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High Heel Face Turn Question

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KSonik Since: Jan, 2015
#1: Apr 13th 2011 at 7:39:57 AM

Looking at some of the examples of this trope, most notably the Avatarthe Last Airbender example, I was wondering what is the difference between this trope and Heel–Face Turn that just happens to be done by a female. Or is the latter the definition of High-Heel–Face Turn?

WackyMeetsPractical My teacher's a panda from Texas Since: Oct, 2009
My teacher's a panda
#2: Apr 13th 2011 at 8:15:47 AM

This is one of those tropes that I'm afraid to even look through, much less attempt to edit, because it's connected with a lot of controversy, is a tad bit subjective, and very prone to pinch a few sensitive nerves. It appears that to qualify for this trope, not only does the heel face turn have to be female, but it also has to be sexist.

What it looks like is that female villains, as a rule, are more likely to be turned to good than the male villains of the same level of villainy. It is almost suggested that any female villain, as a rule, HAVE to be turned good before the show can end, because writers and audiences alike think that women have to be good, especially if they're pretty, and the fact that they started the film as a villain must've been some kind of mistake that's going to be remedied by the end, with the implication that it's the good looking male hero that convinced them to switch sides.

The question we must now ask is, is it possible for a female character to switch to the good side without being sexist? I really can't say, because no matter how such a thing is handled, it is going to be interpreted by somebody to be sexist, simply because it is a woman switching sides. This makes the trope very problematic because it is all based on an audience's perception of the Heel Face Turn, and not necessarily the intent. And the audience's perception has already been warped due to the existence of this trope.

KSonik Since: Jan, 2015
#3: Apr 13th 2011 at 12:26:59 PM

because writers and audiences alike think that women have to be good, especially if they're pretty

Really?

nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#4: Apr 13th 2011 at 3:55:12 PM

[up]Yes, at least if one subscribes to the particular contemptible vapid stupidity known as Beauty Equals Goodness.

In theory, this would make good-looking male villains equally likely to switch sides. In practice, as Most Writers Are Male and assume the same of their audience, this doesn't happen nearly as often.

Non-attractive villains do not really enter into the equation, as Hollywood*

is psychologically incapable of admitting the existence of ordinary-looking people, or at least at casting them in any major part.

edited 13th Apr '11 3:55:25 PM by nrjxll

KSonik Since: Jan, 2015
#5: Apr 21st 2011 at 1:42:18 PM

The problem is that my question has not really been answered. Can anyone help explain to me the difference?

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#6: Apr 21st 2011 at 1:46:46 PM

High-Heel–Face Turn is a Sub-Trope of Heel–Face Turn where the Heel is a female villain who turns because she is won over by the hero's manliness.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
KSonik Since: Jan, 2015
#7: Apr 21st 2011 at 1:56:46 PM

Hmm.. Well that was helpful and under that definition the Avatarthe Last Airbender example definetly does not fit as Mai and Ty Lee did not even switch sides due to any hero's manliness.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#8: Apr 21st 2011 at 2:08:17 PM

Hmm, I just noticed that the laconic for the trope doesn't agree with the definition: it states that when there's only one female in the villains' cast, she's always the one who switches sides. Also, the definition has an awful lot of rambling and only identifies the trope in the first paragraph, and not all that well to boot. Might make a good repair topic.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
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