That. Although...

And anti-homosexuality laws never made much sense.

Well at the time it was physically hazardous. Putting things up an orifice of tissue prone to tearing, in the context of poor hygiene standards should be a no-brainer.

edited 16th Apr '11 12:35:12 PM by Pykrete

JosefBugman Since: Nov, 2009
#152: Apr 16th 2011 at 12:41:49 PM

Yes, but putting the midden down stream of the drinking water was never mentioned in the bible.

Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#153: Apr 16th 2011 at 12:44:18 PM

It was also a no-brainer whose reasons were a bit more obvious to them at the time. One of them is consequences from parts you can't see by microbes you can't see, the other is whether or not you're visibly drinking dookie soup.

edited 16th Apr '11 12:45:47 PM by Pykrete

JosefBugman Since: Nov, 2009
#154: Apr 16th 2011 at 12:46:26 PM

One is where the river runs brown and the other is based around a lot of Bronze age individuals needing kids.

I think that whilst SOME of the stuff may have been accurate it was out of date by the time of Constantine.

IanExMachina The Paedofinder General from Gone with the Chickens Since: Jul, 2009
The Paedofinder General
#155: Apr 16th 2011 at 12:46:37 PM

[up]

What about in 'classical' civilisations (Greece Rome etc) where sexual intercourse between people of the same sex happened with regularity?

By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!
Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#156: Apr 16th 2011 at 12:55:24 PM

Presumably adverse effects also happened with regularity.

edited 16th Apr '11 12:55:46 PM by Pykrete

IanExMachina The Paedofinder General from Gone with the Chickens Since: Jul, 2009
The Paedofinder General
#157: Apr 16th 2011 at 12:59:22 PM

[up]

Reading it basically hygiene is the main factor and lubrication, so a society that had more experience might be better equipped and knowledgeable in prevention?

By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!
Rottweiler Dog and Pony Show from Portland, Oregon Since: Dec, 2009
Dog and Pony Show
#158: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:03:34 PM

[up] Are you suggesting that homosexual acts would tend to be less dangerous in a society where they're traditional? [lol]

“Love is the eternal law whereby the universe was created and is ruled.” — St. Bernard
Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#159: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:06:25 PM

I wouldn't say experience is sufficient — the Greeks were pretty reckless with all things sexual, and the Romans were only slightly better.

Knowledge, however, yes. You don't have to convince me of anything, I'm already in favor of the Church dropping homophobic doctrine.

edited 16th Apr '11 1:09:14 PM by Pykrete

Elfive (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#160: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:06:40 PM

That would explain why in Ancient Greece a small penis was considered a good thing. Less likely to cause damage.

JosefBugman Since: Nov, 2009
#161: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:09:22 PM

@ Rott: Maybe he/she (sorry I don't know your gender sir/madam) is.

I think that you behaving impolitely and with crowing whenever someone praises (on occasion) tradition is making you look as skilled in debate as a pubic louse however.

BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#162: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:23:31 PM

The "There is no God" bus campaign was a little aggressive

I think this, like the notion that Dawkins is "against religion" (he's not; he's against teaching religion as science, but as a separate subject, Dawkins is OK with teaching kids religion), is just another case of misinformation.

It is very common (at least, based on my experience) that Christian people know very little about Dawkins or other prominent atheists, but they often seem to think that these atheists are trying to limit their liberty to believe or something like that. It simply is not the case. For example, look at the poster that was on the bus:

"There's probably no God. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life."

How is that offensive, again? It doesn't even say that "There is no God" - it says there probably is no God, and it's a very significant difference. It doesn't say that religious people are wrong, and it doesn't say that people should stop believing. It just promotes the idea that one shouldn't worry about moral standards set by an entity that is not proven to exist. Nothing offensive at all.

Most of the cases of "discrimination" against people who believe by atheists that I've been referred to were exactly like this. That is to say, people took offense without even looking at the case.

Yes, sometimes atheists have attacked believers. Sometimes, it goes the other way. But neither group is fundamentally pre-disposed to attack each other, and if you ask me, I'd estimate that violence by believers against atheists is globally and especially historically much, much more prevalent than violence by atheists toward believers. But that's not the point. The point is that we can live in harmony and make our respective points of view heard without offending each other, just like this poster on this bus does.

I'm beginning to feel that some people were offended by this simply because they saw a picture with Dawkins standing under the banner.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
KCK Can I KCK it? from In your closet Since: Jul, 2010
Can I KCK it?
#163: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:25:55 PM

@Best Of It's offensive because it implies that theists spend their time worrying and can't enjoy their lives because of their thoughts on God.

There's no justice in the world and there never was~
Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#164: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:26:40 PM

For one, it's offensive because it carries the implication that religion is nothing more than a mindless obstruction to "worry" about that should be done away with for the sake of shortsighted hedonism.

Ninja'd.

edited 16th Apr '11 1:27:03 PM by Pykrete

JosefBugman Since: Nov, 2009
#165: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:27:40 PM

Really? 'cause "stop worrying" seems up there with "be happy" as things that are unlikely to provoke ire.

edited 16th Apr '11 1:29:07 PM by JosefBugman

Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#166: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:29:01 PM

There's a difference between "be happy because someone loves you" and "stop worrying because your beliefs are a crock and earthly pleasure is all that matters."

Myrmidon The Ant King from In Antartica Since: Nov, 2009
The Ant King
#167: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:30:08 PM

Because the transition from theism to atheism often involves a certain level of existential despair.

Not that most people don't get over it.

Kill all math nerds
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#168: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:30:31 PM

So if the message was "stop worrying and come to church", it'd be offensive 'cause it would imply that people would worry less if they went to church?

That looks like you're just looking for a reason to take offense or you're somehow offended by the very notion that atheists and believers both have a message they'd like people to hear.

Oh, well... YMMV, I guess.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
JosefBugman Since: Nov, 2009
#169: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:30:40 PM

"Its probable that there is no God" isn't disprooveable or prooveable, that what faith is for is it not? And I've met some religious people who are worried (excessivly so) about what God thinks of their every action.

Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
Myrmidon The Ant King from In Antartica Since: Nov, 2009
The Ant King
#171: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:32:52 PM

Well, yeah. And then you have fundamentalists who go to gay bordellos and never seem to think for a second that they've lost God's favor.

Kill all math nerds
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#172: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:33:12 PM

Yeah that line is certainly something that could be interpreted as offensive. Things like that are part of why I dislike Dawkins. Though I'm no better really since I go with "Who the fucks cares. Go do shit and believe whatever. All of you bitches worry and bitch too much. Even the atheists,".

edited 16th Apr '11 1:34:08 PM by Aondeug

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
KCK Can I KCK it? from In your closet Since: Jul, 2010
Can I KCK it?
#173: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:34:10 PM

@Best Of I would be offended; I'm a theist and I don't enjoy attending typical church services.

There's no justice in the world and there never was~
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#174: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:35:30 PM

"stop worrying because your beliefs are a crock and earthly pleasure is all that matters."

It doesn't say that, though, does it?

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#175: Apr 16th 2011 at 1:35:50 PM

On being offended by being told to not worry and go to church. That also doesn't offend me personally. It does however come off as dickish and is likely to offend people. Atheists and theists alike.

On enjoying typical church services: I like Catholic mass and only Catholic mass.

^No but it is very easy to read it that way. Wording is very important and that phrase is just worded badly.

edited 16th Apr '11 1:36:22 PM by Aondeug

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah

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