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So, why is atheism such a flame magnet anyway (in genaral)?

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Wicked223 from Death Star in the forest Since: Apr, 2009
#226: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:24:58 PM

We entirely support free expression and freedom of belief, and so fully support the right of these Christian groups to place their ads on buses. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Of course, there are differences between the Atheist Bus ads and the new Christian ones and I want to take this opportunity to reflect them.

Our ads were a response to ads run by jesussaid.org whose website promised an eternity of hellfire for non-Christians. Our response message, suggested by comedy writer Ariane Sherine was intended to be reassuring, telling people not to worry and enjoy life, as there was probably no god and so no cause to fear an eternity of hellfire.

Our ads were funded entirely by thousands of individual donors who gave small amounts in an outpouring of popular support for the positive message. The ads now launched in response to our response are funded by organisations or wealthy individuals.

Our ads were positive and peaceful. They didn’t say, for example, that religious people were ‘fools’, unlike one of the response ads being run, which says that "The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God."

Our ads were undogmatic and funny, with the addition of the ‘probably’ in line with the continuing openness of humanists to new evidence and in an echo of previous funny ads, like the Carlsberg ad which stated that it was ‘probably the best lager in the world’. The new ads are dogmatic and declaratory, leaving no room for reason and debate.

Of course, these groups are free to express themselves as they choose. Our ads encouraged people to think for themselves and I am convinced that they will continue to do so.

You can't even write racist abuse in excrement on somebody's car without the politically correct brigade jumping down your throat!
DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#227: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:26:12 PM

@KCK: What about this? It's certainly less offensive, and people were still getting their knickers in a bunch about it, and enough complaints were generated to get it removed.

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
Myrmidon The Ant King from In Antartica Since: Nov, 2009
The Ant King
#228: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:26:36 PM

@Aondeug, I once saw a bumpersticker saying "don't believe everything you think!" which was apparently Buddhist or something.

[up] Okay, I have no idea how that's supposed to be offensive.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:27:15 PM by Myrmidon

Kill all math nerds
IanExMachina The Paedofinder General from Gone with the Chickens Since: Jul, 2009
The Paedofinder General
#229: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:26:53 PM

I'm not sure I get the insult from the Athiest bus sign.

As firstly it basically points out there is no evidence for there being a god, it doesn't say for definite nor does it cast dispersion upon those who do believe.
Secondly the faith in god, I've always understood doesn't require evidence as it is faith.

To take the stop worrying and enjoy life as a slight against you're belief I feel is stretching to feel insulted.

Edit:
A link to an atheist bus slogan generator.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:32:58 PM by IanExMachina

By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!
KCK Can I KCK it? from In your closet Since: Jul, 2010
Can I KCK it?
#230: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:27:39 PM

And that think for themselves line is one that's always irritated me; because I'm a theist I'm not capable of making my own decisions? No one thinks in a vacuum; everyone is affected by outside influences.

@Drunk G There's nothing offensive about it; just non-believers wanting to connect with other non-believers, no insults needed.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:29:19 PM by KCK

There's no justice in the world and there never was~
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#231: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:28:29 PM

Yeah that sounds Buddhist. You learn through experience. You don't accept everything as you believe you know it. You search, you experience, and you learn Truth. Not everything as you know it is Truth or good. Like your attachment to yourself.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
Midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#232: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:28:41 PM

I've seen both sides have absolutely ridiculous, patronizing slogans for the other side.

I havent decided which offends me more.

The 'theres probably no god, stop worrying" ones, or stuff like I see on local billboards at churches like "exposure to the Son can prevent burning" or "The Big bang Theory: God said so and Bang, it was there"

Either way, people seem to get it in their heads you can somehow convince the other side by being a snide, patronizing jerk.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:29:29 PM by Midgetsnowman

KitsuneInferno Jackass Detector from East Tennessee Since: Apr, 2009
Jackass Detector
#233: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:29:00 PM

On the left is an ad for a pilgrimage to Israel. On the bottom, an ad for the "evolve" fish. And the banner at the top says I should publish using eBooks. What the page is obviously telling me is that I should be impartial, and I shall do when judging these bus ads. I don't see anything wrong with telling someone that they share your beliefs or lack of one, but I do see a problem with calling non-believers fools.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:35:05 PM by KitsuneInferno

"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt." - Some guy with a snazzy hat.
DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#234: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:29:54 PM

@Midget: I saw a billboard once that said that being atheist was equal to treason.

@KCK: But people still generated enough of an uproar to get it removed.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:30:35 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
Karmakin Moar and Moar and Moar Since: Aug, 2009
Moar and Moar and Moar
#235: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:30:11 PM

@Drunk I'll be honest, the backlash against that sign made me a lot more "militant" than I was before that sign.

@Myrmidon That's the point of what I'm saying. To a certain degree, just the statement "There is probably no god" is something extremely offensive. I actually can understand this. There's a lot of unspoken subtext behind it. You're an idiot, you're delusional, etc. Even if it's not meant to be there it's there. In fact, it was there before the rise of the "New Atheist" movement. I know I pre-date that movement and trust me, it was all the same thing before that, there's just more friction now.

Along the same lines, for example Christian messaging and iconography it's hard for it not to be innately offensive to me. When you say a bit of it, it's coming with all the God is the only way to be a good person stuff, etc. I try my best to separate that of course, but it's difficult sometimes.

So in the end I don't blame religious folks from being offended by atheist community building. What I do blame them for is taking advantage of/not recognizing the double standard.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:35:01 PM by Karmakin

Democracy is the process in which we determine the government that we deserve
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#236: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:30:38 PM

The ad server is telling you to visit the local Wat. GO. WE HAVE FOOD AND BOOKS AND STATUES OF FAT MEN. GO NOW DAMMIT. THE WORLD WILL END IF I DON'T CONVERT YOU.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#237: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:31:40 PM

[up][up] Which sign? I'm also slightly curious if I can get the dead baby billboard in my area removed. It seriously squicks me every time I have to go past it on the way into work.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:31:51 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
Midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#238: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:32:25 PM

@Karmakin: Thats generally what happens, yep. I dont think the idiots around my school who post anti-obama political ads and vehemently insulting to liberals editorials, or the said billboards and bumper stickers I quoted actually realize the more likely result of being flat out insulted for having another viewpoint is to become angry, offended, and even more resolutely against them.

Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#239: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:32:41 PM

I would hope you could DG. That just sounds horrible...

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#240: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:33:14 PM

This ad was pulled because someone got offended? How is it even possible to be offended by that?

I read the article.

Local conservative Christian church leaders have agreed the group should be allowed to run the ads. "I think the more people that can have an honest conversation and have honest opportunities and be given environments where they can seek the truth about whether or not there is a god, the better," says pastor Mike Householder, with Lutheran Church of Hope.

This sounds exactly like what priests would say here. Incidentally, Finland is mostly Lutheran.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:34:22 PM by BestOf

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#241: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:34:00 PM

It is possible by being very thin skinned, Best Of. Same answer I've been giving.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#242: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:35:24 PM

It is possible by being very thin skinned, Best Of.

Added another Pot Hole to the previous post to reflect my reaction.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#243: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:35:46 PM

@Aon: It is pretty terrible. There's picture of a dead baby wrapped in the US flag with a slogan about how only a godless nation slaughters it's unborn. It's one of the few things that make me want to hurl.

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#244: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:36:21 PM

Don't ever believe that people aren't capable of some ridiculous thing. They will always proof you wrong in the end. While dancing naked on a flaming unicycle. Humans are crazy fucks, man.

^...just. God.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:36:35 PM by Aondeug

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
Karmakin Moar and Moar and Moar Since: Aug, 2009
Moar and Moar and Moar
#245: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:40:36 PM

@DG The one you posted, the "You are not alone" ad. Pure community building. And yeah, it was a step too far for some religious groups, but there was a lot of flack at the time. Dead baby billboards are really squick. My mother, who is casually religious curses the billboard I mentioned as it makes her paranoid of crashing the car. It was about 2 hours into a 5 hour trip.

@Midget Probably. That's why it's not aimed at those who are going to be offended. It's aimed at the people in the middle who are watching and haven't made up their minds. Believe it or not, direct statements like that are actually sometimes very effective in convincing these people. Being more defensive, not so much.

I actually agree in some cases that it's a step too much. But in my opinion atheists as a group are clean as a whistle compared to other similar groups.

Democracy is the process in which we determine the government that we deserve
IanExMachina The Paedofinder General from Gone with the Chickens Since: Jul, 2009
The Paedofinder General
#246: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:41:29 PM

I feel this bus advert works for OTC.

By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!
Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#247: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:42:45 PM

...what if I don't like anime?

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
Karmakin Moar and Moar and Moar Since: Aug, 2009
Moar and Moar and Moar
#248: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:42:49 PM

^^Yup. I just got my ass slapped.

edited 16th Apr '11 2:43:00 PM by Karmakin

Democracy is the process in which we determine the government that we deserve
Penguin4Senate Since: Aug, 2009
#249: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:53:25 PM

There's nothing offensive about it; just non-believers wanting to connect with other non-believers, no insults needed.

But people did find it offensive. Is their annoyance not legitimate?

KCK Can I KCK it? from In your closet Since: Jul, 2010
Can I KCK it?
#250: Apr 16th 2011 at 2:54:56 PM

@Penguin Legitimate in the fact that they believed that had reasons to be offended, yes.

The reasons may not have been as legit, however.

There's no justice in the world and there never was~

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